I don't understand how to eat healthy.

Actually what you just said was very wrong as well.

You should watch BBC Horizon Did Cooking Make us Human.

 

This is false. I just finished a recent book on cro magnons that goes into a good deal about their diets. You should read it then get back to me.

As for the book you suggest, the statement you make there isn't nearly the same as "most diseases" being caused by processed foods, which is nonsense as I said before.

 

Oh and The China Study is false.

 

Agree to disagree then. We'll see who lives a healthier life in the long run. Good luck to you.

 

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And as said watch that BBC documentary

"We know 2.6 million years ago our ancestors started to eat meat," -BBC Horizon How Cooking Made us Human

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On another note. I am vegan in my lifestyle. Since I'm allergic to a lot of things. I eat vegetables and whole grain bread. But I'd much prefer processed foods now and then.

Especially when I'm lazy.

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In the documentary I recommend they do a study where they try to get people for two weeks to eat like apes. And they state, modern humans cannot live off of just raw fruit and veg.

 

The human body was at one time able to eat a lot of berries and nuts in the age of the cave man however this was in addition to insects and some meats today our ability to process nuts and berries is limited because of our inactive spleans.

To go vegan is not recommended by many doctors. I balanced varied diet is the only thing doctors will recommend. Any study, theory or book that recommends eliminating an entire food group should be treated with caution. Many vegans are on suppliments to boost their iron and vitamin b12 levels also long term damage due to this diet is well documented.

Also consider the fact that local dietary needs are different for instance people living in china think that people in the west eat far too many dairy products. This is not incorrect its just that their diets are different and if they were to switch diets just like that it would likely be harmful. How many times have people been on holiday and had upset stomachs. Its not food poisoning its just a different diet that takes time to get used to.

There was a study done that the stress from diets can have a negative effect on the body so dont worry about it too much. If you have to make food from ingredients in the kitchen then your eating healthy, if it comes all prepared in a packet then as long as its a once a week, and not every meal time, its ok

 

Good info, +rep.

You know, I've always wondered if prehistoric people ate giant roaches for sustenance. The roaches were much huger back then, you know. Gross......

 

There's not much room for disagreement about what cro magnons, the first anatomically modern humans, ate. Some references:

"The first Cro-Magnons to enter Europe and Eurasia still owed much to their African ancestry, to hunting skills and lighter weaponry adapted in open, somewhat arid landscapes....Wild plants and fruits were unimportant in landscapes where growing seasons were extremely short. Judging from a study of modern Alaskan caribou hunters, most people probably consumed no more than a cupful or so of plant food a year....The essentials of survival remained unchanged: meat, of course, but also, and just as important, fat and furs, needles and thread.
...
Hunters working hard outside in cold environments could easily metabolize about four thousand to five thousand calories a day, equivalent to about 9 to 11 pounds (4 to 5 kilograms) of lean dried meat. That would be just enough to maintain their weight, let alone put on more poundage, Fat was only available from their prey for a relatively short time each year, in late summer and early fall, when reindeer and other animals had accumulated fat deposits. This is why late-summer and fall hunts were so important in Cro-Magnon life and probably why many animals depicted on cave walls appear with swollen bellies, with the massive fat deposits that sustained them through winter."

---Cro-Magnon, by Brian Fagan, Ph.D.

further...

"The results suggest little if any dietary difference between the Châtelperronian and earliest Aurignacian assemblages, insofar as such differences can be inferred from zooarchaeological data, agreeing with recent analyses conducted at Grotte XVI....If we assume that all Châtelperronian industries were manufactured by Neandertals and all Aurignacian ones by moderns, then these results support the conclusion that Neandertal and early modern human diets did not differ in any important ways, at least as regards the large mammal component of that diet."

---The large mammals of Roc de Combe (Lot, France): The Châtelperronian and Aurignacian assemblages, Journal of Anthropological Archaeology, Volume 27, Issue 3, September 2008, Pages 338-362 (Donald K. Grayson and Françoise Delpech)

...and you might say "so what if Neanderthals and modern humans ate the same diets. We're talking about humans here. So what was the Neanderthal diet anyway?

Back to Fagan:

"Almost certainly the Neanderthals were predominantly meat eater. We know this from the stable isotopes in the bone collagen in Neanderthal teeth. (citing M.P. Richards et al. "Isotopic Dietary Analysis of a Neanderthal and Associated Fauna from the Site of Jonzac," Journal of Human Evolution 55, no. 1 (2008) 179-85).

As for your assertion that "most diseases" are caused by processed foods, let's look at the World Health Organization's top ten causes of death (the last one isn't a disease and I think you'll agree is not the result of processed foods):

1. Ischemic heart disease - probably a dietary component. We can assume for the sake of argument that processed food might play a role.

2. Cerebrovascular diseases - stroke, essentially. Also a dietary component, but more related to fat intake from what I've seen. Less related to processed food. But diabetes can increase the risk, so there may be a relation one step removed.

3. Lower respiratory infections (e.g., pneumonia) - Caused by pathogenic organisms and not processed food.

4. HIV/AIDS - Unless you're a conspiracy theorist, the cause is viral and not processed food.

5. Chronic obstructive pulmonary disease - no real link to processed foods that I can find.

6. Diarrheal diseases - Highly doubtful that in most cases it relates to processed foods, because the extent of disease WHO is talking about are typically causes by infectious organisms. Bacteria, virus, parasites like Giardia.

7. Tuberculosis - caused by an organism, not processed food.

8. Malaria (tied) - caused by an organism, not processed food.

9. Cancer of trachea/
bronchus/lung (tied) - You made the link to cancer, which isn't implausible, but I doubt the processed food link is strong to these specific cancers.

10. Road traffic accidents - Not caused by processed foods unless you get hit by the Frito Lay truck on the freeway.

So, even being extremely charitable here, you may get 3 of 9 (not counting number 10 because it is not a disease). Hardly supports the argument that most diseases are caused by processed food.

 

Steerpike, your arguments remind me a lot of those Tea Party people who use any obscure logic to smear and contradict reality. I'll ask you in your next reply to use your own ideas instead of quoting other people's work. We all know there are people who will claim anything to get published, get attention, or make a bit of money putting out documentaries on what cavemen ate. Instead use your own common sense.

You quoted from someone's work that a hunter needs to eat 5 kilos of dried meat a day just to survive. Minimum. This made me laugh. Thank you for that. But unfortunately I have to tell you you are wrong again. 5 kilos of dried meat is what... 8-9 kilos of bloody animal? That's a lot of meat.

You say I am wrong about meat and processed foods (foods with chemicals added to them) being the leading killers of human beings, yet on your own joke list, the top two killers are diet related diseased which are caused by poor dietary choices. Seems to me you just confirmed my point by trying to refute it. Thanks again!

You are free to think as you wish. My opinion is that meat, refined sugar, iodised salt, alcohol, and the hormones pumped into dairy products are killing people faster than any time in history. You only need to look at a group of Americans to see how they are very unhealthy people, largely because of the overindulgence of processed foods.

 

Obviously you failed to read what I wrote as well.

We do not need special teeth to tear meat. We have tools that cut our meat. Our early ancestors did as well.


We started eating meat 2.6 million years ago.

Part of the reason that is because we are big brained animals.

I already stated the study where they had people eat a nothing, but Austra Lopithecus diet. Of raw fruit and veg. But it was not enough food for them. Enough energy for them.

We have to fuel our brains as well.

 

Ah, the inevitable ad hominem arguments. Inevitable, but still sad.

 

Peace upon you. Go have a hamburger.

 

Bill Clinton has adopted a whole food plant based diet.

 

This isn't helping your case. Not that you made one. Your argument apparently relies entirely on insulting people, and then stating that published researchers are fabricating their results in order to get published (because everyone knows the quick way to publication is to claim that Cro-Magnons ate primarily meat).

Seriously?

You need to go on the ignore list.

 

The book, "In Defense of Food," by Micheal Pollan is a really good read and makes you think a lot. A couple of points in the book...

1. People have survived on widely different diets for hundreds of years without many of the western diseases like high blood pressure, typeII diabetes, ect... primarily because the only food sources available were NATURAL food. Things that were alive once and will decay. Not like a twinkie

2. The study of nutrition is very limited in what it can do. Scientists have to isolate the element they're studying from the rest of the food in order to see how it works. This can't give a full picture of what a whole food does in your system when each of the foods component parts work together. EXAMPLE: in order to give processed foods a longer shelf life, fibre is removed. Fibre helps the body metabolize sugar (sucrose and fructose for the most part) so it passes out of the liver. When the fibre is removed, more of the sugar stays behind in the liver. According to Robert H. Lustig, MD, UCSF Professor of Pediatrics in the Division of Endocrinology, sugar is processed in the Liver the same way that alcohol is...thats not so great when the fibre is removed. So we shouldn't necessarily make all our food choices based on what scientists, who can only see a small part of the picture at a time, have to say. We can thank them for getting rid of real butter and telling us that fats are bad. Or just look at the news sometime. "Recent studies say that potatos may help fight cancer," two years down the road, "After extensive studies, scientists are saying that eating too much potatoes can increase your risk of heart disease," and so on and so forth.Take in everything you can, read, use your common sense.

You can check out SUGAR:The bitter truth, on youtube. Interesting.

3. Just try to eat real food as much as you can. Look at the label on bread in the supermarket, sometime. There are so many chemicals in there that aren't even pronouncable...and Dough Conditioners? That CAN'T be real food. I make my own bread. Salt, honey, water, yeast, olive oil. Thats it. (and really super good, by the way!)I know what's in it. Farmers markets are great because you can ask the growers how they grow their fruit/veg, if they use chemical pestacides and fertalizers, how they feed and pasture they beef/chicken, ect... so you know exactly what you're eating.

You can still use recipes that you love, just try to use REAL foods when you're making them and substitutions when necessary. Eat less of what comes out of a box, more of what comes out of the ground. It takes more time and effort, and it's a lifestyle change, but it's up to you. Good luck!

 

Those are good points, Nikki, and I think good advice overall. I take exception with only one small point. You talk about eating real foods, but then mention that it is good to get rid of real butter. It isn't. The alternative is margarine, which is not a real food but simply chemically processed vegetable oil. Your body is much better off, on the whole, with real butter. It is a real food and you can handle the fats (though as with anything you shouldn't overdo it).

So the switch from margarine to butter is a real food substitution that people should make.

Other than that I think I agree with everything you have there

 

Great post Nikki! Micheal Pollan's books are really good, I agree with you completely. He plays a big part in a documentary called 'Food Inc.' by Robert Kenner.

Also another great book/movie is 'Forks over Knives' by Lee Fulkerson.

 

I suspect you agree with all she has to say!
Michael Pollan does write with great reasonableness on these things....His notion that you should only buy/eat what your grandmother would recognise as food is a very cogent one.

BTW Campbell's China Study, mentioned earlier, has been utterly demolished in recent years. There are some very sound and commendable reasons for not eating meat but the promotion of your own physical well-being is not one of them. Naturally, this makes the vegetarian course all the more laudable since it is that of the martyr.

 

Steerpike, I think I might not have been clear enough with my sarcasm When I said, "We can thank them for getting rid of real butter," I meant that sarcastically, lol, thats ALL I use with the exception of "I Can't Believe It's Not Butter," for homemade chocolate chip cookies on the rare occasion because they make THE best cookies.

 

Aha! Yeah, my sarcasm meter has been on the blink. I'll give it a swift kick

 

You are correct, art. I did agree after all.

I like the martyr comment. So one is harming oneself to save animals! Nice.

 

I'll take my cow still "moo-ing" please

 

Preferably free range, grass fed and happy if you don't mind.

 

Utterly? The only people who criticise it are the same people who were criticised in the book. American doctors and hospital admins who make lots of money off sick people, and as a result have no desire to see you get healthy. Just like big gas companies paid "experts" to criticise Al Gore for his public stance on global warming.

 

Oh yes. Those who truly understand epidemiology. Those who truly understand how to work with statistics. And so on. Smart people. Some with axes to grind. Many with no axes to grind. Do some searching about. I will not spoon-feed you that which you'll find indigestible.