1. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    Reader Reaction (Legal concept)

    Discussion in 'Entertainment' started by GuardianWynn, Jan 4, 2016.

    Before anyone says it. I sort of recently asked about this or what I am about to ask. I opened a new thread because I am curious in a different way and I think that framing makes this valid.

    Three legal-ish questions. Before I was curious how our law would interupt them, but now? I am just curious what you guys think. In every normal extension of the term. Like, do you like the premise that a character is in the following situation? Do you think she should burn for it? Wish more people in real life behaved this way? Or if you read this, would you be turned off by it? Would it interest you? That sort of stuff.

    I guess since I am not asking them as questions anymore. The three scenarios are this.

    1. A legal woman, drops the charges against a man accused of a crime because a witness came forward claiming he is innocent. There was still enough evidence to take it to trial. She dropped it simply because she trusted the witness and she trusted the witness based on the fact that the witness has a close personal relation ship with her foster daughter.

    2. Her foster daughter has commited a crime(Murder) She believes this is true. Yet she has no way to prove it. The method to which she discovered this would not in any meaningly way be able to even take this to trial. So in that reality the woman does nothing. Tells no one. And takes zero action towards getting her daughter arrested. If she had the chance, she would also be torn. She would rather help her daugther(foster or otherwise) but lacks the position to do such. So she stays out of it.

    3.The circumstances behind the death of her foster daughters real mother are very unclear. So the woman actively took steps to hide them further. To the point of not exposing that her foster daughter is related to the dead woman. Her reasons are this. The dead mother had a large fortune that was slowly being given to charity. The woman here knew of people(literally, remember she is a lawyer) that would have the assests turned to them if the death became known. So in this act she willfully and knowling denied the people in question here access to funds that would otherwise be theirs. She did so to keep it in the hnads of charity though.
     
  2. BayView
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    BayView Contributing Member Contributor

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    It's been a long time since I graduated law school, and I never practiced. And I live in Canada, which has different rules, on at least some matters, than the US.

    That said, as I recall, in Canada all lawyers are officers of the court. As such they're expected to act in the interests of the court. The court wouldn't be interested in prosecuting innocent people, so I have no problem with scenario 1. But scenarios 2 and 3? Big problems. For #2, she should report her beliefs to the police because it's their job to find evidence, not hers. And #3 seems even worse to me, because she hasn't even got the "protective mother" excuse. She's allowing people to be deprived of money that's legally theirs, just because she thinks it would be better used somewhere else. That's really not her call.
     
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  3. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    So you don't like her?

    With number one. Isn't it still sort of on the line. Yes not going after an innocent man is in the interest of the court but she is basing that choice on something personal?

    So, is the foster daughter aspect hurting her cause or helping it? I am curious of your reasonins Since you mentioned the premise of her not having the protective mother excuse. It seems like in the interest of the law acting as a protective mother would be nearly as bad though. Wouldn't it?

    Thanks for your opinions. :)
     
  4. BayView
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    BayView Contributing Member Contributor

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    It's not a question of like/dislike, I just think she's morally wrong in this instances.

    For the first one I was assuming she was using her professional judgment, not some personal whim... if she found the witness credible and the witness's evidence credible, then that's professional judgment. I don't have a problem with it.

    Re. her foster daughter - I think the relationship is important because it explains her actions - parents have a moral responsibility to protect their children (at least to some extent) so I could see how she was torn between two moral duties. If the girl weren't her daughter, just some stranger, and the woman didn't report her? That behaviour would make no sense, and would therefore be more clearly morally wrong.
     
  5. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    Does that mean you don't have an opinion of the girl in this instance?

    Also isn't foster daughter practically the same thing? I mean sure shs didn't give birth to her but she adopted her. Doesn't it hold the same moral conflict?

    Then again. Case 2 is hard. In the sense thatit is really hard for me to think of her honest reason. I sort of say she doesn't proceed because she knows she would fail. But it is hard for me to imagine her proceeding even if she could win. So I guess the fact she knows the court is not going to be able to prove murder is sort of an excuse. Isn't it? lol
     
  6. BayView
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    BayView Contributing Member Contributor

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    The girl? Like, the daughter? Apparently she's a murderer, so - I guess I have a pretty negative opinion of her?

    Foster daughter isn't the same as adopted daughter. Adopted daughters would just be called daughters, generally. But, yes, in both cases, I think that's where the mom's moral conflict comes from. She's torn between two duties. I think when you're looking at murder, you have the responsibility of turning your child in b/c you need to make sure she doesn't hurt anyone else, but I can see how it would be hard for a parent to do that. In that case I think the mom should at least resign from her job in order to remove one moral issue.
     
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  7. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    This is where not using names mixes so much up. The mom. I meant did you have a negative thought of the mom in this case?

    Yeah, you are right. Resigning does take away that conflict. But she doesn't do that. I mean after all. Just because it is the right thing to do doesn't mean she would do it. Right? lol

    And yeah. I am betting you would likely have a negative reaction to the daughter in this case. I didn't even begin to hint at how far she has taken things. I said Murder. I didn't label how many. It is ... a lot! Lets put it this way. Her actions are codenamed by the government. Which I think people actually do that right? Got some mystery killer out there. We tag them with a name until we find them.

    Her first time she was discovered, or her first known attack left 40+ people dead. She did the attack on foreign soil which got her the nickname; "Alptraumkatze" or "The nightmare cat."

    Definitely not on your like list I assume?

    Ironically. Most people that have read this character really like her. They tend to gloss over the whole massacre thing that she does(quite often too actualy.)
     
  8. BayView
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    BayView Contributing Member Contributor

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    Well, yeah, I have a negative reaction to people doing immoral things, so since that's all I've got on the mom, I don't have a good reaction to her. She sounds morally weak, and she seems to be putting the protection of a psychopathic mass murderer ahead of her sworn responsibilities to the people she represents. So--she sounds like a problem.

    You could humanize her, of course, as you write her. But if she's covering for a daughter who's committing mass murder, it's going to be pretty hard for me ever really sympathize with her.
     
  9. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    Do you like art? I recently had a picture made of the daughter. :)

    Actually I get your reaction. Funny enough it is other people I don't get. I find it funny when people try and gloss over the mass murder thing as if it is only a trivial detail.

    The mom being weak. That is a new one for me. She doesn't have a lot of screen time but she is pretty bossy and cheerful. I do get the feeling the only reason she didn't try and fix the situation is based on the understanding that she would fail. Which is true. Also I don't think she thinks jail or murder are exactly fixes which is obviously what the courts would think. Can't blame a mom on that right?

    But then again you are saying she dishonored the court by staying in it. Right?
     
  10. BayView
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    BayView Contributing Member Contributor

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    People who don't do the right thing because the right thing is difficult? Yeah, in general, I'd consider that weak. Doing nothing and letting a murderer go free? Yeah, weak. And, honestly, if there are over 40 dead bodies in this daughter's wake, then I think jail would be justified. Not to fix the daughter, just to show some respect for human life and prevent further carnage.

    And, yes, I think she's dishonouring the court, but more importantly, dishonouring herself. She has a serious responsibility she's not even trying to meet, so--that's a problem.
     
  11. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    With the daughter I agree. This is why I don't understand some people that read her. It is almost like they think if they like her that makes her a hero. They can like a villain, but she is a vllain because she committs unjustafiyable murder. If she didnt do that, she wouldn't be the same character.

    As a writer I am sure you understand.

    The mom though. You got me a bit confused? How did she fail herself? I get how upholding a moral duty to her daughter means she failed the moral duty to the court. I dont see how that was a failure to herself?

    Also, I am guessing I shouldn't go into all the details on why she would have failed. But to sum up the point of those reasons. I don't think difficult is the right word. it wasn't hard or very hard. It was impossible. She knew she would have no chance at it. All trying would do is make the daughter stop talking to her. The cops wouldn't catch her. Nothing would change except that. Funny enough the daughter wouldn't even hate her. The daughter would respect her for trying, but it would fail. Nothing would even change because the daughter already doesn't trust her enough to risk leaving evidence behind. So she wouldn't even be more catious, because she is already catious. lol. Damn. when I say it like that the daughter is pretty bad isn't she? I did open with that she is a villain here. lol
     

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