Yeah, the original Conan character was cool because of his rough edges and general lack of civilization. A mistake authors have made trying to launch new books set in that universe is that they Cimmerians in these books (aka Kern and others) have 21st century sensibilities. It doesn't fit. Conan didn't suffer from those problems.
This thread's probably going to be closed soon. I could never read LOTR. I never got into it. It never hooked me. Maybe that's because I watched the movies first (which are amazing IMO). But I can see why he is respected. It's been mentioned in the thread that he is considered by some to be "the father of fantasy" because of the time period when he wrote it. There were no books like his at the time. Nowadays, is LOTR considered the best fantasy series of all time? By some, sure, but it's just preference. If I like a different series more, I still think I owe it to Tolkien to respect him. I think the emphasis everyone in the writing world puts on him makes new readers have VERY HIGH expectations for his literature. Look at Shakespeare. Do I like him? NO. I think that may be because I was smothered by Shakespeare because of how dumb the education system is at times. But, I can see why he is respected so much. He started something. He was the first. That's basically how I see Tolkien.
Wait, but isn't it kinda normal that contemporary authors try to make the characters think like people today so that it would be easier to identify with them? There are just different things acceptable in society in different times. Not that I'm much of a fan of things like that, I enjoy characters being a bit overboard with all the morals and s**t but this is really what it looks like.
Yeah, but in some cases it is stupid. If you're trying to re-create a barbaric fictional race, like the Cimmerians, and the character ends up being an emo tree-hugger who can swing a sword, I think you've got problems with the story. I'll take the less-PC Conan
What did Shakespeare start? Robert Greene and Christopher Marlowe both preceded him. I'm sure there were English playwrights the preceded Elizabeth altogether.
It's sad that he died before he did much more with Conan. I mean, in a few stories Conan was basically a villain but he was still likable. Robert E. Howard was just that good at writing the character. His Kull the Conqueror and Solomon Kane characters were interesting too. BTW, don't watch the Kull the Conqueror movie they made. It's horrible because of the script. I haven't seen the Solomon Kane movie so I don't know if it was good or not.
Oh yeah, those are excellent stories. Lieber also wrote some good science fiction. 'The Big Time' comes to mind. Yeah, Howard was a weird cat. Shot himself at age 30, I believe on the morning his mother died.
This is totally random, but everyone should read the series of Thomas Covenant, I think it is brilliant. I would also take the chance to apologize to everyone I was..harsh too. But I still support my post.
Woah. The Thomas Covenant books are on my Absolute Garbage list. I tried so many times to read them due to the hype generated by friends and family but simply can't do it. Each to their own of course. Lord of the Rings is one of the few books I re-read every few years.
Have you read them properly ? It's not just about the story, it's about the world he created. I mean the detail that he puts into the world is amazing. Even the language he created for it was amazingly well done. Personally I think he deserves every bit of credit for what he wrote. I think bashing the names he created is abit low, especially since other than starting with an "S" they don't actually have any similarity. Lastly I dunno why people keep trying to find loopholes in his story such as with the eagles and ghosts. If we did that with every story then why bother writing them? I can think of a number of loopholes in many stories that I've read, but I dont really question it a great deal if i enjoyed the story.
Yes, those are quite good. I also recommend the book Monument, by Ian Graham, to see an example of a protagonist who is thoroughly unlikeable, but where the book is quite good. There is a lot of very good, well thought-out and developed fantasy, that doesn't follow much in the way of standards in the genre. There is also a lot of very bad fantasy. Like any genre, I suppose.
Agreed. Tolkien gets the credit he does because he created this amazing world that really pushed the boundaries of what you could do with a fantasy story. LOTR is hugely influential.
I agree: Tolkien sucks. I disagree: Rothfuss sucks just as much. This whole wave of new fantasy writers (Abercrombie, Rothfuss, Lynch) might be slightly good, but they're not the best in the genre, not by a long shot.
With playwrights, from what I noticed, most of them have influence that stretch all the way back to classic Greek plays, such as Oedipus and Antigone. The guys who wrote the Bible even took things from Greek plays, which is where it all began. A few things about Tolkein for me, though. 1.) I respect him a lot. He built a magnificent world and all. But what also made him special was how devoted he was to it. A lot of fantasy authors I feel don't show the same type of devotion to their work as they take many things from Tolkein. Elves, dwarves, big bad lord, etc. Since he has been placed as the pinnacle of all fantasy, everyone feels that their work should be related to his somewhat. That's why writers like GRRM are a breathe of fresh air to the genre. 2.) As others on here, it was hard for me to get through his books. I enjoyed The Hobbit alot, but The Lord of the Rings was a struggle. It also didn't help that I saw the movies first, I think, which are awesome. In the end, I don't think Tolkein "sucks". His work back in his time was praised. And in this time we praise works where in the future they will most likely be classified as "classics" but the reading will be unbearable for most.
You sir are a hard man to impress! Those are some really good fantasy authors you mentioned there. Since you dont like them, what do you class as good fantasy?
Oh god no xD I was made to read that in year 8...It's so dull. Also I can't stand stories where the MC just happens to be the greatest hero the world has ever known.
