1. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    A Deeper Look at Thanksgiving

    Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Steerpike, Nov 27, 2013.

  2. mammamaia
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    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    i've always viewed the observance of 'thanksgiving day' to be the height/depth of hypocricsy and a major affront to the tribal peoples whose usurped lands those 'thankful' folks were giving thanks for, while doing their best to add to that wrongdoing by taking away their victims' beliefs and way of life, to boot... those artists' depictions of 'indians' sitting down to a friendly feast with the pilgrims don't change the historic facts...

    i see today's officially mandated version as being akin to the catholic rite of confession, wherein the putative penitents say a few prayers in order to be forgiven the sins they know they'll begin to commit over and over again, immediately thereafter... to be forgiven again, the next time they go to confession...

    giving thanks for all we are fortunate to have/be with should be a daily/hourly thing, not something we brag about doing only once a year, while making a g-d ritual out of murdering poor, innocent fellow animals...

    sorry for the rant, but that's my 'deeper look' at thanksgiving...
     
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  3. Duchess-Yukine-Suoh
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    Duchess-Yukine-Suoh Girl #21 Contributor

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    So true. I still celebrate thanksgiving, but it's really more of a family thing. We just put up the tree and have "Thanksgivingmas" because we can't all get together on Christmas.
     
  4. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    The article isn't really about Thanksgiving per se or the reasons to celebrate it or not celebrate it, it's just about the world as it was leading up to the "first Thanksgiving," and is interesting in that regard.
     
  5. jannert
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    jannert Contributing Member Supporter Contributor

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    It's sobering to think of how much of North American mythology tends to ignore or twist the truth about the genocide and land-grabbing it took to found our new world, and is still being perpetrated today.

    And it is also true that so many American and Canadian colonists would not have survived if it hadn't been for the generosity and helpfulness of the indigenous population. Look at the settlers in Pictou, NS, as an example. If it hadn't been for Micmac help, they would not have survived their first year.

    It's late in the day, but it would be great if 'Thanksgiving' could be used to make present day Americans and Canadians more aware of what the truth actually is.

    I just read Richard Wagamese's incredibly powerful book Indian Horse and was horrified to learn that the abuses and horrors he writes about were actually taking place ...not way in the past ...but when I was a teenager. It was all swept under the rug then, and their land is still under siege from things like fracking, oil extraction, etc. And do we care? Not a helluva lot. Bring on the Turkey and the prayers.
     
  6. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    A couple of sentences that stood out to me about the failure of history texts used to teach children to address the complexities surrounding the subject matter, and falling back instead of simplistic or idealized notions:

     
  7. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    I think it's interesting that the same word keeps coming to mind... Inevitable.

    If there was ever a more concrete definition of inevitable, it was of the destiny of the indigenous people of North America.
     
  8. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    What is Thanksgiving? Can someone explain this to me?
     
  9. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    The article gets into that, particularly at the end.

    But the short version (and idealized one) that U.S. kids learn is that Indians living in the area where the Pilgrims settled helped them survive, and they sat down together for a feast to give thanks (or at least the Pilgrims supposedly gave thanks). The ritual is repeated every year in America, and the holiday observed by eating more food than the starving inhabitants of the Pilgrim settlement could have hoped to ingest, and by watching football and trampling one another to get deals on cheap electronics.
     
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  10. Duchess-Yukine-Suoh
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    Duchess-Yukine-Suoh Girl #21 Contributor

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    Are you British? It's an American Holiday celebrating the Pilgrims coming to America, "making friends" with the Native Americans, and having a succesful harvest. We usually celebrate it by eating turkey and cranberry sauce and having a big dinner, watching football and Black Friday.
     
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  11. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    Admittedly I have only just read the text, feel kind of silly now. :oops: It's something I've heard about when when talking to Americans, both in person and online, but I've never been told what it is.

    Yip! Guilty as charged, I'm British. :eek:
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2013
  12. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    The article is good, and I believe it is taken from the book 1491, by Charles Mann (which is also excellent, and addresses a number of myths about the pre-Columbian New World, and the idea that the native inhabitants didn't have any agency of their own).
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2013
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  13. Duchess-Yukine-Suoh
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    Duchess-Yukine-Suoh Girl #21 Contributor

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    I have a lot of British internet friends so now I can add another one to the list! :)
     
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  14. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    My wife and I are thinking of having another baby and our plan is to let him/her watch only BBC and talk only in a horrible British accents.

    We're hoping it's a boy so we can name him Gallifrey.
     
  15. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    Our accents are horrible anyway. :p
     
  16. thirdwind
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    thirdwind Contributing Member Contest Administrator Reviewer Contributor

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    Some British accents are very pleasant to listen to. Seriously, I could listen to them all day.
     
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  17. minstrel
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    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Staff Supporter Contributor

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    Me too. I like the accent the science program presenter Brian Cox has - is it Manchester? Sounds good, anyway - almost Scottish.

    /threadjack
     
  18. GingerCoffee
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    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    S'alright. Bet a lot of Yanks never heard of Guy Fawkes or Christmas crackers. :)
     
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  19. minstrel
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    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Staff Supporter Contributor

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    That's why it's good (?) to be Canadian. You kind of get everything. American Thanksgiving and Christmas crackers. We did it all in my family. :)
     
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  20. art
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    art Contributing Member Contributor

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    Close. He's from just up the road in Oldham. Very similar to the standard Manc accent only somewhat less irritating. You know the dear old thing used to be in a pop band?

    [​IMG]
     
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  21. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I think this is the greatest thing I've ever seen in my entire life.
     
  22. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    We have a bonfire celebrating Guy Fawkes day every year. My daughter always liked to help make Guy. Half the people were celebrating Guy's attempt and the other half the fact he was caught.
     
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  23. Wreybies
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    Wreybies The Ops Pops Operations Manager Staff Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    We don't really do Sansgeevy, as it is called here. ;) The only part that really filters into PR is the black Friday aspect.
     
  24. GingerCoffee
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    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    Yeah but you have to listen to the Queen's message. ;)
     
  25. minstrel
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    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Staff Supporter Contributor

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    My mom was into that every year! I never bothered - just a Royal Blowhard yammering as if the monarchy had some kind of relevance other than being on the money. That's how I felt when I was a teenager, anyway. Now I have a bit more respect. :)

    But I still don't listen. Now she's old, and, you know, old.
     

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