1. Night Haunter
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    Night Haunter Banned

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    Religion Is It Mankinds Ultimate Weakness.

    Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Night Haunter, Dec 1, 2007.

    Maybe Religion is one of mankinds basic impulse's the need to believe in another higher order.
    Is faith like a vaccum, sucking up credulity in a frantic effort to fill an otherwise empty void perhaps it is a part of mankinds genetic charactor to need to hunger for a spiritual solice.
    It is a subject that debates a great many arguements. (If the almighty God does exist then the Devil has to exist.)

    Is it really necessary for humanity to worship a higher being or is it because the image of God gives mankind hope in death.
     
  2. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I would say it's a bit of yes and no.

    Religon, and when you get your own religon wrong, has led to many violent events in history.

    But, i'm a buddist. And am greatly comferted by my own beliefs.

    So I guess, it isn't the Religon it's self which is bad, but a few idiots that use it to there own ends.
     
  3. SeaBreeze
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    SeaBreeze Banned

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    Well said!

    Me? I like having hope. Even if it may be false, I can't stand the thought of not being able to THINK or being nothing.

    It doesn't help when the Bible has been re-written how many times now? And then other religeous material is interpreted so wildly, regardless of faith.

    I don't think religeon is weak, it can give the believer strength. It's just how the believer sees the world and interprets what is written.
     
  4. Jerome
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    Jerome New Member

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    I definitely support Lemex's idea.
     
  5. PrincessGarnet
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    PrincessGarnet Contributing Member

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    I think people are just scared, so they like to believe that there is someone watching over them. Religion is also good to keep people in line and to behave - but obviously the people in control can misuse this and exploit people. I think I'd be happier in a delusion but all the religions i have tried out have just been so ridiculous. But I say believe in anything you want if it makes you happy, just don't push it on to other people.
     
  6. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    I agree with Lemex. Most of the problems with religion arise when someone twists it around or outright ignores the meaning. This is a problem with almost any ideology or philosophy. Carl Marx is the best example I can think of besides religion. The revolutions in Russia certainly twisted around his concept (However flawed it may be) and turned it into a way to gain absolute control. The religion isn't the problem its the people who follow it.

    Personally I love religion. My own and I love learning about others. It is comforting to believe that there is a higher power and something after death. Plus its good thinking food. One can laying around and ponder religion for hours and never get bored.
     
  7. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    There is a side of humanity that feels a need to abdicate responsibility to a higher power. To me, that is akin to addiction, and is the greatest harm inherent in religion.

    What atrocities people do in the name of religion, they would probably also do in its absence. Religion often just stands as a convenient scapegoat, a reason to give when man wants to lash out in hate but also wants to believe it is a noble cause.
     
  8. Robert
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    Robert Banned

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    Religion is responsible for a lot of bad things, and a lot of good things too. As an atheist, I hope one day mankind learns to live without it.
     
  9. luke_mushu_2010
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    luke_mushu_2010 Senior Member

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    This is a few question for the athiest's of the board. What do you believe happens after death? Do you get scared thinking that after you die your just not "there", like you never existed or something? That's a scary thing to think about in my opinion.
     
  10. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    All things have a beginning and an ending. It is the nature of reality. But it is an uncomfortable truth for many.
     
  11. mammamaia
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    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    ...one of his first!... and worst...


    ...the silly perceived need to have an answer to everything... so, when mentally-challenged man doesn't know something, he makes up a reason to make himself feel better about being clueless... a god who must keep some things secret for the supposed good of mankind was a great copout...

    ...lacking the guts to admit one doesn't know everything and doesn't have to, 'faith' becomes a good excuse for all bad behavior and leaves the believer the loophole of 'divine forgiveness'... plus, providing the 'reward' of an afterlife, so one doesn't have to make the best of the only one they know they have...

    ...not necessarily, but some like to think so... and subjects don't debate arguments... people debate controversial subjects by making statements... and statements start arguments...

    ...of course it's not 'necessary' but people make it so, in their own minds, that they allow to be limited by others who preach this or that man-made religion... and the belief in a god is certainly not needed, to have some concept of an existence beyond death... but the raising of a god and a religion full of rules 'n regs is the best way for the few to control the many... 'nuff said...
     
  12. Frost
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    Frost Contributing Member

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    Jesus, Maia, you make it sound like anyone who follows any sort of religion a gullible, weak, cowardly fool! (no pun intended there either).

    Touche. The whole point of the after life is to reward those who fulfilled their lifes. You cant go through your life simply saying you believe in God but not showing it and expect to pass through the Pearly gates with open arms. Just goes to show how much you actually know about the 'rules n regs' my friend.

    Personally, I'm catholic. I believe in God because I don't believe that everything around us happened by chance. Does that make me a coward? Does that make me a fool? Of course it does.
     
  13. dushechka
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    dushechka Contributing Member

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    Religion and faith isn't the problem; the problem arises when it's used in extremities, as Lemex already pointed out.

    I'll boldly state that yes, I am a Christian, but at the same time, I haven't been to a church 'religiously' for over ten years. I can't stand today's churches for one reason or another, so I don't go. And I don't believe it's a necessity in order to believe in a faith. My faith is my religion, not the other way around.

    What's wrong with believing in something higher than ourselves? If it gives us hope, what's the big deal? As long as I stay in my corner and worship however I might, why must you consider that an impulse and a frantic effort at solace? (Rhetorical questions..)

    It's necessary to those who find it necessary, and a complete fools hope to those who find it pointless.
     
  14. evizaer
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    evizaer Contributing Member

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    I have no religion. I don't believe in atheism, nor do I believe in a theism (sorry for the clever language; it gets my point across).

    People are not "weak" to have religion. People seek reason when things are inexplicable--they seek a truth where no truth can be presently found. This is not a weakness, but a strength. It is what has allowed us to intellectually survive for so long as a species. We seek out knowledge, whether that knowledge lies in the divinity of God, the prescripts of the Vedas, the transcendence of our physical being, or the end of a microscope.

    Most people do not choose to believe in a religion. They are conditioned to believe in God just as we are conditioned to live in our culture in childhood. This is not a weakness on the part of the religious man, this is a matter of course. He has no control over who his parents are and what his parents will teach him. He, therefore, cannot be faulted for believing in God if that is what he feels in his heart to be truth.

    Does God exist? The question is irrelevant and secondary! You do not need God to exist to lead a good life. If you do, then that is weakness. You have a billion reasons to live a good life that will exist regardless of the existence of some higher power. But truly, you should not need reasons to lead a good life; Being good is the ultimate end.
     
  15. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    I agree one hundred percent! Just remember that salvation/enlightenment in some religions is dependent on the realization or acceptance of a certain principle (Accepting Jesus Christ for example). So for some it is relevant if god exists or not.

    I would say rather that the existence of god can niether be proven or disproven and its pointless to argue over his existence (Let each individual decide for themselves and let it be I say).

    As much as human beings have an affinity for knowledge and understanding, they also have an affinity for the spectacular and the mystical. To ignore one side of human nature completely in favor of another is irresponsible.
     
  16. Eoz Eanj
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    Eoz Eanj Contributing Member Contributor

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    This is all well and good for those who have their lives together, but how about we consider the minority? For some people, who have experienced profound, near infallible pain in their life, honestly, if believing in something supposedly greater than themselves gives them hope and relieves their suffering, even slightly, then I'm all for religion. For example, my close friend's Mother has a crippling spine disorder and she suffers from bipolar, yet what helps her continue living? It’s her personal spiritual search for something greater than herself. Does this make her weak, gullible, cowardly? You decide.
     
  17. evizaer
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    evizaer Contributing Member

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    Religion makes no one cowardly, much like it makes no one kill--it can be used as an excuse for cowardice and closed-mindedness. The flaw lies not in the religion! It lies in the person who is guilty of such weakness.
     
  18. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    That I can't refute because it is perfectly stated.
     
  19. Domoviye
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    Domoviye Contributing Member

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    As an atheist I don't find death scary. I don't want to die, but thats not so much from being scared, as I like living.
    I don't know what happens after I die. If I cease to exist (likely), I won't be around to care.
    Did I care about anything before I was born. No.
    Will I care about anything after I die. No.
    So that keeps me from seriously worrying about my afterlife. Personally though I find the thought that if I did something wrong, didn't pray enough, didn't worship my ancestors enough, spit when I shouldn't have, that I'll end up in a Hell, or be reincarnated as a dung beetle.

    Now for the original question. Religion has all too often been used badly. It can be a great comfort to people, and keep people striving to achieve great things.
    But too often it's been used as an excuse to kill and abuse your neighbour, to keep people from thinking, or advancing, and to keep us weak and powerless sheep.
    So when I see people shouting to the masses that something is immoral and a disgrace to God, gods, whatever, and should be destroyed, I get very nervous, and start looking for a way to stop them.
     
  20. want2playwithurevilinside
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    want2playwithurevilinside Member

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    Just wanna say...
    People who 'worship the devil'
    Have to believe in god.
    So why worship the devil if you believe in god?
    Thats a sure ticket to hell.
    Plus
    Scientlolgy.. anyone want a laugh? Look that one up *chuckles*
    Just to put this out there, scientology was invented by a non-fiction writer ( I hope that's the one where you write fantasy )
    And he also has been quoted before his 'discovery', to have said "the only way to make money, is to invent a religion".. Bit typical when his religion requires thousands of dollars to 'learn' the high levels...
    Religion is stupid.
     
  21. ivy
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    ivy Member

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    I have to disagree with your first sentence, Cogito: I think the greatest part of humanity is self-willed, determined to do things its own way, rather than giving any consideration at all to a higher power.

    To me, there is an important difference between abdicating responsibility and submitting to the will of someone you believe to be wiser. If there is a higher power, it stands to reason that It has the right to dictate how we live. Otherwise, it's not a higher power: it's just a...lateral power.

    Isn't it a heavy responsibility to consider a higher power's will, and to submit to it, regardless of what you'd prefer to do? To me, that kind of thoughtful living is very different from abdicating responsibility to a higher power.

    Just to be clear, I see a real difference between inner faith that guides a person's life, and a formal system of rules that can be exploited to whatever ends are convenient, though both could be called "religion." What you've described happens with the latter, in which case, I end up agreeing with your second sentence wholeheartedly.
     
  22. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    I like the quote from Kingdom of Heaven. "I've seen more men kill in the name of religion than anything else. There is a difference between being holy and being religious."
     
  23. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    My point really was in the first sentence though. It is easier to just shrug and say "it's God's will," than to take on the problem head on and trust in your own strength.

    That is the side of religion I find most intrinsically harmful.
     
  24. Torana
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    Torana Contributing Member Contributor

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    Why would that be scary at all? Death is nothing to fear. It happens to everyone and everything...

    As for Religion...I don't believe but I don't exactly not believe. Either way you look at it human kind makes a lot of mistakes and we look for an easy escape route. A lot use religion as an escape route.
     
  25. Night Haunter
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    Night Haunter Banned

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    What if we abolished religion what would happen then if we denounced all religion every different one.
     

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