How do you remove and and was from your writing?

Discussion in 'Word Mechanics' started by architectus, Jan 22, 2009.

  1. architectus

    architectus Banned

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    Kate much better, and it is five words shorter :)

    Oh, BTW, the reason I call it flat, is because it is a laser blade, and I don't want people to imagine it as a short slight saber.
     
  2. captain kate

    captain kate Senior Member

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    I wasn't trying to be a jerk

    But basic grammar will help a lot in making those sentences shorter...sometimes you just can't keep from having one...unless you want to split them up and that can blow your flow to heck and back...

    But always remember this mantra: Less is more...less is more...less is more...less is more....

    and tell yourself that when writing. Less details is more...because modern "writing" has starting spoon feeding every little detail to the reader, making them lazy. Trust me on this one...
     
  3. Islander

    Islander Contributor Contributor

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    This sounds interesting. Do you care to give some examples?
     
  4. EyezForYou

    EyezForYou Active Member

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    Example #1: When John heard that his newly wed-wife accepted his hand in marriage his heart felt like it might leap out of his chest and he could not hide his happiness because--yes--she was the girl of his dream and said that three word all men wanted to hear: "yes, I will."

    Example #2: John beamed as he embraced Anna and slid the jittering diamond ring on her finger.



    Now, you tell me which says more.
     
  5. architectus

    architectus Banned

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    Eyez, I know this is for the other guy, but the first sentence is just really awkward in general. I believe the last part should be, she was the girl of his dreams, and she said the three words all men wanted to hear, “Yes, I will.”

    The second sentence has a lot of untold story, which is always good. Although, I think it might be better if it included some of the information from sentence one.

    John’s heart still raced as he embraced Anna and slid the diamond ring on her finger. He couldn’t believe the girl of his dreams said yes.
     
  6. EyezForYou

    EyezForYou Active Member

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    That's the whole point of my post, right?

    The first example I provided is how amateurs, or beginning writers would write; and we all once wrote like that. The second is more how a writer who's learned the tools of less is more, and active over passive would write, right?

    BTW, you don't need the phrase "he couldn't believe the girl of his dreams had said yes" because you can already infer from the sentence in example #2, that she already said yes, through the embrace. Why would Anna allow John to embrace her, if she had not said yes? And what's with that "beam" of smile about? If Anna did not want to marry, wouldn't she have let John know whether subtlely or through overt declaration? So John wouldn't be beaming or smiling if he was forcing her to marry. So these are the some of things we should keep in mind when we write. We don't have to say everything out loud. Readers can deduce from the context of the visuals, because we're creating subtexts, as well, not just the actions or random gestures of the character.
     
  7. architectus

    architectus Banned

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    Yes, in the second sentence their is a lot of subtext, which is good. The reason I think adding the bit about he couldn't believe the girl of his dreams said yes, is to reveal she was the girl of his dreams. This is assuming this info was not revealed before hand some other way. It also shows that he doubted himself and obviously holds her in high esteem.

    I also think replacing that he smiled with his heart still raced shows more character because it shows that he was nervous asking her.
     
  8. EyezForYou

    EyezForYou Active Member

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    Yeah, that's fine too. It all depends on the situation and the author's intention.

    For me, personally, I did not want to get inside the head or the anatomical body of the character. I just wanted to convey the visual outward signs of the physical movement. That's why, if you noticed, I added the word "jittering" as he inserts the ring onto her finger, instead of "heart racing," although both are great showing mechanisms.
     
  9. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    I'm with Eyez on this. The second sentence, He couldn’t believe the girl of his dreams said yes, is cringeworthy. There are so many better ways to show his amazement that she said yes, or the fact that he had obsessed over her for years. They don't necessarily fit into the same bundle of words, so any example would require more context. For example, as he goes about his daily routine, periodically drop in a literal thought in the midst of other thoughts or actions. She said yes.

    That's why I can't suggest any formula. You have to look holistically at the scene. You;ve thrown a bunch of words at the reader that say what you wanted to say, but it feels flat when you read it back. So instead of trying to rephrase the sentence, often you need to look at what you're covering in that one place. Eliminate what doesn;t need to be said at all, and find other ways to show the rest.
     
  10. captain kate

    captain kate Senior Member

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    When I write a scene now, I give everyone the minimum to get the picture. Why? Because modern-day writing, as a whole, (not that there aren't good writers out there, flamers) has become an action of spoon-feeding everything to the masses. I will take an unedited section of my novel for example...


    The wind-blown snow was blinding.

    Even with the goggles over her eyes, and the face-mask to keep out the cold, Kate couldn’t see. Cursing silently, she forced herself to keep moving. The weight of the rifle on her shoulder, and the pistol on her belt were reassuring to her.

    She fought off another shiver despite the Arctic gear she wore. Beside her, Loving kept trudging along, their tactical net filled with her mumbled curses. For the one time, she found herself agreeing with her old friend. In the world of the lowest bidder, couldn’t they have found someone who could actually make a set of Arctic gear that kept you warm?



    There is just enough detail to let your know that their walking through a cold, blizzard-like environment. Is it hilly, or is it flat? That is left for the imagination of the reader-at the time-before its unveiled in comments like 'drifts' and 'low spots.' All of which makes the reader THINK, and imagine a scene that fit it in their heads..
     
  11. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    give me some examples of that, willya please?...

    and what do you consider to be 'modern writing' in general?
     
  12. captain kate

    captain kate Senior Member

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    king for example

    spoon feeds you every little bit of detail..three pages to describe a post? I find that too many of the modern, especially science fiction writers, don't make you THINK enough...every is given to you to the point you can figure out the plot before it happens...

    'modern' writing to me is the stuff in the last 10 years of so...
     
  13. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    i still need to see some examples of writers who you think do that, to be able to agree or disagree with your claim, ck...
     
  14. captain kate

    captain kate Senior Member

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    my opinion

    King, Weber, most of the Star Trek and Star Wars novels...
     
  15. architectus

    architectus Banned

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    I don't think King's problem is description. I think he handles that well. His problem is he lingers on and on with back-story.

    Clay's attention was attracted by the tinkle of an ice cream truck. It was parked across from the Four Seasons Hotel (which was even grander than the Copley Square) and next to the Boston Common, which ran along Boylston for two or three blocks on this side of the street. The words MISTER SOFTEE were printed in rainbow colors over a pair of dancing ice cream cones. Three kids were clustered around the window, bookbags at their feet, waiting to receive goodies. Behind them stood a woman in a pants suit with a poodle on a leash and a couple of teenage girls in lowrider jeans with iPods and earphones that were currently slung around their necks so they could murmur together—earnestly, no giggles.

    Chapter 2, paragraph 1, of Cell, by Stephen King. Here he paints a big picture to set up a long scene. Notice he uses key words to quickly describe each part. Just enough to trigger the memory.

    In my opinion a good description is one that lets the reader easily imagine a full colorful scene, yet every reader imagines the scene differently because there is not too many details.

    Kate if you don’t mind I thought of a way to shorten what you wrote and remove a to be verb.

    The wind-blown snow blinded Kate even though she wore goggles and a face-mask.

    Or

    Even with the goggles over her eyes, and the face-mask on, the wind-blown snow blinded her.

    I think the information about the face mask is to fight off the cold is unnecessary because it is obvious. Besides in the next paragraph it says she fights off the cold.
     
  16. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Actually, your example from King does overindulge in gratuitous description. Does the pair of dancing ice cream cones really enhance the image of kids clustered around an ice cream truck? Is the phrase waiting to receive goodies necessary? I doubt they were there to chat with the vendor about te Red Sox!

    I know the area of Boston he is writing about very well, and his description is pretty pale for all the words he uses. The descriptions of the six people are a little better, especially given that they too are probably just window dressing for the scene.
     
  17. architectus

    architectus Banned

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    The people end up playing pretty big roles in the scene, including the ice-cream man. Even his truck plays a role as the scene continues. I think if he only said, the words MISTER SOFTEE were printed in rainbow colors on the side, it wouldn't have had the same feeling as, the words MISTER SOFTEE were printed in rainbow colors over a pair of dancing ice cream cones. From that point on he is called Mr. Softee.

    I think the last part of the sentence, waiting to receive goodies changes how I picture the kids. If it only said, three kids were clustered around the window with their bookbags at their feet, I wouldn't have pictured them as anxious and excited. Waiting to receive goodies, causes me to visualize them being overly excited.

    I think King is a master at producing the desired feeling he wishes his scenes to have, even if he tends to ramble on with too much backstory and narration, but he didn't really do that in Cell, IMO.

    That's just me, though.
     
  18. Atari

    Atari Active Member

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    Another way of writing those:

    After skipping in from the kitchen, his mother hugged his dad.

    His mother, having skipped in from the kitchen, hugged his dad.

    His mother hugged his dad after skipping in from the kitchen.

    His mother skipped in from the kitchen, whereupon she hugged his dad.

    :D
     
  19. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    yuck!... none of which can hold a candle to the plain/simple/clear 'and hugged his dad.'
     
  20. Atari

    Atari Active Member

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    Well, granted. . . but I was merely attempting to help the fellow. :-D

    Actually, I sometimes wonder why those different ways of writing the sentence sound awkward or clumsy. It is a shame, because I like the word 'whereupon'.
     
  21. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    so sorry, atari [nice rhyme, that! ;-)]... meant no offense, it was just a gut reaction that i let spill out too spontaneously into written words and posted without considering how rude it looked!...

    the 'why' is because:

    1. they're over-wordy
    2. using archaic words is seen as pretentious/pompous
    and/or
    3. because the syntax is scrambled

    love and apologetic hugs, maia
     
  22. Atari

    Atari Active Member

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    Wow. I now feel terribly awkward.

    But, no, I'm not wondering if they are verbose (over-wordy) or anything like that.

    I'm wondering WHY. If it is wordy, what makes it that way?

    Also, why is archaic wording 'pretentious'? I remember the good old days when using a word like 'heretofore' showed a knowledge of the English language, and the cognizance to know when to place the word.

    Now it's just 'pretentious'. Lame.

    On a side note, the words heretofore, inasmuch, wherewith, forthwith, and insomuch are all extremely useful words.

    Would you be against -- as a general principal -- using these in a fantasy story?
     
  23. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    This side note is way off topic.
     
  24. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    that should be self-evident... what makes anything 'wordy' is when more words are used than are necessary to say something... using 10 words, when 5 do the job well...

    ...it's pretentious because it's fancier and more formal than its alternatives in common use today... and people who use those words are usually trying to show off how 'smart' they think they are for knowing them, not using them because they're the best word choices for that place in that piece of writing...

    ...and i can't believe you're old enough to 'remember' those 'old' days... i'm 70 and even in my teens, i'd have been thought pompous if i'd used all the great 50-buck words i knew well enough to use properly... i read [and understood] shakespeare, the iliad and the odyssey at 9, always loved using the wonderful words i found in the classics 'for fun' but was smart enough to know when not to use them...

    ...in any age, to show that one has "a knowledge of the English language, and the cognizance to know when to place the word" the proper course of action is to use the most relevant/apt/current words in one's work... and, btw, while 'cognizance' is a near-close fit there, that's really not a completely appropriate use of the nifty word...

    ...hope this answers your questions... hugs, m
     
  25. Atari

    Atari Active Member

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    Eh, you're just reiterating the obvious. I guess my question is more philosophical than -- well, the opposite.

    And cognizance means knowledge or awareness, so I believe that I have used it properly. Different dictionaries define it differently, of course.

    On Wordperfect, it claims to use the Oxford - University Press, and the definition is 'knowledge or awareness'.

    Dictionary.com has several different definitions, and two of the most pertinent are:

    1. awareness, realization, or knowledge; notice; perception: The guests took cognizance of the snide remark.

    and

    3. the range or scope of knowledge, observation, etc.: Such understanding is beyond his cognizance.


    The word is not TERRIBLY specific, so I can't see how my usage is inappropriate.

    (Man! Being called out on everything is getting tiring, however; if you don't get annoyed with my defenses, then I won't get annoyed with your nitpicks)
     

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