PRISM: NSA's leaked internet surveillance program

People who professed these things were scoffed at for being conspiracy theorists

 

The main reaction here was more like willful selective inattention. There are, of course, any number of CTs, you know, Trilateral Commission, New World Order, and all that.

I'll have to go back and look at some of my old forum discussions with the right wingers when Bush started all this data mining.

 

Bottom Line for NSA and why they do what they do.

Boston Marathon Terrorist Attack. VERY GRAPHIC

 

That's crap, sorry. The Boston bombing is an example of how the god-knows-how-much-money-it's-costing-us probably isn't worth it.

I'm all for the government disclosing the results, honestly, and the costs, honestly, and seeing how the math adds up. For a couple million per life saved, I think we could do better.

 

You probably need to subtract out party affiliations there and if you do you'll see that's what has changed, not the Presidential actions. The Republicans are the biggest hypocrites in the world at this point in history. (I'm not saying the Democratic Party hasn't had their time at the top of the hypocrite pile, but they aren't there now.)

 

They're both just as bad. Many of the people who were complaining about drones and U.S. government actions under Bush have gone silent with Obama in office, even though he doubled down on a lot of it. The fact that we have voters who cling blindly to their party of choice is one of our biggest problems.

 

Believe me, I'd vote for someone else if a decent candidate had any chance of winning. Obama (even without the filibusters and obstructionism) isn't living up to his image. But what can one do about it? The viable options were so much worse.

 

You'd only vote for somebody with a chance of winning? Where does that leave the outside runner if everybody thinks, ah he won't win - what's the point?

Shouldn't you ALWAYS vote for the guy you think is best, and just hope enough like minded people do the same? How will you ever have an alternative to Dems or Reps?

 

I vote on principle, not on who I think has the best chance of winning. That plays right into the same stagnant system we already have, where we pick between two entrenched political parties that care first and foremost about maintaining political power. Yes, if people start moving away from them to vote for alternatives, there may be times, especially initially, where the candidate you didn't like from the main parties is going to win, but you have to take a longer view if you ever want things to change. The Dems and GOPers are so close that fear of one winning over another is no reason to avoid a principled voted to try to get on the path toward decent representation.

 

Some more interesting coverage on Democracy Now from today and some older related stuff about the history of government spying on US citizens that I found looking into the 70s whistleblower interviewed:

Chris Pyle, Whistleblower on Domestic Spying in 70s, Says Be Wary of Attacks on NSA’s Critics

There are half a dozen additional links to related stories on the page, in particular related events from 2012, expanding the Patriot Act and the building of the building to house the data in Utah.


In addition:
Flashback: A Look Back at the Church Committee’s Investigation into CIA, FBI Misuse of Power

"Disclosure of ‘Secrets’ in the ’70s Didn’t Destroy the Nation"

An Impeachable Offense? Bush Admits Authorizing NSA to Eavesdrop on Americans Without Court Approval

The Return of COINTELPRO: FBI Launches Nationwide Surveillance Of Activists Ahead of GOP Convention

There's really a wealth of good information within their news coverage.

 

It's a tough one. Do you vote for Ralph Nader and end up with Bush instead of Gore? I can't help but believe that election decision was devastating to this country. I voted for Gore.

Sometimes I think there have to be other ways to change than hoping a third party can get past the corporate money. It was encouraging all the money the GOP had that failed to win them any seats. At the same time, they are going after state seats and governorships, as well as stacking the federal court from the bottom up. These people are not stupid.

 

This is getting really freakin weird.

Obama has admitted spying on non-US citizens living outside the US which means basically that he's spied on everyone except Americans.

If this is the case why isn't the rest of the world up in arms? Not the Russians, the Chinese, the Europeans, no one. What are they afraid of? Are they all spying on every single last one of us and only America has been ratted out?

 

On the lighter side, the PRISM US Gov Twitter handle is a riot. "He who would trade liberty for security deserves great customer service."

 

That's interesting. Except that "great customer service" is newspeak for "getting the customer to buy stuff they don't need".

On further thought, perhaps that is apt in other ways.

 

I hate to sound resigned, perhaps I just think one needs to choose one's battles. But how is this a surprise to you and what about all the commercial data collection on individuals? Just curious what you think.

 

What sucks is that data collection and surveillance has become privatized. The NSA relies heavily on private contractors to analyze emails, phone records, etc. There's no telling what these private companies are doing with your data. For all we know, they could be selling it.

 

what kind of data are they selling? Erebh drinks coca cola? There was a girl here a few weeks back who was screaming blue murder about this kinda thing the day it didn't pass the house - Obama said he'll never see that act passed when he's been doing it along - loada crap huh?

Nothing surprises me about govts. What surprises me are people who are surprised, people who don't believe in a NWO or those that think everything is a conspiracy and people who theorise should be admitted somewhere.

Is this Snowden guy on the run or have they killed him already? He told the Chinese (and showed them proof apparently) that the US have been hacking their stuff for years. Why are they so tight lipped? Are they harbouring Snowden? Will they hang him out to dry? Will he keep Manning company for the next 150 years? Confused? You won't be after this week's episode of DOPE!

 

We're back to, how does that NWO work, erebh?

I'm pretty sure Snowden's alive and spilling some hacking secrets about the US spying on the Chinese to anyone who will listen. I don't mind, BTW. If we're going to complain about the Chinese hacking us, we shouldn't be hypocritically doing it back.


It used to be the Trilateral Commission*, now it's the Bilderberg Group*. I don't think power works that way. It more insidious and less coordinated. Corporations have more power than is good for the rest of us. You don't need to look for secret conspiracies, everything is right there in the open.


* [Note, that's a semi-conspiracy theory site, take it with a grain of salt. Sourcewatch has a bit on the founder, he's got reasonable credentials. I'll look into the organization a bit more. I may need to correct myself on the site's credibility.]


UPDATE 06-15-13: After further looking, the links above (except Sourcewatch which is a credible site that tracks funding sources and political affiliations of front groups with misleading names) are indeed to a site that promotes conspiracy theories beyond what the evidence supports.

 

Oh nooooo we're not. watch most David Icke videos for an idea of what I think of the Bilderberg group.

On channel 4 right now they have a show interviewing people who have been abducted by aliens. One of them has been having an affair with his female alien abductor and she now has hybrid alien/human children for him. The problem he has is his earth wife is jealous. I wish I could tape this for you Ginge.... but its way too weird not to watch so unforyunately haven't the time tonight for my NWO theories lest to say, the destruction of Europe is well advanced.

 

Isn't Icke the trans-dimensional reptilian guy?

 

David Icke, you can't possibly believe that guy! He's on the level of Alex Jones and Glenn Beck. Not too may people are that high up on the crazy meter.

Oh wait, you're posting erebh humor. Whew! You had me worried.

OK, let's see. If it's not the Trilats, Illuminati, Reptillians or Bilderbergs, I'm still left asking, how does that NWO work?

 

Yep, that's the one.

 

well he's not but he's convinced others are. The lizard people are on a parallel dimension similar to radio frequencies, we're on one, they're on another, sometimes they cross over like FM interference into our dimension and these are the ones taking over as part of the NWO.

Interesting theories and a lot of fun
[MENTION=11513]Gin[/MENTION]ger - haven't heard of Glen Beck and only a little of Alex Jones who just seems to be a loud mouth attention seeker. I would put David Icke on a much higher plain. It's not too long ago Jesus was scoffed at and hounded off the planet, now half the world believes (not that i'm grouping Icke and Jesus in together - just attitudes towards them).

 

Consider yourself lucky.

 

As technology advances, so too does the 'public square'. That is, the area we go that is not contained within our private property. If we walk down a city street, we are intentionally giving up some of our privacy. We understand that people can watch us, police can observe us and there are different rules for public space.

I feel the 'electronic ether' is the same thing. When I go on the internet, I understand that everything I do is monitored and stored and scanned somewhere. It's the trade off for access.

On the other hand, I find it interesting that no one in this thread correlates the government eavesdropping with the IRS targetting conservative groups. This is the only thing that scares me. Recently, this government has been pushing to deem conservatives and right-leaning organizations as 'terrorist groups'.

From the Department of Justice, to the FBI, to Homeland Security, the government is trying to use the terrorist paintbrush on groups or individuals that:

• Distrust the government
• Value individual liberty
• Oppose abortion
• Believe in gun rights
• Are 'fiercely nationalistic'
• Buy food in bulk or 'prepare for survival'

There was a study financed by Department of Homeland Security and prepared by the University of Maryland called, 'Hot Spots of Terrorism and Other Crimes in the United States, 1970-2008'

In it, these types of characterizations run rampant. The DHS has been 'filtering' down these notions to local law enforcement as well, training them to watch for these signs of 'domestic terrorism'.

The problem is when my government is slowly turning patriotic, constitution-believing citizens, into potential terrorists.

Because once I'm labeled a terrorist, then they have free reign to do all sorts of legal (and illegal, in the case of the IRS) things.

The next step is a department-wide database of all your 'flags'. When you go to the DMV, the Post Office, or any other government-run entity, you will be harrassed and scrutinized for being a conservative.

I'm proud of the fact that I am a small-government individual and that I think the liberals and the current administration are destroying this country. I will shout it from the rooftops.

I just gotta dodge the bullets coming from the black helicopters that don't exist.