Books about psychopaths

Discussion in 'Discussion of Published Works' started by Poziga, Dec 17, 2014.

  1. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    From all the reading I've done, I'd say no. They don't become psychopaths, they're more or less born that way. Somebody who suffers a childhood trauma and becomes desensitised, or something like that, is suffering a post-traumatic mental illness ...they are not psychopaths. Psychopaths tend to not "suffer" trauma, because stuff doesn't affect them the way it does the rest of us. In fact, they bounce back quite quickly from just about any setback. They may nurse grudges if they think they've been mistreated or hard done by, but they won't be traumatised. They'll be more inclined to take revenge directly on the people who caused the childhood difficulty, and then go on their merry way.
     
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  2. Poziga

    Poziga Contributor Contributor

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    So for my character, who is bullied, bullies' cruel acts don't make him a psychopath, he holds a grudge against them, and takes revenge later on? Means he was actually born a psychopath, but their acts just make it worse.

    I'll have to read some books I see, and fast. :)
     
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  3. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

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    Ah, yes, taking somebody who's cold and callous on a good day, and then giving him a bad day to overreact to? :eek: That's always scary.

    The perfect answer to anything :D
     
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  4. Poziga

    Poziga Contributor Contributor

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    I was wondering do you think it's possible to raise someone into a psychopath?

    Let's say there is a child who is being raised by a psychopath, and said psychopath wants the child to be like him.
    If the child was under such an influence his whole life I daresay it's possible (and interesting), but what do you think?
    Let's also say there would be a trigerring moment which would make the process complete (considering the theory that there needs to be a trauma)
     
  5. chicagoliz

    chicagoliz Contributor Contributor

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    Confessions of a Sociopath is written by a sociopath.
     
  6. chicagoliz

    chicagoliz Contributor Contributor

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    Also try The Psychopath Inside by James Fallon.
     
  7. Charisma

    Charisma Transposon Contributor

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    @Poziga While you've gotten some really learned advice, I'd also add that you apparently are confusing a sadist with a psychopath. They are not mutually exclusive, however they have differing motivations. Like others said, psychopaths do not feel remorse--they are apathetic with regards to the norms and values we hold so dear to us. However, they may or may not be sadist--that is, they may or may not derive pleasure from torturing others. See, a psychopath is neutral to good or bad--he only wants personal gain and he'd do anything to get it, and because his moral compass is awry he really doesn't care how he does it. That's why, most psychopaths are not killers; they're usually just very excellent at getting what they want, because they don't need to worry about feeling guilty or hurt. A sadist, on the contrary, feels pain, remorse, and the general repertoire of emotions--except he feels pleasure (if he's a sexual sadist, then he feels aroused) when he inflicts pain upon others. A sadist is, hypothetically, capable of knowing right from wrong, but he doesn't feel it the way you and I would.

    However, this is not some concrete distinction. A psychopath may be chronically sadistic. A sadist may be delusional (like the case of Albert someone mentioned; he probably suffered from a misplaced or ridiculous belief conquering his mind). They overlap and lead to a myriad of manifestations, and not one is the only answer.

    Some very excellent points were raised about nature vs nurture, but I would add that just because psychopathy has a biological basis, does not mean it is unyielding to therapy (granted, well, it often is), or that is predetermined. Chemical imbalances and nurture are reciprocal--childhood abuse leads to chemical imbalances in the brain, for instance, and chemical imbalances in the brain lead to behavioral problems. Since most of these derivations are post hoc, we cannot know with absolute certainty what caused what; only that the presentation of the symptoms is such. Psychopaths tend to have certain conditions growing up which are also consistent across cases, so both nature and nurture could play a decisive role.
     
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  8. Poziga

    Poziga Contributor Contributor

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    @Charisma , you read "Withiut Conscience", haven't you? :D
    You have the same choice of words as Robert Hare, words I didn't notice while reading other articles. :)

    I can distiungish a psychopath from a sadist, but I never thought of a sadist when writing these posts, so it may seem that way. :)
    Also now when I think about it, I have two characters in my book; one psychopath and one serial killer who is, now that I think about it, a sadist.

    Good post, thank you. :)
     
  9. Charisma

    Charisma Transposon Contributor

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    No, I'm just majoring in Psychology and Forensic Psychology has always been a fascination, so I read what I can here and there, mostly research. As for the not-so-scientific words, I guess that's what I make of it on my own; but I guess Robert Hare and I may have some to talk about :D

    Your insistence on trauma and vengeful emotion seemed to indicate the makings of a sadist than a psychopath. Notwithstanding, psychopaths may have had disruptive home environments, but they won't see it as a delusional or emotionally disoriented individual, going frenzied over the idea--it may simply remove emotion or guilt from their mind. For instance, a dominating mother is not exactly traumatizing, but a child with a predisposition to psychopathy might just turn out to me even more removed from emotion than expected.

    Hope I helped, you're welcome :)
     
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  10. Poziga

    Poziga Contributor Contributor

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    Robert Hare says that it is not some childhood event that creates a psychopath. The majority in this thread also thinks so. I see you also think like that. To me it also makes more sense, but I have a friend who was stubborn on theory that most psychopaths are made that way with some childhood event. I told him even then that it's not true, but like I said, he was stubborn so I decided to check here. :)

    But what about this difference between pcychopaths and sociopaths? I agree with Mr. Hare when he says it's the same kind of people, it's just that public gives them different names.
    Sociologists usually refer to them as sociopaths, saying they are the result of their environmet, while psychologists say they are mostly the result of biological patterns..
     
  11. Charisma

    Charisma Transposon Contributor

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    The idea of childhood being the holy grail of psychological development is so Freudian I feel like smoking a cigar. XD Anyway, I wouldn't say it's purely upbringing or purely genetics--it's just so many possibilities we can only hope for a large, representative sample to study and find correlation (most studies are on convicted psychopaths, not those who aren't convicted, so the sample is biased) and perhaps "create" psychopathic lab rats, not sure if that has been done yet.
    I always forget the nuance of difference, but what you've highlighted is pretty much that. Except it doesn't have anything to do with if you're a sociologist or psychologist--even psychologists delineate the similar difference. Sociopaths are usually not particular smart, with bouts of mood swings and insecurity, a quick Google search has told me. They're also more likely to have poor conditions growing up. They aren't intrinsically unable to feel empathy, they just struggle with it. Psychopaths are just lacking in that area--like I said, it could be inborn or something in their environment which causes a biological deficit. They are just unable to empathize and feel remorse.
     
  12. TOmRL

    TOmRL Member

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    There is such a thing called the secondary psychopath. This only occurs if the child has suffered very heavy trauma in the very first few years. However this form of psychopathy can be remedied.

     
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  13. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    @TOmRL - Thanks for posting that video. I watched the whole thing. SO sad. I'm so glad that she got lucky and got help, but how sad. And I wonder about her poor brother, whose situation must have been horrible as well. He was probably too little to remember what he suffered in his birth home, but he will certainly remember what his sister did to him. Just horrific what child abuse can do.
     
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  14. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

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    … No, he didn't.

     
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  15. Poziga

    Poziga Contributor Contributor

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    I didn't express myself correctly. What I wanted to write was that it happens a lot of times that public - and even some experts - have different labels for the same kind of people. I messed up the ifrst bit of the sentence. :)
    This is from "Without Conscience".
     
  16. Kasubi

    Kasubi Member

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    It's not fiction, but The Psychopath Test by Jon Ronson is eminently entertaining.
     
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  17. Poet of Gore

    Poet of Gore Member

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    yeah, every president writes an autobiography after his term is over. these are pretty good books about psychopaths.
     
  18. Chinspinner

    Chinspinner Contributor Contributor

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    Not far off the truth, the upper echelons of politics and business have a higher than average incidence of psychopathy.
     
  19. JTW

    JTW New Member

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    John Douglas has two books that were very good and insightful.
    - The Anatomy of Motive
    - Mindhunter

    There was a reference earlier in this thread about Robert Ressler and how he "coined" the term serial killer and essentially made criminal profiling what it is today. John Douglas was also part of that team and worked extensively with Ressler.
     
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  20. CMacgregor93

    CMacgregor93 Member

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    American Psycho is a very obvious look at psychopath/socialpath personalities.
     
  21. Frazen

    Frazen Member

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    I use the book Diagnostic and statistical manual of mental disorders : DSM-IV-TR whenever I want to write about characters with mental disorders. It introduces a wide range of mental disorders that when put in a high imagination, can be very captivating. It has a very scientific language, though. You might find it difficult. I recommend it if you want to pick up some rare and new idea for your story.
     
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