A question about critique

Discussion in 'Revision and Editing' started by jazzabel, Mar 8, 2013.

  1. AVCortez

    AVCortez Active Member

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    A pet hate. I've spent a lot of time critiquing people artwork and there is nothing more frustrating then when people acknowledge but ignore what you have said. I find it more prevalent in younger people, teenagers mostly. They tend to try to find reasons why the reviewer is wrong, rather than acknowledging room for improvement. E.g. the reviewer's writing/illustrations are not as good as theirs, so said person has no right to give critique... Nerws flash; readers review work, not writers.
     
  2. jazzabel

    jazzabel Agent Provocateur Contributor

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    If you want a re-write you should ask for one, because most people don't, so this way, you'll get what you need and re-writers will be appreciated :)
    Personally, I don't mind an occasional re-write if done well. However, those are usually a sentence or two, a paragraph at mst. But re-writing an entire piece is in my opinion bad form, unless the OP asked for it.
     
  3. shadowwalker

    shadowwalker Contributor Contributor

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    IMO, re-writing should only be done to give an example of how to correct/improve something. I do it because I've tried explaining and it takes forever for the writer to understand - an example is BOOM! - "Oh, I get it!" I'm not there to do the writing for them - I'm there to give advice.
     
  4. jazzabel

    jazzabel Agent Provocateur Contributor

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    ^This :)
     
  5. cazann34

    cazann34 Active Member

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    I have read the above posts with interest. I am a member of several writing forums, yet it is this one I keep coming back to time and time again. Why? Because of the critiques. Posters here, tell it how it is. They don't sugar coat it. And I for one truly appreciate it. My writing has come on leaps and pounds since receiving critiques here.

    Are some people unnessarily cruel for their own gratification no doubt but happily these people don't stay long, they get bored or get themselves banned.

    Everyone here is an amateur (unless there's a professional novelist hiding somewhere - is there? :D) so we are all learning. And when it comes to critiques - as Cog once said, we critique other posters works to help with our OWN writing. I for one have learnt to be more alert about tense slip ups and general clarity in my work by simply seeing these errors in others posters work and pointing them out - it has given me a keener eye. Surely we are all grown up enough to take criticism as it meant, to help. We need to considering whether the critique poster has a valid point by asking our selves, is it warranted? Are they right? If they are, work on the piece and iron out the problem(s) or simple ignore them if you believe they are just being horrid for fun of it. We are all working towards the same goal to improve other writing.

    I love to write. It's my passion, my compulsion, it's my way of making sense of the world I need it and no negative critique is ever going to stop me from writing.
     
  6. rhduke

    rhduke Member Reviewer

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    Aye well said.
     
  7. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    "I prefer a critique where the reviewer keeps in mind, this is the story this author wants to tell, it's not the story the reviewer wants to tell."

    ...........................

    I totally agree with GingerCoffee on this. Learning to critique is a skill, same as any other. It's important not to impose your own preferences for story AND style, but try to help the writer achieve the goal they want. If either the story or style is something you simply can't engage with at all, even in the hands of a good published author, best to leave it alone and let somebody else critique it.
     
  8. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    because it's impolite to do so without being asked to, that's why...

    rewriting a sentence or a phrase, as an 'example'--as i sometimes do--is ok, but to just go ahead and rewrite a whole paragraph without any indication that's what the op wants, is not...

    for the record, i'm a professional editor/ghostwriter/lyricist/poet/columnist/short story writer/script doctor and writing mentor/writing services provider, among other things... 'professional' in the sense that i have been well paid for all of the above, other than mentoring, which is done free of charge...
     
  9. rhduke

    rhduke Member Reviewer

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    I guess politeness it what it all boils down to anyway. If it's an unspoken rule around here then I'll conform. I just think people will be missing out on something that broadens their writting abilities.
     
  10. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Not exactly "unwritten." See Constructive Critiques.
     
  11. rhduke

    rhduke Member Reviewer

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    True.
     
  12. Michael O

    Michael O Member

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    Need help....Don't know how to get those highlighted sections separated while critiquing.

    If I click reply with quote the entire work is highlighted.

    I see critiques, say the work is 5 paragraphs. Each paragraph or even a sentence can be highlighted in a box then comments are added below. And on to the next section.

    Don't know how to do that.
     
  13. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    Click "Reply with quote" on a post you want to quote. You will see the quoted text enclosed between QUOTE and /QUOTE, both terms enclosed in square brackets. Anything you want to show up highlighted, enclose it in those terms.
     
  14. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    you can highlight the parts you want to deal with in your post, then just 'copy/paste' them into the reply box...
     
  15. KaTrian

    KaTrian A foolish little beast. Contributor

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    Sounds like doing a disservice to the writer. They put their work out there for critique which I take as a sign that they are mentally prepared to have their baby slaughtered. That being said, I always, always end my crit with something positive.

    I dress honesty in pretty clothes, though some may argue, is it honesty then. Well, the message is honest.

    Again, I might be preparing the writer for future hurt, if I didn't point out what I consider big flaws, and I don't want to do that cos I don't want the other critters to do that to me either.

    Critique faux pas? As in what I consider shitty critique? Hell, I'm happy to get some critique. Sure, it won't help much if all they say is "this was boring" and never elaborate, but they have taken time to read my work (at least some of it) for friggin free, no less, so they deserve a thank you. Not as big as those who actually justified their comments, but still. Re-write my material? Yes, please, not because I wanna steal your stuff, but because the critter who rewrote it probably benefitted from the crit him/herself too. I won't mind. Not reading carefully or missing the point? If they missed my point, maybe I wasn't clear enough (not always the case, of course). Still, people here are critting your work for free, unlike real editors (you pay thousands for them to crawl through your work, so they better be careful), so if some of the forumites miss something, no biggie. I might point it out to them kindly, but I'm also paranoid about coming off defensive. Which, by the way, is pretty shitty from the writer who gave their work for others to be critted, afaic.

    More than I've ever expected. For the most part people on this forum seem to be excellent critters. And why not put effort in it? It helps you to become a better writer yourself, I think, so it's worth it. I also think that anyone can offer critique, no need to have a Master's Degree in linguistics and ten published Amazon best-sellers out there. That guy wouldn't read my story anyway, I bet. Wouldn't so much as use it as toilet paper. Often the target audience is the people who might not know much about the technical side of writing and just want to read a good story.
     
  16. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    Hi Michael O

    Just highlight the 'bit' you want to quote. Copy and paste it into your 'quick reply' section at the bottom of the page. Highlight it again, and click on the little 'quote' icon - the one that looks like a speech balloon. What will happen next, is the word "quote" will appear in CAPS and brackets at the start and finish of your quoted bit.

    Write the rest of your comment and post it. When you've posted, the bit inside the 'quote' brackets will appear in blue!

    ........................

    My pet peeves regarding critiques?

    1) People with short attention spans (and large egos?) who can't be bothered to read a piece through, before commenting or 'critiquing.' That's very annoying. We should be attempting to help a person write a better piece, not telling them their writing isn't worth the effort of reading.

    2) People who are dismissive and contemptuous of another person's efforts, because they don't like some aspect of it. Writers on this forum put heart and soul into what they write, and deserve to be treated with respect.
     

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