1. Killer300
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    Killer300 Active Member

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    Arsenal of Socialism

    Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Killer300, May 10, 2011.

    Okay, this is the best idea for a novel I've had in quite awhile! I really could write this, I just have to do it properly. The basic premise is that the United States is attacked by the Axis, Germany and Japan in this case of course, before the Soviet Union. England gets captured. So, the Soviet Union, which has Trotsky instead of Stalin, must become the, "Arsenal of Socialism," kind of like the U.S. was the, "Arsenal of Democracy." They have too supply everyone, and they are the ones that will emerge from WW2 undamaged, while the U.S. will emerge wrecked but still a superpower, just not as big as in the original time stream. This was all caused by some time travelers fooling around with the time stream who decided we needed a united world, so want the Soviet Union to win the Cold War. This is the first step.

    Edit: I realize now I was asking the wrong questions. Okay, what I really need are tips for such a plot. Those of you who have written alternative history fiction before, any tips? Besides that, opinions on how one would take the plot are greatly appreciated, as a comparison, not something to copy.
     
  2. JimFlagg
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    JimFlagg Contributing Member

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    IT all depends on your writing style. I personally like to start a story on action and disorientation so I would start it in the past and probably with a well known event in history so people can see how the time traveler has messed things up. I would start with past and maybe have it so that we don't alien with England so that England becomes closer with the USSR. You could mess with the decision of resources so that the USSR gets both the rocket scientist and the nuclear scientist.

    Lots of research on your half though. I wouldn't start such a project unless you are a history expert of have a friend that is one. I like to stick with what I know.

    Sorry, Cogito is right. I really should not tell you how to tell your story.
     
  3. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    It's your story. Or more accurately, your story space. Each of the decisions you make creates a slightly (or radically) different story within that story space.

    I cannot emphasize enough how important it is for you to make these decisions instead of passing them off to others.

    Writing is more than stringing words, sentences, and paragraphs together. It is making choices that shape the course of the story.
     
  4. RobT
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    RobT Active Member

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    I'm struggling to see that you actually have anything here. If I've read the post correct you have some time travellers who change time because they want to have a united world. What I can't get my head around is if they want a united world and they're changing time why would they have WW2 at all? They might as well just go back in time, stop Hitler being born and stop communism and it's job done.

    For me the reason you have for wanting to change time doesn't lend itself to having an alternate WW2 scenario.
     
  5. JimFlagg
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    JimFlagg Contributing Member

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    For all of the lives that would save we would probably not have things such as Nuclear Power or be able to put a Man on the Moon. Changing the past can be tricky.
     
  6. RobT
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    RobT Active Member

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    It is indeed tricky. I wasn't suggesting lives would be saved, or various technologies would or wouldn't have been invented. What I was trying to say is that for me it makes more sense not to have WW2 to get to a united world scenario. What the OP appears to be suggesting is to still have WW2, but have the Soviet Union come out untouched with Trotsky in charge. That's fine as a scenario, but to me that doesn't get me any nearer a united world because the Soviets can then win the cold war. If anything it's the exact opposite.
     
  7. Killer300
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    Killer300 Active Member

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    Okay, hold on. The reason why the Soviets winning the Cold War, in theory, would create a united world in their view is because the Soviet Union would cover the entire world, i.e. humanity gets united. You get the line of thinking they have?
    Also, something to keep in mind is that they are the ultimate internationalists, which of course means they hate fascism because it's ultra nationalist. They want just humanity, no more nations.
     
  8. RobT
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    RobT Active Member

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    Okay, so would that make your time travellers Russian, Russian sympathisers or communists?

    What's the focus of the story. Is it the alternate WW2 i.e. the Axis powers attacking the USA? Is it about the Soviet Union? Is it about time travel, and the eventual outcome of changing time? Is it the united world?

    Apologies for sounding a bit dim on this one, but I don't see in your premise what the actual story would really be (although your title hints at a Soviet perspective) and what the outcome would be. I am intrigued though and would like to understand. Can you expand a bit on your premise? Maybe outline a bit more?
     
  9. Killer300
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    Killer300 Active Member

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    Ah, I see. Okay, well, there are three acts. The theme that unites them all is that there isn't a single, "way," things had to work out, i.e. multiple systems can still get the same results, even if radically different from each other. Now, the results in this case are eventually a united world, however now it happens earlier, but that's it. However, by the time the event occurred the original way, Earth soon can't support human life, so the change is worthless to us.

    The first act is how WW2 is so different, but still ends with the Allies beating the Axis, and both the U.S. and the Soviet Union becoming Superpowers. The Soviet Union is the more powerful one now, while the U.S. is the most damaged. The Soviet Union gets nuclear weapons first, which gives it the head start.

    The second act, after WW2 is done, is a Cold War that goes mostly in the favor of the Soviet Union, ending with the U.S. eventually capitulating to the Soviet Union. However, the Soviet Union is democratic now, so that isn't as bad as it might sound.

    The third act is the world dealing with various problems as a united front, like enviromental issues and terrorism, and the differences between the original system, which seem major but actually aren't.

    Now, this is just a quick summary, there is far more to this, however this is just to give you an idea. Hope this helps.
     
  10. RobT
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    RobT Active Member

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    Thanks for expanding as I understand more now. The downside of understanding more is I think this is what I'd call a "Ben Hur" . . . a bit of an epic! To me the scope of writing a novel using this framework is a massive undertaking, and I wouldn't really have a clue how, or what plots you could incorporate purely because it's scope is too big.

    I'd suggest you need to think this through a bit more yourself, maybe start with a broad outline and work it in until you can get to more specific plots, else I think this is one where you could just wander off at leisure!
     
  11. Killer300
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    Killer300 Active Member

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    Something I've realized recently is I think I may have bitten off WAY more than I can chew right now. This is one of those books that probably takes years upon years to write, and even then is broken up into three parts. I should probably slowly work my way up to a length like that, starting with an idea a little bit more... sane. :)
     
  12. JimFlagg
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    JimFlagg Contributing Member

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    I always say write what you know. If you are a historian and have ideas as to how the future would be different if only something in the past went a specific way then this would be a great fit for you. If not then you could write something that is a "Different Timeline" story that is not based on our history and is just a fun story.

    I like Sci-Fis because I like computers and astronomy. So I kind of find the research to be fun. I don't like to do time travel stuff because history is boring and I personally have problems with paradoxes. That does not mean you don't find history boring and you might love complex paradoxes.
     
  13. Killer300
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    Killer300 Active Member

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    I do know this stuff well, but not that well. I do love paradoxes, but find myself realizing this. I feel as if when writing this story that I went from crawling, to flying. However, I will write it, just maybe not now. I must write something though. Songs, poems, short stories, and novels.
     

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