I agree @Steerpike. Same sex relationships should have more representation in film. My argument is that in this case the issue has been created after the film when there is nothing about Elsa's character that suggests any sexuality. If the second film brings it up, cool, but in the first it just isn't an issue. Thats just my take on it though
I'm basing that off all the parents I know telling me it is setting a great example for little girls because it showed they dont need a man. I can only go off my own experience at the end of the day. I find it strange to, sort of flies in the face of equality whiles trying to empower girls. Doesn't stop it happening all the time. Progress is slow
But "don't need a man" doesn't require that there BE a man, to which she's romantically attached to, for her to not-need. That's the part I'm not getting. Why does she need a man in order to make the point that she doesn't need a man?
I didn't say she needed a man, I said it was probably the most logical for the story. I'm not arguing with anybody about anything just giving my opinion on an aspect of the plot thats being disscussed. Not saying I am right or that is the only way they could have done it, only why I think they did. Isn't that why we are on this site, to disscuss story telling. Gender politics really isnt my area.
Yeah, I don't think that as the point either. Maybe if it had come out thirty years ago. For that to be a significant part of the message, you'd have to consider a woman being relevant to a story, rather than simply to a male's character arc, to be a novelty.
I mean, just talking about princess movies, Brave came out before Frozen and was - in part - specifically about Merida being independent / not wanting to be betrothed. There was no fleshed-out prospective love interest for her to be disinterested in; the movie paid just about as much attention to the suitors as Merida did and it worked perfectly well.
It's going to take a lot of time and energy to change the perception of the normal romantic relationships. For hundreds of years males have been taught -you love having sex with females more than anything (there was even a saying when I was young that amounted to 'if you're not thinking about sex ever 6 seconds, something is wrong with you') -the way to have the most/best sex is to be extremely skilled or wealthy Females have been taught -be as attractive as possible to get the best male -don't take sex with a male lightly, make them earn it So nearly our whole economy, most of our progress, is attributed to guys desperately wanting to get laid, and girls saying, "you better earn it." To add to this charge, kids aren't even allowed to see what the opposite sex looks like during their developmental years. If a 11-year-old boy or girl even glimpses another naked, they freak out; they've been told for years now they should absolutely not do that. Same sex relationships in the media aren't fighting bigoted people, those are just the idiots that found an excuse to hate other people, they're fighting the current culture. The reason certain cultures/religions/beliefs stay around is because they're very difficult to kill off.
The 3 guys in Brave that are trying to get her hand don't count as love interests? The fact she ignored them was the point. Anyway I am not saying a film has to have a love interest to work, just that it is a common thing in film.
Shouldn't the real message for girls be: “Do whatever you want with your romantic life! If you want a man, go for it. If you want a woman, go for it. If you just want to be free from the burdens of marriage to either sex, then have at it!”
That's what I mean, they were there but neither Merida nor the narrative gave them that much time - they weren't really love interests because she wasn't interested in them, and they weren't even full characters. I haven't seen Frozen but from what I've gathered about it, Kristoff and Hans are fleshed-out characters and love interests who had plenty of screen time. I'm just saying, you don't need a love interest to demonstrate that the princess is independent, and to me it's counter-intuitive to say so. I mean, even in Frozen, Elsa's plot is about her relationship with her sister and herself / her powers, right? She's not less independent than Anna because she doesn't have a guy to reject/ignore.
That is a fair point. I think it is just easier for writers to do it that way because it is safe. Right now I think studios are wary of same sex relationships in kids films because they don't want it to affect their bottom line. From what I gather it is a touchy subject for some parents and kids films are generally aimed the mass market so they are cautious about which attitudes they tackle. Of course they probably base this of societies attitude but thats a whole other kettle of fish.
And if Disney leads the way with a commercially successful movie that includes a same sex relationship it will show other studios you can do it.
