How can I write this seduction scenario with this character?

Why does it have to be a rapist he's hunting? Why can he not be hunting someone who has killed a relative or friend, or some other thing, as others have suggested?

It's very clear to me that you do not have the understanding to pull writing rape off. Have you actually done any real research, and by that I mean reading books (and lots of them) into the effects of rape on a person?

 

Well I was told by others that the cop avenging his own rape is an original premise they felt and they liked that, and the whole avenging a killed relative or friend has been done before they said. So I told to stick to the original idea, rather than redo one that they have seen done many times before in comparison.

I can do more research. Since I am into writing screenplays, I watch a lot of movies. I have watched quite a few movies on the rape subject, which gave me the idea. It seems I have to work on the villains motive though. I asked other people though, and they said that the idea was good, cause they hadn't seen it before, and that I should change the villain's motive, rather than change the idea. But perhaps they are wrong? But I do acknowledge what they are saying that the whole avenging a killed friend or relative, has been done many times more, by comparison.

 

It seems to me what you're really writing is a serial killer hunt that has a sexual motivation underpinning the killings. Been done before? hundreds of times. So what. It will be what you bring. how you weave the characters and what drives them. What kind of impact to they have on others and their relationships is what will define your story.

 

Okay thanks. I was told it was the main character's situation that was original, of a cop avenging his rape, and that it was this part of the story, which is the main part, that is original.

When it comes to opening the first act though, I open with the villains committing their crimes, and the cops finding out about them. So the first act is where a lot of the crimes are depicted. So is this bad, since the reader has to get past this in order to get to the impact and relationships of the characters?

But the inciting events that get the story started, are the crimes, so I felt I would open with the inciting events, if that is better?

 

It's just one more aspect of rape culture. That not having a sex drive, that being celibate, causes someone to become 'crazy'.

But the idea of the 'twisted woman' who is made 'evile' because of her 'experiences' not being 'satisfying enough', that's pure, unadulterated rape culture 101.

 

Yes it's original, but I do not think you have the capabilities to handle it. Watching movies is not enough. You need to be reading books, textbook-like books to understand fully what you are dealing with. At the moment, you really don't understand it.

Who have you asked who says that the rape is good? Did they know of the killer's motives, as you have them? Because I see a heck of a lot of people, not only on here but on at least two other forums, who have serious issues with what you're doing. You're very quick to dismiss them and hang on to what 'other people' have said.

 

Agree. But doctoral theses have been written about this: people go to the internet chiefly to find people who agree with them, not to change or learn something new.

I stated that once on a woman's website and one person chimed up and said, 'I did SO learn something new! I got some new recipes!'

head.desk.head.desk.head.desk.

 

Sorry I don't mean to come off as stubborn on wanting to make changes, but if I throw out the entire premise entirely, than there is no premise left really. The rape of the MC is the premise that almost everything else comes out of, and I was told that I should go with that idea, cause it was original, I was told by people before.

Like I am told to throw out the idea entirely, and write something else. That's not really a suggestion of change. So I have a hard time taking the suggestion, if it doesn't help the story.

Basically I just asked a few other writers way back when I thought of the idea a couple of years ago, and I asked just ordinary people, and they said it was original, and I should go with it, cause they hadn't seen it before. At the time, they did not know of the killer's motives fully, I come up with a lot of that later. I did not tell them why the villain is doing what she is doing, I just gave them the what, who, etc. But not the why at the time, since I did not have the why yet.

But I can come up with a different 'why', since it seems that might be the problem, or at least according to what others are saying now. Are their any good text books on what can lead to rape, and how rape can lead to revenge for the MC, if I do not understand it enough? What is a good book on the causes of it, if anyone knows any?

Back when I started though, I did ask some people in the psychology field, who were educated in psychology, and asked them. A couple of them said that the villains motive to lead to such crimes is possible, and they have seen stranger. Some said they were not sure. So it seems kind of all relative, if that is the case.

 

It will help the story, though. At the moment your story has the potential to be offensive and unrealistic. Changing rape to another crime may get rid of those problems. Kill your darlings.

But you don't seem willing to accept anyone's help (makes me wonder why you post so many threads, to be honest, if you don't want to listen to anyone), so I'm done too.

 

I think you need to focus less on writing something that's 'original' and more on writing something that's good.

I also think you need to think less about what people have told you you should write and more on what YOU want to write. If you're well and truly decided on this current plot because you think it's worthwhile - not because 'people' have told you it is - then just do. Maybe it'll be garbage, maybe %98 of the people I've seen in your threads will be wrong and you'll pull it off masterfully. But write what you want to write, not what others have dictated that you should.

Plus, that way you'll have to start defending this plot based off its actual merits and not solely over having been told it's ~original.

 

Okay thanks. You make some good points. You as well Sapphire at Dawn.

If I were to change the crime around, it would change the theme of the story around entirely, since the MC was suppose to battle with his inner demons for his rape, and get revenge. So if I were to change it around, I need to have some idea, of what the theme would be, therefore, after the change. I am not asking for people to provide me with one .

I am just stuck on changing the crime, cause I do not know what the new theme would be, and therefore, have no idea on what the new story is actually about, theme wise. I can do more research on the whole wanting revenge for rape subject for the MC.

Before I would get inspiration from movies like The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo, or movies like that for example, where the main character is raped, and then plots revenge on her assailant. I thought it was pretty simple and straight forward, but I probably thought wrong. If I were to change it from rape to a different crime though, I think that the theme and feeling of the story, would be completely different entirely, and I don't know if all the rest of the story would work as a result.

I don't know if I could change the crime itself, and keep the rest of the plot the same. Maybe I can. But if I change the crime, the rest of the plot feels off somehow now. There is one thing that could help though. For a story such as this, I don't know if you simply swap one crime for another, and keep the rest of the theme and tone of the plot the same, if that makes sense.

But I am curious, why are readers more accepting of me using avenging a murder for my story than rape? What is it about avenging a murder that gets a pass or more acceptance in comparison?

But my instincts are telling me that if I swap out rape for murder, that the rest of plot and the directions it goes in, will not work as well. Or is that not true and you can swap out one crime for another and keep the rest of the story and plot, the same?

 

The people in this thread aren't more accepting of one over the other. They are saying that you are ill-equipped to handle such a topic.

 

I said I'd stay away, but I have to echo the above. Rape could be a good motivation for your character, but from what I've read in this thread, you as an author do not have the understanding to do the topic justice. People have pointed out repeatedly that your rapist's motivations are skewed and offensive yet you don't seem to see this. It doesn't bode well.

Rape is an incredibly complex and delicate subject to write about. I will be the first to admit that I myself wouldn't have a clue how to handle it and the fact that you seem to just be blindly winging it is worrying.

 

First of all, if you want to include rape in your story, don't.

Yes it can be a motivation for revenge or whatever, but have you really considered the implications of writing in something which has so many people up in arms at the moment with regards to what actually constitutes rape?

Also, from a publishing point of view, you will find that most - if not all - publishers will turn down anything that includes a rape scene or anything which glorifies rape in any way. In fact, you will even have problems self publishing a story which includes the above too - it's part of the agreement with Amazon that your story does not include rape, child abuse or animal abuse in any way, shape or form. (yes, there are other self publishing outlets but you'll find they almost all have the same terms and conditions)

So ask yourself, "is it really, REALLY necessary to your story?"

If it is, then is there a way you can skip the act and bring it up in a court scene later in the story? Because if not, then I think you really need to take a moment to seriously consider what you are doing. There are a whole bunch of things that can happen to a character to make them want revenge on someone, without going as far as rape.

Good luck x

 

Okay thanks. I was not aware that rape might have been that bad of a topic for fiction at the moment. When you say people are up in arms about it, what exactly are they up in arms about to what actually constitutes rape? I also do not think I glorify it, since I wrote it so that it has a very negative impact on the characters.

 

Really? Have you not been reading this thread?

Re-read this thread.

This is what makes me worried. You've had 90 replies to this thread yet you don't seem to remember what it is that people object to. You're not taking anything in.

 

That's why he has so many of these threads. The information retention seems to be non-existent.

 

There's a massive argument at the moment as to what constitutes rape as it seems the word "no" or the ability to say anything, actually means yes.

There was recently a case in the US of a college guy who was a fantastic swimmer and was set to swim for USA in the future. On his way back from a night out, he came across a college girl passed out drunk in the street. He had sex with her, without her permission because to him, she was asking for it, why else would she be passed out in the street? It took a few people to pull him off her and the case went to court. His family pleaded with the court to rule it as NOT rape because A) she never said no, even though she was passed out and never said yes either, and B) a rape conviction would end his college life and would end his swimming career.

Do you think he raped the woman?

In parts of the world, a married woman is not allowed to refuse her husband's advances, for any reason. If a woman goes to bed and an hour later her husband comes to bed and asks for sex and she says no, not tonight, but he forces himself on her anyway, is that rape? (also referred to marital rape) or has a married woman got no right to say no?

Two twenty year olds hook up in a bar, they get chatting and drinking and after a good snog in the corner of the club, they jump into the same taxi and go to his flat. In the taxi on the way, the girl sobers up a little and asks to be dropped off at home. The guy ignores her and takes her to his flat, saying "just one coffee and I'll call you another cab." She goes with him and once inside he pins her to the wall by her throat and forces himself on her. Rape or was she asking for it?

45 year old woman is in the office copy machine room when the new 18 year old trainee post lad comes in looking for his boss. The woman traps him in the room and starts to undress herself. The poor boy has not idea what to do until she pushes him onto the ground and sits on him, forces an erection and rides him until the cows come home. Rape or not?

It is a very, very sticky subject that must be approached in the writing world with more caution than I care to explain. If you take the time to look into it, you will find that it's a subject rarely handled in fictional media and when it is, it's done discreetly. Take Law and Order SVU, they've had rape storylines, but the story deals with the aftermath and the conviction. Hope you understand what I mean.

 

I never watched it. (or read the books) but you can see where I'm coming from.

 

I'm wondering if this is partly the reason why one of K Reeves' films - scheduled for cinema release this June in the UK - was shelved with no other date put forth as I think the storyline deals with the rape of one of the characters who witnesses the death of Reeves' character's police partner. I think (but am not sure) that the movie went straight to video/amazon.

So for the OP, that's how much a rape scene/story can potentially affect your work. I've loved Reeves for over 30 years and although his character has nothing to do with the rape, this is one movie I won't be watching but just compare that to the gratuitous violence of John Wick, (blood splatter on the "camera" from point blank gunshots) that is one bad-ass retaliation movie and I cannot wait for the release of JW2.

 

Now, did they make it into a film? I seem to remember a film by a similar (or same) name where there was a married couple who couldn't have kids, which is essentially what they used the girl for, as well as cleaning the house and shopping. Obviously the girl knew what the job entailed but it still left me quite uncomfortable about the whole thing. I think I remember in the film, they covered her face with voile and the man's wife was there with them - and it wasn't violent.

If I've got the right thing, then I think it was partly acceptable because it was not contemporary, it was set in a Utopian/Dystopian/other world setting. That being said, it's still something I don't think I could ever do/write.