?

Did the Principal make a fair decision?

Poll closed Apr 1, 2008.
  1. Yes

    2 vote(s)
    14.3%
  2. No

    12 vote(s)
    85.7%
  1. Bluemouth
    Offline

    Bluemouth Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Messages:
    976
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia

    School Suspension

    Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Bluemouth, Mar 28, 2008.

    My friend's brother, Jack, attends the school I graduated from, and the other day I heard he was externally suspended for a couple of days, which is the step below expulsion and goes on his record for the future. I was further amazed at the reason for his suspension, though. What do you think?

    Jack was standing around with his friends when a teacher walked over and told them to pick up some of the rubbish that was lying around. The friends did this. The teacher told Jack, however, to pick up a couple of grapes that were sitting nearby. Jack refused, the reason being he didn't know where the grapes had been, so why should he put his health at risk? The teacher told him again to pick up the grapes and put them in the bin. Jack, again, refused.

    He was then told to follow the teacher to the Focus Room (a detention-room kind of thing). Jack said: "No, I haven't done anything wrong." The teacher walked off, expecting Jack to follow, but he didn't. The process repeated itself about 3 times. Then the teacher returned and said he was going to get the Principal. About five minutes later the Principal comes round demanding where Jack is and takes him off to his office. Jack was then told he was facing external suspension, wasn't given a chance to have his say, and the Principal signed a form that can't be undone and so goes on his permanent academic record. If anything I think it was an abuse of power by the teacher. Why should the student pick up dirty rubbish while the teacher doesn't? And why should someone be suspended for something so petty?

    Personally, if I look at the recent problems the school has had (and it's an affluent school, don't get me wrong), including a guy getting a stick lodged in his eye and going blind, and another kid being tackled to the ground, resulting in eye surgery where his face was pulled down, and permanent scarring through his hair - it's obvious that the Principal is on edge to discipline. But he was out of line. A call by Jack's dad only received a pompous response from the Principal, and now the family might make a serious complaint to the Education Board and Superintendent so that they will investigate the situation. I'd back their decision, because that minor event could've been easily dealt with much, much better. I mean, if that's the standard discipline, then it's starting to sound like a concentration camp.

    Thoughts?
     
  2. lordofhats
    Offline

    lordofhats Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,023
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    The Hat Cave
    Wait wait wait wait

    wait

    wait





    wait

    The students were cleaning up the rubbish? Firs off, where are the Janitors and how much are they paid?

    Note: jacks excuse is rediculous. It would have been far easier and less troublesom to grab a tissue and pick them up, which he should have done. But I agree the teacher and principle went way to far.

    I say again, where are this schools janitors and how do I get a job? I'm guessing they get paid for sitting on their butts?
     
  3. Bluemouth
    Offline

    Bluemouth Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Messages:
    976
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    The janitors don't clean up the "yard", as in ovals. They just do the classrooms.

    You're right about students "overpowering" the teachers these days. Many of them are too soft. But there are ways of being reasonable with students to get them to follow an instruction. Ordering a student to pick up something is rarely going to work, particularly if the individual is strong-minded ... or just strong. :p
     
  4. lordofhats
    Offline

    lordofhats Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,023
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    The Hat Cave
    No grounds keepers?

    You know, red hair, scottish accent, really mean and cranky all the time... named Willie?
     
  5. Torana
    Offline

    Torana Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    9,659
    Likes Received:
    128
    lol lordofhats! :p

    I think the punishment was a tad extreme, but the fact of the matter is, he failed to listen to an authoritive figure and argued the point. Thus the results were harsher than they would of been.
     
  6. Bluemouth
    Offline

    Bluemouth Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Messages:
    976
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    Funnily enough one of the grounds keepers is Scottish, but I don't know if they pick up the rubbish. They clean the bins and mow the grass. But that's as much as I know. :cool:
     
  7. ValianceInEnd
    Offline

    ValianceInEnd Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,670
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    Phoenix, Arizona.
    Bassically the way it is in a nutshell.
     
  8. Charisma
    Offline

    Charisma Transposon Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    Messages:
    2,704
    Likes Received:
    142
    Location:
    Lahore, Pakistan
    I agree with Torana. A very harsh punishment, but I wouldn't be too sympathetic. Sorry about Jack though.
     
  9. Kit
    Offline

    Kit Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2007
    Messages:
    2,001
    Likes Received:
    15
    Location:
    Nottinghamshire
    I don't think it was fair to be made to pick up the grapes if he didn't put them there, you never really see the teachers do it, but they always make the students.

    Its unfair that its going to stick on his record like that though.
     
  10. SeaBreeze
    Offline

    SeaBreeze Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2006
    Messages:
    1,195
    Likes Received:
    17
    Location:
    At the bar
    Hmm... He could of been the usual smart ass teen (sorry, but there are a few in our town at highschool age) that could of gotten the teachers back up but to take it as far as they did is a bit unfair. I mean, couldn't they have given him a warning? They should of let him explain his reasons but I probably would of just given him detention or something. Or a blue slip (going by my school! :p) But yeah, depends on how this kid said it. I would probably add to the poll if it asks if the principal was too strict. Or something like that!
     
  11. adamant
    Offline

    adamant Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2006
    Messages:
    1,087
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    The Comatorium
    I would have done the same thing. If he didn't put them there, why the hell should he pick them up? The teachers may be authoritative figures (in the classroom), but they are not in strict control over any other person.

    Besides, the grapes are biodegradable.
     
  12. Torana
    Offline

    Torana Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    9,659
    Likes Received:
    128
    Problem is when you are on school property you are under the control of the teachers and administration department basically. If you are going to argue with an authoritive figure you have to expect to get a sever punishment.

    If you winge, complain, argue, they are going to get harsher and harsher on you till you learn your place in the food chain. It's as simple as that. A student is at the bottom of the food chain.
     
  13. Cogito
    Offline

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    May 19, 2007
    Messages:
    35,935
    Likes Received:
    2,043
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Yes, but it really IS an abuse of power. The parents could probably file a formal complaint with the School Board and/or the Board of Selectmen (or the equivalent there).

    Students are responsible for following the reasonable directions of school staff, but whether it is reasonable for the teacher to demand a student clean up a mess that (presumably) was not his is questionable, especially if the teacher himself is equipped with two good hands.
     
  14. TWErvin2
    Offline

    TWErvin2 Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2006
    Messages:
    2,528
    Likes Received:
    561
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    There are usually two sides to every story. One side was presented, which makes it difficult to properly answer the question without knowing the other.

    Terry
     
  15. Cogito
    Offline

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    May 19, 2007
    Messages:
    35,935
    Likes Received:
    2,043
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Very true. Any vote/opinion applies only the presented scenario, and not necessarily to the incident it was modelled upon.
     
  16. Bluemouth
    Offline

    Bluemouth Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Messages:
    976
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    True. But I know both of the other individuals involved in the situation and their responses don't surprise me at all.
     
  17. TWErvin2
    Offline

    TWErvin2 Contributing Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2006
    Messages:
    2,528
    Likes Received:
    561
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    Bluemouth,
    If the result to such a situation was obvious to you (based as you indicated on the individuals involved as to its likely outcome) and not knowing how this will end up being resolved--if it will go any further--a lesson that Jack should come away with from this, if nothing else, is to learn to pick one's battles. Sadly, fair or not, life is like that sometimes.

    Terry
     
  18. Frost
    Offline

    Frost Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2006
    Messages:
    670
    Likes Received:
    20
    Location:
    Australia
    Yeah, he got a bit fired up over something very minor. If the teacher had told him to do something that could really put his health at risk like pick up a used tissue or something, i would then be inclined to refuse, unless he/she gave me something to pick it up with. But I think personally that he brought it on himself, even though it was harsher than need be.
     
  19. soujiroseta
    Offline

    soujiroseta Senior Member Contributor

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2008
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    26
    Location:
    Harare, Zimbabwe
    my opinion is that this guy failed to listen to an adult and compromised their authority around others. in a way i dont blame the teacher for going to the principle but the end decision was harsh. you parents ask you why'd you get suspended and you answer for not picking up rotting grapes. kinda weird and unjustified if you ask me.
     
  20. SeaBreeze
    Offline

    SeaBreeze Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2006
    Messages:
    1,195
    Likes Received:
    17
    Location:
    At the bar
    The decision was way over the top. I would of settled for giving him detention or asked him nicely or suggested something he could pick the grapes up with. I dunno. yes, he should of listened to the teacher but the teacher should of given him at least a (clean) tissue to pick the grapes up with. Threatening with expulsion- well, I would of taken my kid out of the school if it were possible.
     
  21. Neha
    Offline

    Neha Beyond Infinity. Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,060
    Likes Received:
    37
    Location:
    India
    lol....and just ause he wouldn't pik up some grapes? And why didn't he pick the grapes upp? He would have a fit if he cam to our class. We're forced to pick our own mess, even though the sweeping ladies come twice a day. But still stupid reason for suspension. At least he didn't get expelled.........I came real close to getting expelled once..All because I wrote "I have a great ass" and stuck it behind a girl. I thought the ass part meant donkey!! I'd heard my brother's girlfriend saying it once.........so I agreed when some girls dared me too...!!The Princi wouldn't even hear me!! Luckily our classteacher asked me what I'd meant and I told her I though it meant I have a great Donkey........she sorted it out.......though she laughed real hard when I told her that!!
     
  22. Neha
    Offline

    Neha Beyond Infinity. Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,060
    Likes Received:
    37
    Location:
    India
    oh, my God, sleeplessnss is taking it''s toll, did I just say that?? :0
     

Share This Page