1. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    How would this character discover something like this?

    Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Ryan Elder, Aug 4, 2016.

    For my story, it's a thriller set in modern day America, and in it, a group of cops form a group to get revenge on the villains, who killed their friend, who was a cop.

    However, I want the villains to find out that there is a group of rogue cops out to get vengeance on them. This will motivate the villains into their plan of action, once they find out.

    But how would a gang of crooks find something like that out? I mean let's say the police are looking for the group of vengeful cops, and are trying to stop them. If the villains have a police radio scanner, would they find out that there is a group out for revenge over the radio? The police will probably talk on the radio, and say to be on the lookout for so and so, but they will not actually say that the cops they are looking for, are out for revenge and they need to be stopped therefore, will they?

    Or the police commissioner could go to the media and make an announcement that there is a group of cops they are currently looking for who are out to seek revenge on the people who killed the cop. The police do not know who the killer is, and just have hunches, hence why a group wants revenge, since the killers were not caught.

    So the commissioner could announce on the news, for the mystery suspects to watch out for these cops, whoever they are. But even if a gang of mystery suspects are in danger, the police commissioner is probably not going to get on the news to warn them and admit that there might be a group of vengeful cops looking for them.

    So if those two do not work, are there anyway that the villains could find this out maybe with today's technology?
     
  2. Sal Boxford
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    Sal Boxford Active Member

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    I know nothing about police work so this might be implausible but...

    I suppose it depends on the timescale but I'd go for them finding out via a less direct route. The cop world and the villains' world are hardly isolated from each other. You don't need radios, TV broadcasts or email hacks to connect the two. There has to be a chain of people between one of the cops and one of the villains - I'm thinking somewhere their worlds overlap: petty criminals, former criminals, not-quite-above-board businessmen/security professionals.

    One of the cops is maybe checking in with a low level criminal, a minor dealer or something, someone he's spoken to before who knows a little about his situation, knows that the cop's friend was murdered. The criminal notes the cop seems a bit high strung or whatever that day, or maybe seems less sad/angry that he has been lately - whatever his response to formulating the plan has been - and the cop says something that (not bearing in mind all the tiny bits of info this guy will have gleaned from talking to him in the past, and, at the point, the criminal having no motive to use the information even if he understood it) implies that they're going to take revenge.

    Going back out the other side of the connecting bridge between the cops and the villains: the criminal upsets someone a bit more powerful... who it turns out reports in to one of the villains... the villains get the criminal... he realises who they are... they're going to hurt him/his family... he tells them about the plan.

    Not very original. Think I've stolen it from any number of TV shows, but that's my suggestion.
     
  3. ddavidv
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    ddavidv Contributing Member

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    If you spend time listening to police radio on a scanner you won't hear them discuss anything like that. Most channels are recorded so things stay to the essentials. When cops gossip about work it is when they are together physically.
     
  4. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    That's true. On a scanner cops just follow orders, if they are ordered to brought someone in, they do not ask why they are bringing them in, over the radio, right?

    The police do have one suspect though. Not an official suspect, but a person of interest, who could be part of the villains. Would the police commissioner, or higher ups, call him and warn him that some rogue cops are after him?
     
  5. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    That's true. On a scanner cops just follow orders, if they are ordered to brought someone in, they do not ask why they are bringing them in, over the radio, right?

    The police do have one suspect though. Not an official suspect, but a person of interest, who could be part of the villains. Would the police commissioner, or higher ups, call him and warn him that some rogue cops are after him?
     
  6. Scot
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    Scot Active Member

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    A plausible scenario could be one, or more, of the cops going a bit OTT when questioning someone possibly connected to the gang. Location is important. tie-wrapping someone to a chair in a deserted warehouse is hardly normal police practice (I hope!).
    The nark meets up with one of the gang, perhaps not knowing who he is talking to, and "Man, they were serious. They don't want proof. They just want to know who killed their buddy."
    If the word on the street is the cops are asking around in a less than formal manner the gang will soon hear about it.
     
  7. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    Okay thanks. There is one character who the rogue cops are coercing into helping them, set a trap for the gang. He could tip the gang off and then the gang would know. However, I am not sure if I want them to know it's a trap, because I still want the trap to follow through and have the cops succeed in trapping them. Perhaps the cops will know that he will tip off the gang, and they use this as part of their plan. But would they rely on the man to help trap the gang, if he is going to tip them off that is?
     
  8. Scot
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    Scot Active Member

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    Perhaps you need a Judas in the gang who, out to save his own skin when they find out the cops are after them, leads them into the trap.
     
  9. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    Okay thanks. I thought about that before, but I feel it would go against the theme of the story, and the feeling I want to create. One of the themes is honor among crime and how the villains all honor each other and stick together, so I feel if I were to have a judas, it might go against the theme.

    Unless the Judas was a minor character, and not one of the major players. But would I have to devote additional subplot time to setting up this character? A lot of times when I find myself stuck on the story, on how to get the plot from point A to point B, people will often suggest for me to create another character. Before I know it, I have more characters than what I thought was necessary.

    So is it good to create characters, when they serve no purpose to the story's theme, other than to be bridges in getting the plot from one place to another?
     
  10. Scot
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    Scot Active Member

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    Ask yourself, Is it necessary to create characters ...
     
  11. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    Well is the Judas character suppose to betray the gang only, or are you saying that he should warn the gang that rogue cops are out to get them?
     
  12. Scot
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    Scot Active Member

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    Someone on the fringes of the gang, irrelevant and disposable as far as they are concerned, warns them that the cops are rogue and out to get revenge. Could be a hooker, a paid informer, a drug user or ex-con.
    The Judas is the weakest member, or possibly the smartest member of the gang who betrays their trust. How many in the gang? I'd leave the identity of the Judas hidden until the last chapter.
     
  13. Cave Troll
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    Cave Troll Bite the bullet, do your own thing. Contributor

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    Where cushions are comfy, and straps hold firm.
    Word would travel fast up the chain from street thugs to big time players.
    There could be a mole and the villain have him followed, where they catch the mole informing the crooked cops.

    Well that is all I have, I tried. :D
    Good luck. :)
     
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  14. Iain Aschendale
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    Iain Aschendale Contributed Member Contributor

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    Don't fret, there'll be a fresh thread in a day or two.
     
  15. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    Okay thanks. I just can't think of a reason why the police would tell anyone about their plan, so that it would risk making it's way up the chain. Unless they wanted the gang to know, but I don't know if I can buy them wanting the gang to know, thereby diminishing the element of surprise.

    As far as a mole goes, there was already a mole in the story earlier, but he is dead at this point in the story. I could have two moles maybe, but not sure if that would come off as far fetched that the gang would have had two.
     
  16. Selbbin
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    Selbbin I hate you Contributor

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    The cops find them, a shootout occurs, it results in the gang getting away and realizing what's going on.
     
  17. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    I guess I could do it that way. The way the cops find them is they create their own sting operation to trick them into all meeting up in the same place, and giving them a reason to do it. This is how I wrote it so that the gang has a reason to have a plan of action against the cops. But if I write it so that the cops go after the gang, and then they escape, and then cops have to try again, I then have to write two sting operations, with the second one, being so much better than the first, since they will be hard to fool twice, after escaping a death trap the first time.

    So I feel it may overcomplicate the story to have to create two sting operations, and having to have the gang be fooled twice therefore. But maybe it could work.
     
  18. DespairAcademy
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    DespairAcademy Member

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    I'm not sure if this would work in the style of your novel but what if one of the cops is actually a traitor who is working with the villains? They could be holding his family hostage or maybe paying him large sums of money to help them. Sorry if this is not what you're looking for but I think it would be a really good plot twist.
     
  19. Selbbin
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    Selbbin I hate you Contributor

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    Scripts are simple. Not simplistic, because nuance can make them very complicated, but they need to be as refined and simple as possible.

    For example, in the main plot of The Matrix, after he's pulled out by Morpheus, how many times does Neo go back in to the Matrix?

    Twice - Once to see The Oracle, and a second time to rescue Morpheus. The rest are training simulations. That's it. Twice. And both become extended battle/chase sequences.

    If you really deconstruct most films, not much actually happens, plot wise. That's why normally it's short stories, not novels, that are properly adapted for film. Novels need a lot cut out of the story.
     
  20. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    Okay thanks. Well there was already a cop working for the gang earlier in the story. I don't know if the gang would kidnap another cop's family after the original traitor is killed, because the cops are already investigating the original mole's death, and the gang would not want to draw attention to themselves, by kidnapping the family of another cop per say. There is one person who can alert the villains who is being held hostage and forced to help the rogue cops that are after the gang. He has to alert the gang without the rogue cops knowing though. But I don't want him to say too much, cause this will give the gang the upper hand. So maybe he only says a little too alert them.

    Or maybe, one of the gang members is called into the station for questioning on the cop's death from before, and he goes in voluntarily to be interviewed to show that he has nothing to hide. The rogue cops maybe try to torture him into giving up the other members, since they do not know who all the members of the gang are. The honest cops catch the rogue cops torturing him, and this gives the gang member the opportunity to walk out of the station, go back to the gang and warn them.

    However, I am not sure how seriously the gang will take the threat. Even though one of their own was tortured, they might not take it as a death threat, in order to prompt them into action. And would the rogue cops actually torture a gang member in a police station, where they can be caught?
     
  21. loonypapa
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    I had a relative who was a rogue cop until he finally retired. We're all kind of shocked that he never got busted, because he would talk about it when he drank. He was a strange dude. None of us think he ever should have been given a badge and a gun. He developed a reputation on the streets as a cop who wouldn't think twice about taking out the night stick and beating someone. One time he was going to be included in an episode of Cops, but he threw someone off a roof during a chase and the show quietly kept him out of the filming. He was also famous early in his career for regularly walking into the worst, most crime-ridden, racially tense bar in the city, alone, in full uniform, just to start a knock-down, drag-out brawl with the gang members that called that place their hang out. He loved it. More than once the gang tried to ambush him. One ambush made the national news, but he wasn't in the car. He walked around for years with a recording of the ambush from inside the car, playing it for anyone that would listen, saying "that was supposed to me." Two cops died, two are now on permanent disability. Total nutcase.

    I could definitely see a gang member putting two and two together: this cop (these cops) are throwing people off roofs and getting away with it, coming into our bar thumping our skulls with night sticks and getting away with it, something must be going on, this is an organized effort by these few cops and no one is doing anything about it. It's totally, completely plausible.
     
  22. Ryan Elder
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    Ryan Elder Contributing Member

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    Yep for sure. That is very interesting to hear...

    Well my group of rogue cops could blackmail someone into helping them find the gang, and then that person, while left unsupervised, cause the rogue cops had to leave, can secretly warn the gang that they are coming. But the rogue cops know this and they were counting on him warning the gang, cause this will get the gang altogether in one place... which is what the rogue cops want so they can take care of the majority of the gang in one swoop. So perhaps the rogue cops can tip off the gang on purpose, and make it look unintentional, just to scare the gang into all getting together in one place for the cops' convenience.

    The only thing, the gang is now all together, mobilized, and prepared for an attack. So that is a disadvantage as well. Does that sound logical?
     

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