Ha, ha, well said. One of the first cyberpunk novels I read was William Gibson's Neuromancer. In that case, the "-punk" suffix actually fit; many of the characters were counter-culture rebels (hackers, smugglers, career criminals, and such) and their world had a "punky," gritty vibe to it. The word fit. Lately, it seems like the term is straying farther afield. Cyberpunk and steampunk are, at their core, science fiction subgenres. They imagine worlds where radically different technologies (i.e. steam) rule the day. Lately, it seems like the term is straying farther afield. I've seen people talk about fantasy novels with a magic-based economy as being "magepunk." What?
Thanks for this. I've never read Neuromancer (I know, right?), but your description does justify the -punk suffix. I hope all these newer -punk genres are equally punky.
When I saw the title I was thinking grease-the-musical-+-punk. And was scratching my head over how that would work out. Danny Zucko and Craterface racing steam engines. In top hats. And Goggles. And Marilyn Manson singing Go Grease Lightning. Sorry, I couldn't resist. I googled it out of curiosity, but I would find it hard to write a novel to fit a genre or movement unless I was really inspired by it.
Punk denotes the counter culture aspect of the genre. Cyberpunk isn't about cybernetics, it's about hackers (counter culture/punks) exploiting cybernetics. Steampunk isn't about machines that work with steam, it's about machines that work with steam instead of conventional systems. Steampunk usually features a radical genius as well working against the system. So I guess greasepunk would have some kind of counter culture element. You could see that in greasers I guess. But part of the punk genre is the discovery of new technology and I can't really see greasers inventing anything.
I've already stated how opposed I am to "punking" everything, but if I were forced at gunpoint to classify Fallout under a -punk category, it would be considered atompunk, which is steampunk's glowy, nuclear cousin. There is virtually no fossil fuel usage in the Fallout universe. Cars and aircraft run on nuclear reactors, buildings have reactors in their basements, and even the energy weapons have miniature fusion reactors in them (microfusion cells). I've heard another name for this subcategory but can't seem to recall it now and someone else said "atompunk," so I'll go with that.
Hmm...ok. What about Fahrenheit 451? Also, only plasma weapons have microfusion cells. Laser guns have energy cells. And of course there are still traditional gunpowder and bullet guns.
With grease-punk are you looking for more of a futuristic form or are you aiming more towards a ray-gun Gothic feel. I wrote a ray-gun Gothic style Diesel-punk comic once. test audiences felt the style i wrote was not fast paced enough for the grit and struggle going on. I ended up rewriting the entire thing little less gritty little more fast paced. exp. Valves opened to the clamoring of the combustion. Each chamber following its order precise and exact at the moment it was required. This violent harmony encased within the block its voice rumbling through the exhaust shuddering forth into the night. Gripping the steering wheel knuckles white..... my test audiences felt that if i was aiming for the Diesel-punk styled that the machines needed to be held in equal if not greater regard than the people in the world. The way i ended up using it was by being more descriptive with the machines than with my characters.
Not a punk-fan either I prefer alternative history ... But it has got me thinking! This world we're talking about, does it still have 50's sensibilities as well as extreme fossil-fuel usage? The thing that springs to mind is a society that lives in their cars, 50's stlye motor-homes, in an America that has become one vast free-way. Maybe only the rich get to stay in buildings, while everyone else is transient, but still living with 50's "wholesome" values, inching down the highways along with millions of others. And then, an explosion occurs on the horizon, a vast explosion that rises up from the road, sending debris across a wide area... no?
I can dig it, kind of rebel without a cause, only a community of motor homes? Grease meets a gypsy caravan?
Okay, going back to the topic before we out-punk each other, as Sonne Lore says, grease-punk is actually termed diesel-punk (by those who are writing and publishing it, and according to Jeff Vandermeer). It's the replacing of steam-punk's technology and society with that of petrol and possibly nuclear power ie the 50's. Dropping the genre term, it is just alternative history, the idea that technology and society have either stalled or stagnated at that point in history. So while my idea above was a bit jokey, it does have mileage (ahem...) The closest diesel punk story I've read/seen is Gilliam's Brazil. But this just shows how vague these sub-genres have become.
Brazil is clearly distopia, I don't know if I would put it in any other genre. The only thing that uses gas is their monster trucks.
Well, that's kinda my point. The problem with any sub-sub-genre (which diesel-punk is, if you think steam-punk is a sub-genre/love-child of SF and fantasy), is that it is everything, and it is also nothing in terms of genre. Vandermeer's Steampunk bible defines diesel-punk as "a heresy in which fuel and nuclear power replace steam power in alternate histories that often have a political component". This pretty much is a definition of dystopia anyway: "An imagined place or state in which everything is unpleasant or bad, typically a totalitarian or environmentally degraded one. The opposite of utopia" - from The Oxford dictionary. Brazil is very much both of these, however much diesel it uses. It's about the stagnated technology and sociology; a vision of a future, present or past progress that has inexplicably stalled. Depending on a person's point of view, it can even be argued that steampunk is dystopian. Even with its romantic adventure origins, would we really wish to live in a world where progress has hit a brick wall and we live in cities of choking smog? (And I'm not counting what's happening in London and the South East right now! ) But ultimately, its not really a genre at all. Its a specific setting which can be defined away as a number of other sub-genres, but really all it is a fantasy with a technological/scientific bent. As such wishing to write something in this sub-sub-genre is not something I would advise. It would be better to write a story without constraints and little boxes, about stuff you're interested in (the story is always king, not the genre) and then put that story into the box it fits. As Clive Barker once said, "fcuk genre!" I think sometimes writers should start there before they commit words to paper.
I think the films Mad Max and The Road Warrior (Mad Max 2 in Aus) Fit the definition of the genre.But they are dystopian. I kind of get the impression that greasepunk is something akin to the New Horizons 1940 Vintage General Motors "Future" Film .
think more along Skycaptain and the World of Tomorrow. Mad Max is its own Genre literally named Mad Max (or post apocalyptic) Dieselpunk came after Steampunk in "historical fiction context" Victorian thru Pre ww1 would be Steam Post ww1 1920s-1950s is where Dieselpunks timeline really diverts from what I have read and seen.
I actually had a very difficult time in defining a book I recently wrote. It's Science fiction - Fantasy - Steampunk - Horror - Alternative History - Multiverser. Genre really is bullshit, if the story is rubbish no one will read it. I totally get what Clive is on about. The book I'm currently researching is a thriller set in the 1960s. Ultimately you don't start out think about what genre its going to be. The story defines itself.
Shouldn't a story be grounded in themes and characters and conflicts? Deciding on the type of 'punk' and then writing a story into it sounds kind of half hearted, but that's just me.
I developed a story and character set specifically for this genre, because it's something I really want to explore, but well.
I've never understood why any of these are all called "punk". Honestly it's been a real turn-off to the genre for me. With the exception of Sandersons Mistoborn series I've done all I can to steer clear of the genre. Not because of the content, but more because I dislike the usage of "punk". Just seems like a scream for attention. Steamwar, Steamrune, or any other combination seems more palatable. I guess its more of what I associate with the definition of punk: a worthless person (often used as a general term of abuse). a loud, fast-moving, and aggressive form of rock music, popular in the late 1970s and early 1980s kinda like "why you gotta be such a punk man?" Sorry, not trying to be provocative, but terminology for titles and genres along with their cover images totally influence the attention I pay to something. This is coming from a guy that reads three or four books simultaneously.
