1. colorthemap
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    colorthemap Contributing Member

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    Horrible writers

    Discussion in 'General Writing' started by colorthemap, Mar 20, 2011.

    Don't hate me for this post but I still want your opinions :)

    But I recently read a post describing that most children who get published are simply brats who write fantasy rubbish.

    So, onto the topic of my question do you consider all published works by young authors rubbish.


    How about all first authors?

    I think I am a decent writer, but I did a few years ago. I read what I wrote a few years ago and it has nothing. No flow, a "cookie cutter" plot and I even used terms that are used in a video game.

    However since then I have more onto more sophisticated writing.

    Any way what are your thoughts?

    Hope my grammar was ok.
     
  2. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    What exactly is the question?
     
  3. Elgaisma
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    Elgaisma Contributing Member Contributor

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    One of my good friends finished her first 80K novel when she was twelve she is an amazing author so I don't hold that against someone. She is much better now she is eighteen of course.
     
  4. colorthemap
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    colorthemap Contributing Member

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    Sorry Drifted a bit, well a a lot.

    Okay but do you think it is worth it for a young lad or lass to be published, on a general stand point.
     
  5. Melzaar the Almighty
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    Melzaar the Almighty Contributing Member Contributor

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    I wrote crappy fantasy obviously written by a teenager when I was... a teenager. I knew I had the connections and stuff that if I'd worked hard I could have got it published, but as proud as I was about the novels piling around my ankles, I held off and waited.

    I think if you can honestly recognise good and bad writing, and see you've leapt the hurdle between them, then you're probably a decent enough writer these days not to get accused of such a thing, so go for it.

    I personally know that I could have been published, may have got a pretty decent reception for being the novelty teenage writer, but ultimately people would have said my writing wasn't top standard, and it would have tainted my career. First novels and things that LOOK like first novels even if you've written 100 of them should never see the public light of day.
     
  6. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I personally don't. I judge something a young person has wrote on it's own merits. I helped out in a first school last year, and usually the children would hand in non-fiction pieces to the effect of 'What I did last summer' which the teachers set for them. I read these pieces and was asked to give my opinion on them by the teachers at the school (some of whom had a really sarcastic laugh when they asked me) and I didn't see anything wrong with them for the age of the children who wrote them.

    Not 'rubbish' then, but I tend to read things that people over at least 18 have written anyway.
     
  7. Youniquee
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    Youniquee (◡‿◡✿) Contributor

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    At 12! *slaps self* Whoa, she must be super at the age she is now.

    And I don't believe that...I saw on this one website that apparently all teenage writing is crap...that kinda made me wary about my own writing. But as long as we keep writing and don't give up, we can get better right?
    This is my third novel (Even tho I didn't finish the first 2) and I plan to get it published when I'm 17...seems unrealistic, but if i work to it, I'm sure there's a lil bit of chance that can come true.

    The same goes for other teen writers. Don't give up, keep writing until you writing is up there (Y'know, to the publish-worthy state) :)
     
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  8. Eunoia
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    Eunoia Contributing Member Contributor

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    I haven't knowingly read anything published by a young person, but to be honest, age doesn't matter. Some twenty year olds write better than sixty year olds and vice versa etc. It would wholly depend on the book itself.
     
  9. colorthemap
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    colorthemap Contributing Member

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    Oh bloody hell! I hate those wretched "'What I did last summer' rubbish".

    How about this though Eragon, you guys seem to think it is bad(from other posts and topics on this fourm) Yet children love it.

    So is something like that good or bad?

    My goal is to write, like the script writers of Doctor Who,unexpected and geniu.
     
  10. JeffS65
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    JeffS65 Contributing Member

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    I remember the first real crack at trying to write something back oh so many years ago. When I think of it, I just cringe. It was what I thought was cool at the time. I was in a 'post-apocolyptic-Mad Max-world' type of mind frame. So not good writing on my part.

    Some people can write within that or another genre with great effect, at the time I couldn't. I think I can do it much better now though the genre of choice is not longer the same.

    What I have now is a better human understanding. I have greater insight in to the human condition than I did when I first gave writing a try.

    That, I think, is key to the answer; when you have a keen insight in to people, you can become a good writer. A story is about people. Things like setting and all the accouterments are useless if the human story isn't told.

    So, the answer is: Anyone can write well no matter the age if they have insight in to how people work and can translate that to the page.
     
  11. w176
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    w176 Contributing Member Contributor

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    I think young fiction writers are a bit problematic. There are great young dancers, painters, musicians and poets and there are great young non fiction writers. There are many really young bloggers that is worth reading and Anne Franks diary is one of the most read books about the second world war. So obviously young readers can write, at least non fiction.

    But when it comes to fiction writing it partly extrapolating from life experience, not just technical skills. If you are young just don't have the life experience of a older writer. The young author will often come off as immature, because they don't have the psychological insight or knowledge to write characters, plot or setting that feels believable.
    On the other hand I've once seen a fiction writer who was stunning at fourteen and mature past her years. It was impossible that she was any other age then the rest of the rest of the group I wrote with who where in their twenties. But I think that girl might been the one in a million.

    But there a simple truth and a upside to being a young writer: If you start writing you, you will have a huge head start to anyone who start to write later in life.
     
  12. NateSean
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    NateSean Active Member

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    My opinion of Eragon has always been that it the difference between that series and fanfiction was that most kids don't have parents who will publish their fanfiction.

    Being something children love shouldn't be a measuring stick for whether it's good or not, as some children also love copious amounts of sugar. It doesn't mean it's good for them.
     
  13. colorthemap
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    colorthemap Contributing Member

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    I agree with the last 2 before the post before me(JeffS65 and w176 )of the previous posters, so I don't write about things I can't write about. If a non-engineer writes an engineering book it will be rubbish, simple.
     
  14. Trish
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    Trish I've been deleted.. again Contributor

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    Let me say this, I haven't seen any of the topics on Eragon, but I read it, I read Eldest, and I read Brisingr. Could there have been changes, could things have been rounded out a bit? Of course. Don't we ALWAYS read a book and think "He/She should have done this, or why didn't they do this"? Are they terrible books? No. They're not. They're actually quite good. Judge me if you will. I'll be reading the 4th one too. It's not my usual genre, but as I've said I'll read anything. Kudo's to him, I say. I don't feel the need to be jealous.
     
  15. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I agree with you, but at the same time: Anne Frank.

    Nobody can tell me that's either bad writing or not emotional.
     
  16. Elgaisma
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    Elgaisma Contributing Member Contributor

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    Her writing wasn't crap at all - I considered myself honoured to have read it. When she gets published I expect a signed copy lol The story was a bit heavily Harry Potter influenced but given her age and when she wrote it that is hardly surprising - it was different enough to be a fun light read.
    I read whole thing in a day it was good.

    My daughter is seven and whilst it is children's books she writes they are highly imaginative and interesting to read sure she will get better but have read worse. She illustrates them Japanese anime style - she wrote an interesting one a few weeks ago where Shakespeare wrote a play about a Pokemon lol (The anime style Shakespeare was recognisable enough that people that came in and saw the picture on the wall knew who he was).

    She has moved on from more original fairy, unicorn and pony style tales to Japanese anime/fan fic type work but I personally think it is good. The illustrations for a seven year old are amazing and really make the stories.
     
  17. w176
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    w176 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Yet she didn't have to extrapolate from her experience, just tell it. She didn't have to deconstruct her own experience, and reconstruct it into something new.

    She just told her tale with clarity and honesty. It still a fantastic work, just not a work of fiction. Fiction takes a bit of other set of skills and analytical tools.
     
  18. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    ^ I know. I'm just saying younger people can turn real life events into good stories. It's rare but it happens. I was just using that example, as it was the most famous example I could think of.

    I will admit, it's not the best example in the world. :p
     
  19. Elgaisma
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    Elgaisma Contributing Member Contributor

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    But then children often have a more raw talent with imagination and the ability to ask what if questions. I don't know how long my friend was writing for but Ellie has been writing stories since before she was three (admittedly she made me do the actual writing - I would be ordered to sit with pen and paper and write it in a certain way so she could fit her drawings in).

    She has experienced a lot in her seven years and manages really well. Her experiences are the stories she has read, her fantasy style imagination, places she has been etc Because she is home educated she can spend a lot more time writing than most children.

    I talk about my stories with her,she shares hers with me it is a common interest. She has filled about seventy A4 sized pads with writings, drawings and stories. Figure she will have well and truly done her million words by time she is fourteen.
     
  20. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    As Jeff said, if there is a difference, it's life experience. More life experience makes for deeper, more rounded writing.

    There isn't an absolute correlation between life experience and age. Some young children have been through a great deal, and some older folks have led very uneventful lives. But all else being equal, life experience does increase with age.
     
  21. Yoshiko
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    Yoshiko Contributing Member Contributor

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    Maybe the ones who become well-known are. I don't write fantasy and my family doesn't have any connections whatsoever, so it was never a case of saying, "Daddy, I want to be an author - get me a deal!!"

    I was fourteen when I first had my work published. Was it good enough? I don't think so but others liked it (not my parents - they're the type who offer constructive criticism rather than complimenting the things I get right. Plus, they're more into fantasy and sci-fi and consider my interests "creepy and dodgy"). No one has managed to correctly guess my age from my work yet, some adult readers assuming upwards of ten years older - so I doubt I'm bad enough to be "rubbish", but I wouldn't say my writing's great either. I just know how to make people laugh and cry.

    Of course, some published young writers are "simply brats who write fantasy rubbish". But not all.
     
  22. Mallory
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    Mallory Mallegory. Contributor

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    I never wrote fantasy fanfic. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it seems to be a stereotype that it's all beginning writers will write, and that wasn't the case for me. I started writing when I was in elementary school and I had a series going on about a cat who went on adventures - I might try to convert it into a children's series sometime, but writing kids' books requires a certain writing style and formula which I may not have at this point. As a preteen/teenager, I wrote a lot of chick lit stuff similar to the books I read (Meg Cabot, the Alice series etc) about a teen girl in high school who deals with drama.

    It's training and length of experience that makes one a good writer, not age. Someone who starts writing at age 10 and is currently 25 has 15 years of writing experience, so will likely be better than someone who is 31 and started writing at age 30.

    Age often correlates with amount of experience, but not always.
     
  23. colorthemap
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    colorthemap Contributing Member

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    That was a quote not my own saying although I probably messed it up a bit.

    It would be nice to read a published work made by an author on here.
     
  24. Alvaro
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    I think there's a difference between a good writer and a good storyteller. You don't have to be a good writer to tell a good story, though you would tell it better if you were.

    Youngsters can be excellent story tellers without being as skilfull as a writer as somebody who has been writing for years. Often young people have incredibly lively imaginations and if they can write at least halfway decent they sometimes get away with it.

    Eragon has often been used as an example. I have read it. I enjoyed the story more than the writing and I am unlikely to read more. That is fine, I am of an age where I expect more from the words on the page than just a decent story. But for youngsters, it's not so important. The simple way in which it's written makes it easy to read.

    I am not Eragon's target audience. But obviously it works for the average (young) teenage reader and that's just the point. If it gets young people reading (and writing!) it's worth being published.

    A. :eek:)
     
  25. Yoshiko
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    Yoshiko Contributing Member Contributor

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    Yes, I understood that. My comment was on the quote itself. :]
     

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