Alternatives to a sword

Discussion in 'Research' started by EllBeEss, Apr 24, 2014.

  1. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    Give her steroids.
     
  2. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    Also the op mentioned "surviving" against better armed opponents, not vanquishing them handily. I took that to mean her goal is to survive, so a lot of the things I mentioned also have practical use as survival tools as well as being functional in combat.

    And a bow isn't unreasonable either. In medieval societies that had bows, they weren't uncommon. And there are a variety of short bows intended more for hunting birds and small game that would be easy to use by a trained, but not herculean girl and could still kill a guy.
     
  3. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    Read my post again. I wasn't saying someone strong with a better weapon. I said someone weak with a better weapon (my words were "equal or even lesser strength.") And I didn't say "awesome sword." I said "long knife or light sword." Someone small and weak, but quick with a kitchen knife, could beat a bigger, stronger person armed with a club.
     
  4. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    Ok? So, someone who's better armed and better skilled would win in a fight? This makes my suggestions bad because...?
     
  5. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    I guess you are working from the assumption that either: clubs are inherently inferior to knives in combat no matter what, in which case I don't know what to say. Or you believe that the only kinds of clubs which exist or ever existed are seven feet long and weigh hundreds of pounds like in Skyrim. This is not the case. There are small, handy clubs and maces as well.
     
  6. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    Why would a weaker individual who is more worried about surviving than killing, use a weapon that would put them in the kill zone of better armed attackers while she is using an inferior weapon?
     
  7. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    In a medieval society there are a lot of dangers to a young woman wandering around. Something to fend off a rapacious thug in a tavern would be pretty useful.
     
  8. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    But what looks less assuming? A woman walking around with a club the size of a baseball bat, or a woman walking around with a staff that can be used to keep her balance and check for snakes or other menacing animals in the brush like a bow staff?
     
  9. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    You say, "You're right. Clubs are inherently inferior to knives in combat." :p

    What army in the last thousand years that has been successful armed its soldiers with clubs? Most used swords, even small ones. An edged weapon beats a blunt weapon, given combatants with equal strength and training.
     
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  10. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    So all clubs are the size of a baseball bat? Doesn't matter.

    Didn't I mention a staff/walking stick myself?

    I don't' know why you guys are giving me so much grief. I offered a bunch of realistic weapons that fit the criteria that was asked for. Most would give her a fair chance in a fight with a better armed opponent and most have other uses that someone in that setting would take into consideration. I don't actually know what she'll be doing or what her concerns are because I'm not writing the story. Nor can I say that any or all the things I suggested would definitely be perfect for any hypothetical situation you can think of.

    Guess you guys just like to argue to argue. Or in Lewdog's case because he's still mad at me. :)
     
  11. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    Snoop Lion would argue that blunts are much better.
     
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  12. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    I hope I'm not giving you grief, but I am a little pissed at you that you misread my post to mean a stronger person with an awesome sword and not the exact opposite.

    Let's drop it here. :)
     
  13. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    Have you ever seen a pissed off squirrel?

     
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  14. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    In posts after the one you are referencing, I amended it to "better armed and better skilled", referencing the fact that you said they would be "faster" with a knife. There's no reason to assume that they would be automatically faster with a knife, given that the girl has had combat training, so I reasonably interpreted that as meaning if they have a knife and know what they are doing they will definitely win. You continued making the pointless "knives rule clubs drool" argument after this point.

    I'll drop it now, but since you started it, I feel I should get the last word.
     
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  15. Smoke Z

    Smoke Z Active Member

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    I'm drunk, and I recognize that MLM is being like a drunk me despite being wise earlier... Let this lay until morning.

    Something about nightstick.
     
  16. Okon

    Okon Contributor Contributor

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    Improvisation is usually the most entertaining weapon.

    Or give her a weapon that puts her at the most disadvantage? Like a rusty sword with a loose hilt or something. People root more for the hero when her odds are lower than dirt, but she fights like a wolverine. A smart wolverine.

    You really don't have to worry about what who would have had what at the time, because A: it's fantasy, she could have a two metre-long "blessed" sword (ultra lightweight to carry) for all we care, and B: it's your story she could inherit the sword from some dead relative: a disgraced knight who only had that weapon and tatters to his name. When it comes to writing, the stars aren't even a yardstick to your limits.
     
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  17. MLM

    MLM Banned for trolling

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    Attention all (and minstrel)!

    I figured we should settle this scientifically, so I looked up the facts in the best scientific literature available. According to the one true AD&D 2nd Edition Player's Handbook, a 3lb club does 1d6 damage with a speed factor of 4 and a 1lb (rounded up) knife does 1d3 damage with a speed factor of 2. Speed factor is of course a variant rule and only affects initiative. The club does twice as much damage per round with a negligible weight difference and has the advantage of being useful against enemies resistant to edged weapons. And yes, as a DM, I regularly take advantage of players' general preference for edged weapons by throwing skeletons, crabs, and other things that resist blades at them! The knife would only be marginally more dangerous if you were playing a level 1 wizard with 2 hit points on the grounds that the enemy has a +2 bonus to initiative relative to a club user assuming no other factors affect initiative in the encounter and *if* you are using that variant rule which almost nobody does.

    That means I WIN! Ha ha ha ha!
     
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  18. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    @minstrel has a dagger of Ogre Strength and is always rolling 1d20. :cool:
     
  19. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    I haven't played Dung and Drag since 1977 or so. ;)
     
  20. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    Did you listen to 8-tracks while you played?
     
  21. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    Nope. Vinyl long playing records. Moody Blues. Early Genesis. Stuff like that.
     
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  22. Lewdog

    Lewdog Come ova here and give me kisses! Supporter Contributor

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    Ok which one are you?

     
  23. Garball

    Garball Banned Contributor

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    Best cartoon ever!
    Can I be Venger?
     
  24. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    I watched it with the sound off. I want to be the kid with the unicorn, because, hey, free unicorn!
     
  25. EllBeEss

    EllBeEss Senior Member

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    Wow I didn't expect so many replies :) Thanks to everyone who contributed.

    Thanks I'll look them up :)

    Wouldn't a pole arm require a lot of upper body strength to be used effectively? They were one of my original thoughts but I may have to go back and do some more reading.


    Thanks some of these would definitely come in handy. She would carry a knife however she would be carrying another weapon as well. A quarterstaff and your last suggestion could definitely work. :)

    This issue with a sword was more the ease of manufacture than the weight. A longsword apparently wouldn't be too heavy for the character to use so weight wouldn't be an issue.

    The fantasy elements are pretty subtle (there are creatures not on earth but no supernatural beings and all the apparent magic is fake) so having a blessed weapon isn't really an option.
     

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