Do your beliefs allow?

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Wreybies, Sep 15, 2009.

  1. DragonGrim

    DragonGrim New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2008
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    21
    Location:
    Iowa
    May beliefs strengthen my stories and my stories my beliefs. I would best fit the category of “deist,” and the worlds I build could only have come about (if in reality) with the aid of a mind, much as I believe our existence came from a thinking presence. Fantasy lets me explore just what a god could dream up somewhere else.

    For me personally (though I know many wouldn’t want to in their worlds) the fantasy’s oddities can be explanation scientifically, which grounds the stories, and furthers the juxtaposition between the fiction and the real world.
     
  2. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    May 1, 2008
    Messages:
    23,826
    Likes Received:
    20,818
    Location:
    El Tembloroso Caribe
    Even in Science Fiction this is an error I often see. The Star Trek universe is rife with only Vulcans and Romulans, Ferengi and Cardassians.

    The worlds whence these peoples come have no nations? No ethnicities? No diversity of cultures upon the worlds themselves?

    And as you have noted, religion, the lack of religion, or differences in belief within these cultures almost never comes into play unless it is the pointed focus.

    A definite error in realism.
     
  3. HorusEye

    HorusEye Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2009
    Messages:
    1,211
    Likes Received:
    48
    Location:
    Denmark
    You shouldn't let it bother you. Readers should know that what you have written is fiction, containing fictional people with fictional thoughts and desires. If people can't get that, they're probably gonna be confused about alot of other things first. ;) It's like accusing an actor of being evil, if he's always typecast for villain roles. It would make no sense.

    In my own writing I have characters that say and do absolutely horrible things, according to my own view of the world, but it's weighted up by all the characters that do and say the contrary.

    If you're too uncomfortable writing about these two people having sex, consider letting one of them have a stance similar to your own, and turn that into part of the book's conflict. Thusly, the conflict you're having becomes fuel for drama. It could possibly make for a far better story, because the conflict is sincere.
     
  4. x_raichelle_x

    x_raichelle_x New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2009
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    Hartlepool, UK
    I agree with you. If I was an actress I would have trouble doing a sex scene with somebody other than my husband, because I believe that would be wrong. Even if I wasn't actually 'doing the deed' I still wouldn't feel comfortable portraying a situation that looked like I was.
    The same way I don't think I'd include overtly sexual scenes or a barrage of foul language in a novel - it goes against 'trying to keep my thoughts pure & Godly' which might sound preachy-preachy, but by deliberately setting out to try & imagine a scene which is un-Godly, I'm conciously going against what I believe to be right.
    It makes scenes of conflict really hard, but I have read books where the writer has been able to manage situations like this really successfully. It doesn't mean that it's any less powerful, or it's harder for the reader to connect with the character, it's just written very cleverly.
    Hope this makes sense.
    xxx
     
  5. Dante Dases

    Dante Dases Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2008
    Messages:
    3,462
    Likes Received:
    183
    Location:
    West Yorkshire, England
    Things about me: I used to be a Christian (I've had something of a fall out with religion of late), I seldom swear, I'm teetotal (and have fallen out with people who try to force me to try alcohol), I've never smoked, I've never taken drugs and I don't go round having casual sex.

    On the other hand, one of my characters is a drinking, womanising, gambling, swearing little so and so, and he's terrific fun to write because it's so far removed from the person I am. I may not do all those things above, but other people do, and perhaps it's just me, but I like to portray people as who they really are. Not everyone's like me.

    I've never had occasion to write a sex scene (well, not yet, anyway), but I wouldn't count myself out of writing erotica or anything like that if the situation was right, and I'd certainly never have a problem portraying a potentially controversial opinion, even if it wasn't mine.

    In truth, all that holds me back is what my dad might say to some of the ideas I have and some of the things I might say.
     
  6. M9A8E6S4TO

    M9A8E6S4TO New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2008
    Messages:
    180
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Mississippi
    My beliefs influence what I am interested in reading/writing about, but it goes no farther than that.
     
  7. jlauren

    jlauren New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2009
    Messages:
    135
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Queensland, AUSTRALIA
    @ x_raichelle_x - I completely agree with what you said. There are things in real life that I would never do, like sleep around, swear excessively etc. But, I'm finding it hard to reconcile my beliefs with what my character believes. Just because I'm a Christian, that shouldn't mean he automatically is too. And it's hard, when I know in a particular situation, that the only appropriate word for him to say is one that I would never say myself. But HE would.

    I mean, I'm a fairly relaxed Christian, with different ideas about life and how we should live it. And if I want to write a novel that is relevant to believer and non-believer alike, then I walk a very fine line between content that is relevant and appropriate and content that is offensive and off-putting. I mean, I actually want my Christian friends and family to read my work and enjoy it, support me and encourage my success.

    I guess this is the struggle that rages in my head - "You have to decide right from the beginning whether you are going to be a Christian writer, or a Christian who writes." - Francine Rivers (Christian author) EXACTLY.

    @ Dante Dases - I know what you mean. It's fun, almost liberating, to write a character that is so far removed from who you are. It's like a rush, a walk on the wild side. That's the whole point of a novel really - giving the reader an experience they would never have normally. It's allowing them to meet people they never would and see things totally outside their reality.
     
  8. TWErvin2

    TWErvin2 Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,374
    Likes Received:
    1,629
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    In the end, your name is on the project. What you write and how you appear to "endorse" or "frown upon" a subject such as premarital sex (even if you do--or don't). Of course how it is approached, the consequences (if any) of such a choice, etc. are important.

    It really comes down to who you are and where your beliefs stand, and now strongly they stand. Will you be proud or embarrassed of the end project? It will be tough to promote a project if it is published and you're feeling that you cannot share your success with family and friends because of its contents—especially if the contents feels wrong to you.

    My writing doesn't, for example, contain vulgar language. I guess it could, but it just isn't right for me and my faith.

    Terry
     
  9. Ferret

    Ferret New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2006
    Messages:
    556
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    The parts of your soul you refuse to recognize.
    Hmmm. If a piece of writing disagrees with my paradigm three things can I happen: I accept a superior thought process, it challenges min and I grow or I just ignore it.

    As a Christian, I really don't care if something is about fantasy. Lewis and Tolkien both wrote incredible stories about the Faith that took place in fantasy realms and had gods that weren't Christ. In the end though, we are the image if the Speaking God. Everything we do is a reflection of that. What you believe will show up.

    I don't find much fiction anymore. I fancy myself an A.W. Tozer, as silly as it sounds.

    The whole point of a book is to create a universe where certain presuppositions ring true, and to tell a story that exemplifies those laws. Of you could just say that it's to tell a theme. A christian ought not write what does not honor God, for then he's saying something that's against Him, I think. I don't think I could reconcile writing a narrative that glorifies pride or lust.
     
  10. NaCl

    NaCl Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,853
    Likes Received:
    63
    As a happy "post-theis", I enjoy the luxury of writing from either mindset. My early life experiences in Christianity and Judaism provide me with foundation for writing within those value systems. On the other hand, my experiences in war and since becoming an atheist provide a very different, sometimes conflicting, set of values from which to write. Like Terry, I don't insert much (if any) profanity in my works because it is rarely needed to tell the story and I feel it is a crutch for weak writers. Even my Vietnam war manuscript only contains profanity where it is realistic for the setting...we cussed a lot over there. The bottom line for me in story crafting is that I have no restrictions based on my personal value system. If a topic, style of writing or offensive language fits the story, so be it.
     
  11. Jester

    Jester New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2009
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Western U.S.
    I saw this thread earlier and wanted to comment. My relationship with my deity is important to me, and something that is an ever-changing "beast". The mainstream version of my faith denounces many elements of fantasy and horror, though there have been notable writers in both of those genres who come from my faith's background.

    Currently, I am working on a fantasy that involves vampirism, magic, and many other elements as an analogy to the spiritual aspects of following my faith. It's something akin to what Pilgrim's Progress did for Christianity.

    I hope that satisfies your curiosity, Wrey.
     
  12. Lemex

    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,704
    Likes Received:
    3,425
    Location:
    Northeast England
    Considering i'm an Atheist, and a Secular Humanist, there is nothing stopping me from looking at and reading as I wish.
    However, I have a set of morals I live by and am happy with.
     
  13. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2006
    Messages:
    19,150
    Likes Received:
    1,034
    Location:
    Coquille, Oregon
    certainly... since i'm an agnostic atheist [i know, a semi-contradiction ;-)], i definitely wouldn't write anything religious in content and as an anti-violence activist, i will no longer write fiction with violent content... nor will i write anything for money ever again, since i've made a solemn vow to not do so...

    and as far as what i read, while i may read religious stuff for research, i wouldn't read it for pleasure, as i find nothing believable in such writings...

    this does not all relate to work sent to me by mentees, however... while i do refuse to help with any fiction having violent content, i still will help writers of religious-aimed works, since i wouldn't impose my own non-beliefs on anyone... and of course i do help people who want to write for money...
     
  14. Lemex

    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,704
    Likes Received:
    3,425
    Location:
    Northeast England
    Is it? I think it would be stupid to say that you KNOW there is no god. But I think all Atheists are agnostic to some extent - myself included.
    In the words of Richard Dawkins: 'on a list of 1 to 7 one being absolute conviction god is real, 7 being absolute conviction he does not, I would say I am 6.9'.
     
  15. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2006
    Messages:
    19,150
    Likes Received:
    1,034
    Location:
    Coquille, Oregon
    put me at a 6.999!
     
  16. Irish87

    Irish87 New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2009
    Messages:
    228
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    California
    Nope, of course not. Granted, I will admit that my beliefs do affect a lot of the things that happen in most things that I write. I would love to tell you that I am devoid of bias when it comes to my writing, but chances are if you're reading my work you will be able to make connections to my real life beliefs and philosophies.
     
  17. Kas

    Kas New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2009
    Messages:
    567
    Likes Received:
    19
    Location:
    The ***hole of the world
    Me, too. Incidentally, I love Dawkins' writing.

    I wouldn't write anything that would seem to endorse religious faith, but neither would I shy away from creating religious characters as a means to an end.

    As for my reading preference, I'll read almost anything well-written, but if it contains an obviously fallacious and heavy-handed "message" of any kind, I'm immediately turned off.

    Even when my father was religious, our home was full of books of every kind. Although he was not very open-minded at the time, he allowed us (his kids) to read whatever we wanted, and so we kept our minds open, at least.

    Nobody in my family is religious any more (and I have six siblings). We're all atheists--even my father, who used to read the bible to us for at least an hour every night.
     
  18. Agreen

    Agreen Faceless Man Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2009
    Messages:
    2,142
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Canada
    This is basically what I mean when I say I'm agnostic- it's not that I'm midway between the two positions, it's that I'm a 6.9, not 7.
     
  19. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2006
    Messages:
    19,150
    Likes Received:
    1,034
    Location:
    Coquille, Oregon
    the only thing anyone can know for sure, is that we can't know anything for sure...
     
  20. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    May 19, 2007
    Messages:
    36,161
    Likes Received:
    2,828
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Are you absolutely sure about that? :D
     
  21. Danijay

    Danijay New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2009
    Messages:
    0
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Louisiana
    Yes, my faith has hindered what I have written and or read. I am Southern Baptist. Fantasy and supernatural genres are frowned upon, even preached against unless it is something like Frank Peretti. (They didn't even like Narnia, which is a Christian series. You should have heard the uproar over Harry Potter.)Basically, anything other than bible studies and biblical self help are frowned upon.
    Because of this legalism, I haven't been to church in about two years.
    Now I read and write what I like. I am careful what I let family and friends read of my work. I don't need to be the subject of an intervention.
    I do consider myself conservative, romance books do not have to have blatant sex scenes to be good. I like to read books before my kids to make sure they are acceptable, but I honestly haven't refused to allow them to read anything they have brought me so far.
     
  22. lavendershy

    lavendershy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    310
    Likes Received:
    12
    Location:
    Sparks, NV
    I won't go into detail on what I believe here, but I see most genres as fine and generally healthy in proper increments, as with anything else. I understand the use of swearing in literature, but I will not read a book with obscene dialogue or plot - there's a difference between obscenity and swearing. I also avoid horror as a whole because of Philippians 4:8. "Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think on these things." (ESV) 'Most any genre can give you a good picture of human nature, commendable examples, etc., but I don't see how horror or a couple other things are "worthy of praise" in any way. If a book or subject is going to damage my mind or lower my standards in an unhealthy way, I won't read it. In my writing I stick to the same principals, although I have read things I would never write. It's the idea that's already been discussed here about endorsing things that I believe are wrong. If I portray evil and wrong to portray evil and wrong as what they are, I will write about them, but not otherwise. I hope that's logical to someone besides myself.

    Cheers,
    lavendershy
     
  23. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2006
    Messages:
    19,150
    Likes Received:
    1,034
    Location:
    Coquille, Oregon
    sure, i am!... sure that i'm sure that i can't be sure, that is... wanna keep goin' round?
     
  24. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    May 19, 2007
    Messages:
    36,161
    Likes Received:
    2,828
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Nope. Nothing kills a good jest quicker than trying to maintain it past its time.
     
  25. Lavarian

    Lavarian Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2009
    Messages:
    4,562
    Likes Received:
    93
    This makes me sick to my stomach. I do like Peretti, though.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice