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  1. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    Ugandan President Signs Former "Kill the Gays Bill"...

    Discussion in 'Debate Room' started by JJ_Maxx, Feb 14, 2014.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/officials-ugandas-leader-to-sign-anti-gay-bill-that-includes-life-imprisonment/

    Everyone thought that the global pressure would cause President Yoweri Museveni to reject the bill but today Museveni promised to sign the bill after he read a report he had received from Ugandan "medical experts" saying "homosexuality is not genetic but a social behavior."

    When the bill was first introduced in 2009 it was called the 'Kill the Gays Bill' because it punished certain acts of homosexuality with execution. The death penalty provision was removed following international outrage, but the current bill still calls for life imprisonment for gay sex involving HIV-positive individuals, acts with minors and the disabled, and for repeated 'offenses' involving consenting adults.

    A person who "conducts a marriage ceremony" for a same-sex couple faces seven years behind bars under the bill, and it also criminalizes failure to report homosexual acts to authorities, and calls for five-year prison terms for medical professionals who treat gays, landlords who rent them property and even individuals suspected of being gay.

    "Promoting" homosexuality is also a crime under the bill, an 'offense' which reportedly covers acts as innocuous as providing HIV counseling.

    I wonder how the rest of the world will react to this news, if at all. Sanctions, maybe?
     
  2. Thomas Kitchen
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    Thomas Kitchen Proofreader in the Making Contributor

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    Now I'm a Christian, and I believe homosexuality is wrong, but it shouldn't be treated as a crime - at least the world shouldn't treat it as one, and although Christians would call it a sin, it is not a crime as such. I really hope they retain their rights.
     
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  3. Duchess-Yukine-Suoh
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    What. The. Hell.

    People are insane......

    The majority of HIV sufferers are straight females, idiots.

    And persecuting people is wrong no matter how you look at it.
     
  4. thirdwind
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    thirdwind Contributing Member Contest Administrator Reviewer Contributor

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    The Ugandan President and anyone who agrees with him are idiots.
     
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  5. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    You sure about that?

    According to the CDC, in the US:

    Gay and bisexual men account for most new infections among African Americans; young gay and bisexual men aged 13 to 24 are the most affected of this group.​
     
  6. chicagoliz
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    This bill has been around for a while, and it is of course, disturbing. But what's really disturbing is that a lot of the genesis and support of this bill actually comes from some virulent far-Right Christian groups based in the U.S. These are, ironically enough, some of the same folks who now enthusiastically support Putin, for his anti-Gay stance, and actually send support abroad for all kinds of anti-gay measures.
     
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  7. JJ_Maxx
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    Funny, I don't remember Jesus trying to imprison the tax collectors and the adulterers. I treat these so-called 'Christian' groups the same as the WBC and the majority of Christians agree with me. I don't believe they have a doctrinal leg to stand on. As Thomas Kitchen said, there's a large difference between believing homosexuality is immoral and criminalizing or punishing people for it.
     
  8. JJ_Maxx
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    If the US gives any money to Uganda, shut it off as soon as he signs it. Same thing with all other nations in the UN. Make an example out of them.
     
  9. GingerCoffee
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  10. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    Problem is, the U.S. does send aid to Uganda, the majority of which goes to things like health and education. So if you cut all that off over an issue like this you're not really impacting the people at the top, like the President, but hurting a lot of people who need the aid.
     
  11. GingerCoffee
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  12. JJ_Maxx
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    Yeah that's always the difficult trade-off with sanctions. You want to make the country cease its bad actions, but you don't want to hurt the innocent people. Technically, though, maybe the people will rise up and put pressure on the government?

    @GingerCoffee - This thread has been quite civil with both Christians and non-Christians denouncing this. WHy am I not surprised you would take this opportunity to spout your partisan anti-religious agenda? Seriously, get a grip.
     
  13. JJ_Maxx
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    Once again proving you know nothing about what the Bible says.
     
  14. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    I don't know enough about Uganda to know the answer to this. Though Obama did send troops over there in 2011, I think, to track down some rebel leader.
     
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  15. JJ_Maxx
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    It looks like we still send about 20 million dollars there a year, although I'm not sure where it goes. :(
     
  16. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    Given that the President (who is a dictator) in Uganda is so bad, I wonder why we sent troops over to help him crack down on some rebel leader? Maybe the rebel guy is even worse. I seem to recall him being accused of some massacres.
     
  17. GingerCoffee
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    This is a bit of dead horse beating on top of the gay issue but it's related.

    We had some impact with the AIDS fund. Before all this meddling, Uganda had one of the most successful condom campaigns against HIV in Africa. Bush's maneuvering with the abstinence only crowd saw that success drop precipitously. It has since regained some ground.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/aug/30/usa.aids
    Bush made an attempt to correct the damage and in the end I don't think he was all evil, just part evil. ;)
    http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/rough/2007/07/uganda_the_cond.html

    This was all tied to the C_Street Evangelical influence on both our government and Uganda's.


    Edited, correction, wasn't a direct reply to @Steerpike's post.
     
  18. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    Africa seems to be one thing Bush ultimately did right. You even had liberals in the U.S. and Europe commending him for Africa. I remember when Bob Geldof made these comments: http://vitalsignsblog.blogspot.com/2008/02/bob-geldof-george-w-bush-has-done-more.html

    I think the health and education aid is needed. I'm not thrilled that we send military aid to help keep the dictator there in power, but if the alternative is even worse then I can at least understand it.
     
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  19. JJ_Maxx
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    @GingerCoffee wishes to turn this thread into yet another flame war of Christians/conservatives but I am proud of everyone else refusing the bait and being united together in condemnation of these actions. :)
     
  20. GingerCoffee
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    Seriously, open your eyes. This action is a direct result of the Evangelical Global Mission. Look it up, read the links I posted and don't expect me to go along with the denial you prefer to maintain.

    We aren't talking a vague kind of, sort of, they read the same Bible. This is the result of in-person concentrated Evangelical involvement in the country.
     
  21. GingerCoffee
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    What do you think is the cause/motivation for Uganda moving in this direction? When do you think it started?
     
  22. JJ_Maxx
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    Wrong again. This is the result of a radical group spewing their hatred under the guise of Christianity. Any attempt by you or anyone else to paint over all of Christianity with this horrible brush should be thoroughly discarded.
     
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  23. GingerCoffee
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    I agree. In the long run Bush repaired some of the damage and really seemed to care about the HIV Fund doing more than just paying off US manufacturers and pleasing his political base.

    Follow the lobbyists and you'll find why we support this particular government.

    When too much heat was generated by the original law that included the death penalty for gays, The Family in the C Street House was embarrassed by it. The death penalty law was withdrawn. Clearly we have direct pressure on this government.

    It's been under the radar for a couple years, but the beliefs and some of the hate generated attacks on gays in Uganda have continued. Looks like the people in power are reviving the hate.
     
  24. GingerCoffee
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    I'd love to see your evidence.

    As for all Christians, I've never said any such thing.

    Right wing Evangelicals are by no means a tiny faction. And it's not even all the Evangelicals. There was a split within their own community over protecting the environment with leaders like Jerry Falwell and John Hagee claiming humans were incapable of damaging the God-created Earth and other leaders interpreting the Bible to have given responsibility to people to care for the Earth.

    I would think you'd know more about the Evangelical movement. Yet you don't seem to.
     
  25. Duchess-Yukine-Suoh
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    New cases are one thing, but heterosexual females account for most of the total cases.
     
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