1. seelifein69
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    seelifein69 Active Member

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    People with "Internet Muscles"

    Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by seelifein69, Nov 2, 2011.

    I've just seen one too many users who are being rude.

    It's kind of stupid, there are so many ages and skill levels that it's discouraging to read the rude things someone puts. I'm all for constructive criticism, and I don't believe that I've been bothered by anything people comment on me, but I've seen others who have been rudely commented on.

    We're here to help each other become better writers, not tell someone how much something sucks.

    That's great that some people are so knowledgeable, but there's a way to be sweet and smart at the same time.

    Us writers are on the decline, so we have to stick together. Grow up!
     
  2. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    Rudeness is not something that is acceptable on this forum. Please, if you (if anyone) sees someone making rude comments, use the report button to alert moderators to it. We do not want members to be put off by the incivility of others, but unfortunately we cannot be everywhere at once. The report button allows you to flag such posts to us.
     
  3. seelifein69
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    seelifein69 Active Member

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    It's moderate rudeness, you know. I don't know if I would want to report every pompous air head on here, that would get tiring (lol). I wasn't aware that I could do that, and if I see anything serious, I will. Thank you
     
  4. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    If you're unsure, report it. Either myself of Cogito will take a look, and decide for ourselves what action to take. You're not going to be in trouble for reporting things which end up being judged within the rules.
     
  5. seelifein69
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    seelifein69 Active Member

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    Great.

    And BTW you guys have a great site running here. Kept up very nicely, and it's fun for all.
     
  6. shadowwalker
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    shadowwalker Contributing Member Contributor

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    I've read other places that writers need to be 'toughened up' so they don't consider it rude - needless to say, I steer clear of those places now. I figure, of all people, writers should be able to get their points across clearly without getting nasty... (well, okay, other sites, when someone absolutely refuses to listen to anyone's comments, I've been known to get a bit snarky :p )
     
  7. Arathald
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    Arathald Contributing Member

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    On the other hand, please don't confuse frankness with rudeness. If someone asks me for comments, and I think there is something that needs to be improved, I'm not going to tiptoe around it, and I know there's a number of other folks here who feel the same way. I don't think people need to be "toughened up", and I certainly don't think it's appropriate to try to find things to pick at just to be able to post criticism (which may be what you're getting at?), but providing suggestions for improvement is what makes reviews and comments useful (while "this is awesome!" makes someone feel good, it's not terribly useful in helping them get better -- we're not here just to be encouraged).

    Aside from reporting a comment that is out of line, perhaps also try PMing that person. I'm generally a nice guy, but I'm sure I've come across as less than gracious a time or two here, possibly because of something going on in my life or just because I'm tired and a bit moody. I don't mind getting a tip that maybe I was a bit too harsh, even if at the moment I might not like it. Not everyone here is an adult, but I expect us all to be able to talk and act maturely, anyway.
     
  8. Quezacotl
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    Quezacotl Contributing Member

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    Welcome to the internet and life. It's much more fun and easier to insult something than it is to praise something. If something gets too off-tangent or cruel, report it.

    @POST6
    Writers are human too. We say one thing and assume everyone else understands and agrees with our perspective. It is the poor writers that neglect to elaborate and expand on their claims.
     
  9. minstrel
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    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Staff Supporter Contributor

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    I've been accused of being a bit rude sometimes around here, but I never intend to be. However, I do tend to have almost a knee-jerk reaction to certain kinds of posts. For example, some people here take some writing "rules" as gospel, never to be questioned or challenged in any way or for any reason - adverbs are always bad, never use semicolons, show don't tell, any exposition is an "infodump" and must be avoided at all costs, hook the reader in in the first paragraph or the first sentence or the first word, etc. I see these popping up in many threads and in many cases, I don't agree. When I see something I don't agree with, I post politely about it. When I see something I don't agree with for the fiftieth time, maybe my response loses a bit of the politeness. I apologize here and now for offending anybody, but sometimes it's frustrating to see the same points repeated over and over when I don't think they're always valid.
     
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  10. shadowwalker
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    shadowwalker Contributing Member Contributor

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    I think if people remember it's constructive criticism it would be good. Some people forget that asking for a critique is asking for help. The author wants to know if there's something that needs fixing, if something really worked well. It's still a work-in-progress. It's not going to be perfect - if it was, there'd be no need to ask for help.
     
  11. Snoopingaround
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    Snoopingaround Banned

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    Hmmm...everyone who has posted so far seems to assume that rudeness is wrong. Why?
     
  12. jnk1296
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    jnk1296 Member

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    In my own opinion, I'd have to say that it just isn't good manners. People, I would hope, prefer to be treated with respect and courtesy, and being replied to with rudeness tends to do a lot to grate on the nerves. That, and it makes the poster of such comments come off as rather immature. Granted, there may be a time or place for bluntness, but for the most part, I feel it's looked down upon for the simple fact that rudeness doesn't usually bear any good tidings.

    As for my opinion on the statement of writers "needing to be toughened up," well, it's stupid. That's all I can say about it. Like many of the posts above me have pointed out, to be critiqued is to generally receive advice for a work with which someone can better their craft with, with the occasional positive comment thrown in, not to be ruthlessly nit-picked or otherwise demoralized.

    All in all, a flourishing environment, such as this one, is built around manners and general positivity. Therefore, rudeness is looked down upon.
     
  13. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    Heh. Anyone else catching the faint whiff of irony...?
     
  14. cruciFICTION
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    cruciFICTION Contributing Member Contributor

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    I think we all need to watch the gig that Steve Hughes did on offence.
    As he says, "Nothing happens when you get offended." And it's true. Nothing actually happens when you get offended. You're not going to die by being offended or get sick or get cancer. Hell, outside the internet, when I hear someone being rude, I retain the right to tell them they're being a fuckin' idiot (if such an insult is relevant), but that really just applies to racists most of the time (I retain the right to also occasionally be profane, anywhere, especially when proving a point).
    Really, the only thing that happens when you get offended is that you feel crap for a bit. I mean, boo hoo. Grow up and get over it.

    To be honest, I get sick of seeing threads like this on all the forums and all the posts on Facebook about it, because you know what? Nobody will ever change because they see that you have a problem with them. The best thing to do? Yeah, report it. We don't want to cultivate that sort of community here. Other than that, just get over it. And if it's someone being rude to you, try and figure out what the thing they're actually trying to say is, and work with it. If someone tells you your writing's terrible, maybe that's rude, but maybe it's true, too.
    /rant
     
  15. seelifein69
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    seelifein69 Active Member

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    I totally agree with constructive criticism, but everyone has to remember the difference of skill levels and ages on this site. You know instead of saying it 'sucks' or it's 'stupid', criticize the work that is done. A lot of people are kinda reluctant to post here, so lets not discourage.

    I don't look at writing as a structured past time, I look at it as art, so everyone's art is different!
     
  16. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    There is such thing as "bad" writing. But there are better ways of saying it, and feedback should focus on how to improve, not just knocking it down.
     
  17. mammamaia
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    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    how about saying that someone's comment is 'frankly moronic'?... i took that to be a rude put-down of the person who'd made the comment... was i wrong?
     
  18. cruciFICTION
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    cruciFICTION Contributing Member Contributor

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    If they say "frankly" or "quite frankly", that excuses it from being rude. :p
     
  19. shadowwalker
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    shadowwalker Contributing Member Contributor

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    What I really hate is when people tell others to just 'get over it'. Most do 'get over it' - but many also quit writing, temporarily or permanently, because the rude comments make them think they're stupid, unskilled, talent-less, etc etc. After all, they come to these forums (in general, not here specifically) to get help and when they get brow-beaten - well, I think it helps to remember when we were all new writers, frankly. I just see no reason for nastiness, other than to make oneself feel powerful.
     
  20. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    Quoted for agreement. You never have to be rude. You can phrase, even criticism, in a friendly and respectful way. I don't believe that there is a legitimate reason not to.
     
  21. Thanshin
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    Thanshin Active Member

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    I'm very surprised by this thread. This is the one forum I use as example of politeness and good manners.
     
  22. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    I think it is pretty good here, Thanshin, as we don't really stand for the sort of people who are just rude for the sake of it. But this is the internet, and there will always be people so arrogant as to thing that the rules of etiquette don't apply to them.
     
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  23. VM80
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    VM80 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Nice little discussion here.

    I think well-meaning criticism is fine, if it actually is intended to help someone.

    Some can be over-sensitive. Some can be petty or think it's their way or the highway.

    It's the same everywhere online. You get all sorts.
     
  24. Alex W
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    Alex W Contributing Member

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    I'm used to being on sports forums, and mainly British forums, which tend to be a little different and I think better for the arguing. And that's not an anti-whomever comment, but it's strange to me to see so many people trying to be nice about things.

    I like to see debates, I like to see people arguing their points of view, aslong as it's not done with any real cruel intention or just an attempt to insult the other person. When you see everyone being nice to each other without any arguments of any kind, it seems a little 'fake' to me. Perhaps i'm alone on this one.

    And i'm not trying to suggest that a lack of heavy arguments on here is a bad thing, just the seeming lack of spirit I suppose, a lack of challenging each others views and talking about them. Tends to be a "Oh, we're both right" emphasis on much of the forum, which puts me off a little. I guess i'm used to conflict! lol.

    Oh, and the only rudeness i've encountered on here was from a moderator, the general people seem fine, though i'm only a 'twice a month' type visitor on here, so i'll be missing most of the rudeness, if there is any.
     
  25. RusticOnion
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    RusticOnion Contributing Member

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    I think rudeness is fine if it's called for (irony).

    What I mean is that if the author of the thread asks for bold/brash comments then it's alright, or if someone makes a controversial statement like "My short story will redefine this genre as you know it," only to have it turn out that said short story is nothing but Nyan Cat flying around planets and visting "space-pals". But If you get a bad writer like me, submitting his first ever piece in the hopes of recieving constructive critisism, but instead gets plagued with comments similar, but not exactly: "Ubad." Then it gets inappropriate.
     

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