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  1. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Patricia Arquette's Oscar acceptance speech

    Discussion in 'Debate Room' started by 123456789, Feb 25, 2015.

    Patricia Aquette, who looks like this ,
    [​IMG]

    and who won the Oscar this year for best supporting actress, delivered a short speech regarding equal rights for "women," which I quote here.

    “To every woman who gave birth, to every taxpayer and citizen of this nation, we have fought for everybody else's equal rights, it's our time to have wage equality once and for all and equal rights for women in the United States of America.”

    She was later asked to elaborate backstage what exactly she meant, and this is what she said.

    "It's inexcusable we go around the world talking about equal rights for women in other countries ... and we don't have equal rights for women in America.The truth is even though we sort of feel like we have equal rights in America, there are huge issues that are at play that really do affect women. It's time for all … the gay people and people of color that we've all fought for to fight for us now."

    Full details in the link below

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2015/02/23/patricia_arquette_on_pay_equality_insulting_to_feminism.html

    My thoughts:
    Personally, I find the quote in bold to be very disturbing (for multiple reasons but let's stick with the obvious). If gay people and people of color are in a different group, then who is "us?" Straight, white, women. If you look at the article linked above, you'll find that straight white women suffer less from the pay gap, when compared to racial minorities and also homosexuals. She mentions the pay gap in her on stage speech, but according to her comments off stage, its the pay gap for straight white women that matters, which is the smallest of the three groups she defines off stage (gays, racial minorities, and "women."

    I like to play devils advocate with myself, so I thought, maybe this is not what she meant. Maybe she just meant that feminists have tried to help different types of inequalities, like those specifically against racial minorities or gays, and now she'd like the favor in return for inequalities specifically targeted against women. This line of reasoning still belittles the efforts of non white female feminists, and also unecessarily distinguishes white females from the rest. But the defense simply doesn't work, because white straight women have the smallest pay gap, and therefore, according to her on stage speech, which focuses on pay gay, suffer the least.

    So there you have it. Sometimes I take long hard looks in the mirror, and I think to myself, "maybe you are just a stubborn jerk who really doesn't get it. You really need to rethink things, boy!" Then, some white, spoiled, rich women comes along and reinforces my initial opinion, that when new wave feminists talk about bettering things, they're really just talking about themselves. It's sad that everyone is so selfish, but makes me feel a little better about myself, too.
     
  2. Chinspinner
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    Chinspinner Contributing Member Contributor

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    Just sounds like a stupidly worded comment. Everyone will now concentrate on that rather than the issue of pay disparity.

    It is one of those things I see time and again these days though. Someone will make an important and sincere point, and the media will pick up on one bad phrase, which they will pick apart, and everything else will become lost.

    EDIT: I should add that I get pissed off with Hollywood stars lecturing me, regardless of their cause.
     
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  3. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Stupidly worded comments can be very revealing. What it sounds like to me is a white straight women who is thinking primarily about herself. No one is really playing with her words. It's basically exactly what she said.
     
  4. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    Patricia Arquette, wasn't she in Lost Highway? (look at me all not being bothered to google something!)

    I've watched only parts of her speech to be honest, but I applaud her for it. As I applauded Emma Watson for bringing up the same issue to the UN. I find their attitude much more mature and effective than idiots who treat men like the enemy, and I personally respond to it much better.

    I also like the fact that people can make a speech like that at the Oscars and not be unanimously attacked as some-kind of blow-hard. Is the issue she's raising all that important in our day and age - I don't know. I've been called insensitive to the feminist struggle in the past, and I dare say that's even true, but I'm also at the same time sympathetic. Ok I'm distantly so, but still sympathetic.
     
  5. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    I need to see that movie, still.

    It's not the speech that bothers some people (although personally, when watching it, it felt kind of tasteless to me). It's the fact that off stage she separated non whites and gays from women. Who does that leave left?
     
  6. Chinspinner
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    Chinspinner Contributing Member Contributor

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    It is a stupid comment, I agree. She should probably have worded it better.

    Before I left the UK a Tory MP said words to the effect of this (in response to a specific question): If someone with severe mental disabilities is able to improve their sense of well-being, self-worth and confidence through gainful employment, but in specific circumstances where the employer can't afford to employ them because of their lower productivity; then the minimum wage should be reduced on an individual basis.

    The papers the next day: Tory's don't think the disabled are worth the minimum wage. That was the end of an important debate because people wanted to sensationalise and twist it to suit their own ends.

    I think that some random Hollywood star (who isn't even a big draw) should word these things a little better, but I'm not going to sacrifice her at the alter of sensationalist headlines because she didn't.
     
  7. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    How could she have worded things better? You mean by not spending the ~20 or so words to separate non white, straight women from part of the feminist effort? :confused:
     
  8. Chinspinner
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    Chinspinner Contributing Member Contributor

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    She would have been better to word it along the lines of "it is time for true equality" or something. A wealthy movie star suggesting that minorities should help her get a pay rise, essentially because they owe her a favour, that is crass in the extreme. But we've all said stupid things off the cuff, I think we are just too ready these days to crucify people for it.
     
  9. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    I don't believe in crucifying celebrities, and I understand your natural reaction to defend any celebrity being crucified. However, lately I have been seeing all sorts of doube standards in this particular area of discussion, and when I read what Patricia Arquette had to say, everything fell into place for me.

    For example, I hear all the time people complaining about sexual assault on campus. Then, just today, I found out campuses are actually the safest places in terms of avoiding sexual assault. So why are college campuses a focus? Do I have to show you which race predominantly attends most college campuses nation wide?
     
  10. GingerCoffee
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    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    Shock, I'm with @Chinspinner on this one. ;)

    People who didn't like the message are glomming on to the mistake. I'm sure all she meant was pay equity is an important cause that seems to be ignored while other civil rights causes get a lot of attention.

    People have a short memory. The Sony email hack revealed Jennifer Lawrence was being paid less than her male counterparts that were not as well recognized as she was. And the producer responsible blamed Lawrence. That had to be a very big deal among very big female actors in the business.

    That is the issue, not Arquette neglecting to consider black women. Of course she would include black women. They get paid the lowest of all. To claim the slip revealed a double standard, (aka racism) sans other evidence is ludicrous. (Sorry, @123456789)
     
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  11. Chinspinner
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    Chinspinner Contributing Member Contributor

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    Wonders will never cease.
     
  12. GingerCoffee
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    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    :D
     
  13. ChickenFreak
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    Even the link that you point to doesn't claim that she actually meant any such thing. The opening focus of the article was that statements should be more carefully scripted to avoid errors of meaning of this sort.

    It seems clear to me that she meant that it's not OK to discriminate against people because they're gay, because they're people of color, OR because they're women. And that on that occasion, she was focusing on the "women" part of that equation. Not straight, white women, but...women.

    Yes, she misphrased. Yes, Fox News is leaping on that misphrasing with cackles of delight. Fox News would have found some way to demonize the message of wage equality for women; her misphrasing just made it a bit easier for them.

    Edited to add: By the way, what's the relevance of "looks like this"?
     
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  14. Ben414
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    Ben414 Contributing Member Contributor

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    I'm surprised Fox News isn't going further with it. After all, you could quote her as saying, "It's inexcusable we go around... talking about equal rights for women... The truth is... we have equal rights in America..."
     
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    Jack Asher Wildly experimental Contributor

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    I'm interested to know why you put up a picture of Arquett. Is it necessary to know what she looks like?
     
  16. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Yes, she looks like exactly how I would have expected her to look like.
     
  17. Jack Asher
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    Jack Asher Wildly experimental Contributor

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    Ah, so it was a super sexist reason. The girl looked displeasing to you, so you made that the central tenet of your post. I kind of figured as much.
     
  18. ChickenFreak
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    ChickenFreak Contributing Member Contributor

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    Strong and confident? How dare she!
     
  19. minstrel
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    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Staff Supporter Contributor

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    Maybe the pic was included in the OP just to show that she's, you know, white.
     
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  20. ChickenFreak
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    ChickenFreak Contributing Member Contributor

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    I suppose that's possible, but that was stated in the post. It didn't take that many square inches of likely copyright violation to communicate something that simple.
     
  21. Chinspinner
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    Chinspinner Contributing Member Contributor

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    I can't understand why showing a picture of the individual in question is a problem? It identifies her more clearly than a description.
     
  22. ChickenFreak
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    ChickenFreak Contributing Member Contributor

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    Well, we talk about a whole lot of people on this forum, and people seldom--very seldom--find it necessary to offer a picture.
     
  23. Chinspinner
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    Chinspinner Contributing Member Contributor

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    I didn't particularly agree with the OP, but when a couple of people group together to start attacking it for a reason as laughable as the inclusion of a picture, it devalues any debate to the point of irrelevance. Obviously he's super sexist because he showed a picture of the person he was referring to... what? Really, what the fuck?
     
  24. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Not just white. Aryan/ anglo white. Blonde, fair skin. Affluent looking.
     
  25. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    WF is a fairly one sided forum on some issues. That's ok. But everyone here is smart enough to realize there are other people with different conceptions. That modern feminism belongs to upper white class women is a real conception that exists. Whether it's true or not is of course arguable. But there are people who do feel this way. I posted that picture because she fits the bill so perfectly. And she did make a statement that also fit the bill, whether it was a slip or just poorly worded .
     
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