I would actually like to read a good ghost story or gargoyles would be a refreshing change. Can anyone recommend anything?
Heheh, they do actually 'grow' and become more capable (though each to their own path). One DOES learn to fight (although it's not like battles are already decided, it's more like she's capable but LEAGUES far from the best), and the other is actually more akin to an explorer trying to find a new home where he'd be accepted (he is NO fighter, though he does become noticeably smarter over his journey). The thing is, is that the MCs aren't human and could not pass for them either (so beautiful/handsome are right out), plus no real romance: the two MCs do love one another, although I don't really delve into all that in the first part of the story (plus it'll still reach a limit, one of my original goals was to make this suitable for someone of my younger sister's age, kind of like how the hobbit was tailored for the young Christopher Tolkien, although I don't let that goal affect the prose). As for combat....well it's exceedingly rare and always one sided (in favor of the villain). The first story is more of the human struggle of two MCs growing up in two vastly different environments and the hardships they face because they're not human, in addition to showing a sneak preview of the world itself that'll come into heavier play in the second story and onwards. Heheh, thanks. Honestly I'm really passionate about the story I'm working on, it's just that I'm worried about selling the idea to an agent (and I know they sift through many proposals per day) if I can't give them a guy who looks like James Bond and fights like Persius. The story is far more character driven, the events (both good and bad) occurring because of the very human nature of the two MCs and the other characters in their lives (to the point that even after the female MC learns to fight, she still rarely ends up doing so). The story in turn, I feel, feels more folkloric because of the inspirations for the world and the creatures living in it. I've created magic 'systems', but I've intentionally remained vague (though not impossibly so, the magic itself isn't world changing stuff) on much of it to make it feel more akin to myth/folklore. If I hopefully manage to get my book published, I'll be sure to send you a copy
@jannert I have to say that I see comments like this a lot, and it makes me wonder exactly what reading people are doing within fantasy. There's a huge variety of fantasy literature out there, and if you're reading the same sorts of things over and over it seems likely that you're choosing the same sorts of books over and over. Want some recommendations?
This kind of reminds me of a surprisingly (and sadly) large portion of people who get all of their music from mainstream sources ... while complaining that all music sucks these days.
Yeah, I'm in the same boat with music. I have co-workers who complain about how bad music is today compared to the music of yesteryear, and then I find out they only ever listen to mainstream radio and I'm like "Here, check out all these bands...." and then they say "Wow!"
If the setting is semi medieval or even older/more primitive, the reason that all tales were told about Kings, Queens, Warriors, Wizards and so on, is because the peasants were not allowed to take significant action, nor did they have the resources to do so. A villein who went around adventuring or fighting crime would quickly be put down by the local lord for trespassing upon his prerogatives. He is the law or the arm of the law. Peasants work. Peasants who don't work and meddle in the affairs of their betters are wolfsheads, outlaws. Robin Hood was romantic and fun, but even he needed King Richard in the end.
I love to write fantasy but nothing I write is ever commercial. I've written ugly mermaids, nice robots, men mining on the moon, another man farming on the moon discovering a hollow-earth/er moon scenario, worms that create vases, a man who must physically confront his past self, men that grow on trees, and a race of creatures that look like men and behave like maggots. My sci fi/fantasy isn't conventional by a long stretch but I like it. And in the end as long as you like what you write and are passionate about it, it will speak to others and once you can find someone to take a chance on your work - eureka! - that's how new trends start.
Yes, I wouldn't mind a few recommendations, thanks. I love fantasy, although it's not my main interest in reading. I love Kage Baker, and she's not that kind of fantasy writer. And I LOVE Joe Abercrombie, whose stories take very unexpected turns (for me anyway. I fall into all of his traps.) And Terry Pratchett ...although he's an unusual category unto himself. But I'm struggling to think of any others at the moment ...at least others who are modern. As far as my remarks, though, I was more or less responding to the OP's observations. The OP was actually worried that their writing would be rejected by publishers because it doesn't contain this stuff. And what about the plethora of teen vampires, zombies, werewolves and other 'beings with super powers' that we're dealing with a lot at the moment, both on the forum and 'out there' in the reading world? It seems formulaic to me.
This isn't a fair statement. The greatest music artists of the last century were all famous enough to be considered mainstream . Those types of artists aren't appreciated anymore. Obviously there are talented people today, but I don't see them being cultivated in the same way, as, say, the Rolling Stones got to be.
For a genre that allows a great deal of flexibility in how nebulously defined it is, too many fantasy novels seem to adhere to the exact same cliches. I say this as someone who will probably have a feudal Europe aesthetic in one of my stories. But there's also a Russian Wild West and church made out of glass, all in the 21st century! It's not all bad. Don't worry about the fantasy tropes. Just stick to the bare minimum and add more if that's what you were aiming for in the first place.
<reads over the thread> ...I'm gonna go ahead and make some alterations to my fantasy story. It's given me quite a few refreshing ideas.
For my sci-fi, fantasy writer comrades, I present a free entry competition, the deadline is 31st January 2015. According to the editorial guidelines, and I paraphrase :NO! robots (or computers or monsters) that turn on their creators time-travelling assassins virtual reality dragons abductions by UFOs vampires alien invasions quests for magical items god/s as alien/s or alien/s as god/s ultimate weapons stories about Elvis Presley, Adolf Hitler, Albert Einstein or Jesus retelling Adam and Eve in space… http://www.jameswhiteaward.com/advice
I assume that one was put on there by the creator as a joke. Surely there can't be that many stories along those lines, right?
He's just saying: 'Listen guys, I seen it all folks, just you goddam send me something that sizzles like Mercury, bangs like Jupiter's moons, pops like Pluto's penguins, and btw these tropes are tired.'
There's some good information regarding formatting in this article, as well as the advice about writing.
A quick read of the website and my first reaction was that they need to proof read. It will help if you know the answers to the following questions (although you might not want to include all this information in the actual manuscript) before you start writing your story. Who is your main character (the protagonist)? What does they want? What happens to them? How does they respond to what happens?
@jannert (I also like Kage Baker a lot) For an urban fantasy, try Emma Bull's War for the Oaks, or Charles de Lint's The Onion Girl. Steven Brust and Emma Bull wrote a nice epistolary fantasy called Freedom and Necessity. Caitlin R. Kiernan has written some wonderful things. Daughter of Hounds, is a nicely done, and often creepy, urban fantasy full of characters who are mostly screwed up. Her writing has changed more recently, with The Red Tree, and The Drowning Girl, the latter having an MC who is schizophrenic and not sure what is real and what isn't. She deals a lot with outsiders and otherness, as well as some LGBT themes. Among Others, by Jo Walton, won the Hugo and Nebula awards, and takes place after a girl and her sister successfully stopped a great evil, though at great cost, and now the girl is physically disabled and trying to move on with life, but things are starting up again. Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell is a fantasy set in Britain during the era of Napoleon. Just about anything by Elizabeth Hand will be dark, unusual, and interesting. Mortal Love is particularly good. China Mieville is also good, and his work is also strange and breaks the mold of fantasy (sometimes classified as SF or at least blurring the boundaries). Memory of Water, by Emmi Itäranta, takes place in the Scandanavian Union in a near future where wars are waged for water. Just about anything you pick up by James Blaylock or Tim Powers is going to be a bit off center and a lot of fun. K.W. Jeter coined the term "steampunk" to describe what he and those two were writing. There's a wide variety of work between them. The Anubis Gate, by Powers, is a good one to start with. Blaylock's Homunculus is a classic (or cult classic I guess). Jeter's Infernal Devices is great fun. I view Storm Constantine's Wraeththu books as fantasy. They take place in a future where a new species of human is evolving and supplanting Homo sapiens. Octavia Butler's Fledgling is a great vampire story, and her book Kindred is a time travel story about a black woman from the 1970s who travels back into the body of one of her ancestors in the antebellum south. The Golem and the Jinni, by Helene Wecker, is a charming fantasy and doesn't follow the standard tropes in the least. Highly recommended. Neil Gaiman's The Ocean at the End of the Lane is another unique fantasy novel that doesn't tread over-used ground. The Company, by KJ Parker, is a character-driven fantasy about what happens to a group of military comrades and their family when they move into the wilderness to live off of gold illegally taken during the war they fought in. Guy Gavriel Kay's Under Heaven is set in a fantasy, alternative Tang China. Graham Joyce's Some Kind of Fairy Tale is a non-standard fantasy and a great book. Robert Holdstock's Mythago Wood, and follow ups, are also well worth reading and not at all in the vein of fantasy that has been discussed in this thread. I could write three or four times as much as I've posted, above, but that's probably already too much as far as recommendations go
Actually there is so much good in this post, I've copied and pasted it into my own document. I've tried reading China Mieville, and think he's an excellent writer, but his stuff drags me down too much to be enjoyable. I will persevere though, because again, I think he's good. But I have to be in the mood. Jonathan Strange and Mr Norell is actually on my list of books I want to read. And I've also intended to read Neil Gaiman as well. But all the others are new to me. THANK YOU for this list.
