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  1. King Arthur
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    King Arthur Banned

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    Would you kill 4 people to save 6 people?

    Discussion in 'Debate Room' started by King Arthur, Jun 21, 2016.

    You're with a group of ten people. Do you let them all die, or kill four in order to save the other six?
     
  2. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    No, you don't kill four.

    Based on the way this conversation is likely to go, it should be in the debate room.
     
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  3. I.A. By the Barn
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    I.A. By the Barn A very lost time traveller Contributor

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    It depend who all the people are, what's going to kill them and what's going on in the world for me.
     
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  4. TopherT
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    TopherT Member

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    I'd kill all ten.
     
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  5. jannert
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    jannert Contributing Member Supporter Contributor

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    I reckon he's just engaging with the prompt. :twisted:
     
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  6. ChaosReigns
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    ChaosReigns Be Still and Know Contributor

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    It depends on the situation really, and as this situation has not been made clear, them I cannot say...
     
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  7. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    Ah, you may be right.
     
  8. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    That also turns on what you consider "necessary." In general, killing the four would be immoral. You could come up with a hypothetical that allows for it, probably. What if they consent?
     
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  9. Oscar Leigh
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    Oscar Leigh Contributing Member

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    As a pacifist, I'd want to avoid killing anyone. And what I would do if I felt the situation warranted it enough to overrule that, it would depend as to who deserves it most and who these people are in general. (E.g children get preference because they haven't had time to live) Also I'd be lying if I said personal relationships would mean nothing in the circumstance. If the four are my family the six are probably going to have to accept their fate. It would be ideal to save everyone, but it wouldn't be a very human thing to sacrifice those I love.
     
  10. Tenderiser
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    Tenderiser Not a man Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    Apparently this makes me a heartless crow but I've never understood children getting priority like this. Nobody is worth more because of their age. An adult should not be sacrificed for a child just because the child is younger.

    We had to do one of these ridiculous scenarios at work once, in some training session. We were given particulars about 10 people trapped on a mountain and had to decide in what order to save them, knowing that whoever we left until later on might not be saved in time. There were no children on the list, but one of my colleagues was seriously arguing that the people who were parents should be saved first, because apparently breeding makes you more deserving of life. And another didn't outright say it, but clearly insinuated that the middle aged people should be left until last because of their age.

    It made me really angry.

    If anyone's curious, my order of saving was entirely based on how able they were to wait. The person with a chronic illness who needed their medication was first on my list. The younger, fitter, mentally stable people were last. Because I thought every one of them had an equal 'right' to life, and the only way to rank them was to give them all an equal chance of surviving.

    (Damn. If I was eligible to enter the contest I would totally do one about 10 people trapped on a mountain...)
     
  11. ChaosReigns
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    ChaosReigns Be Still and Know Contributor

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    I don't know why my changes didn't save, but i changed it to say that "I cannot say for sure as the situation hasn't been made clear as to why the four need to be killed"
     
  12. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    4 Hillary supporters and six Bernie supporters?
     
  13. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    I don't think that makes you heartless. Ironically enough it could be argued as being more heartfull. I mean you aren't saying you don't care about the children, you are saying you care about them as much as everyone else.

    But I feel like being a devil's advocate. I mean, I sort of read a book that talked about this and the author went into detail to explain why people have a gut reaction towards saving younger people. Which was genes! Like our personality and emotions is drawn by our genes. Genes are passed along by children, which is our genetic reason for wanting to have children. It is our genetic desire to save children because they are more suited to keep genes alive. Pure and simple math.

    But then again, I don't think in a pure sense your logic was exactly equal. You were counter balancing. Making the fitest people wait the longest because they had the best odds of surviving the longest. True equal would be random. But obviously no one in your little discussion there was probably gonna like that answer. So everyone was just adding the values they liked. Me personally? I would lean more towards saving the youth too, for a slightly different reason. If I were an older man trapped in a situation like that with a younger person. I wouldn't want to be saved until last. Because I would be furious to think a youngster lost his chance at life for my little time left. In that sense, I view life as "achieved potential" and the more of the potential I have achieved, the less potential I have, making my life innately less valuable.
     
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  14. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Rescue Ranger Mike jumped down the ladder from his chopper and landed into the snow. Ten women trapped on top of Mt. Everest and there was only room to save six. Covering his eyes with one hand and then looking through the gaps, he pointed toward the bunny blonde, the fox, the one with the gazelle legs, etc., etc.

    Frog, chicken, cow, and pig watched the disappearing helicopter with clenched fists and frozen tears.

    Back on the chopper, Rescue Ranger Mike was not doing too well. "I am overwhelmed with guilt," he told the blonde. " I do not think I will sleep at all tonight."
    "Who said we were letting you sleep tonight," asked the fox?
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2016
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  15. King Arthur
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    King Arthur Banned

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    Interesting how no one has seriously suggested letting all ten die. It's the option several people I know picked to avoid being guilty of manslaughter.
     
  16. GuardianWynn
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    GuardianWynn Contributing Member Contributor

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    Wait, as in they are part of the ten, so murder and suicide? LOL

    I mean, the issue is the devil is in the details.

    Which you didn't include. So, you are asking us about math. The math of is 6 greater than 4? Well. Yes(I hope that much is obvious). Then you are asking us if we could deal with the reprussions of the event. Which..... I dunno. All honestly, anyone that seriously answers this without being in that situation is lying. You can't really predict how you will react. It is like being punched in the face. Sometimes people shatter and fall apart and ruin away. Other times people hold firm and show they have iron for a will. But hell, anyone can guess how they would react. I have seen 300 pound body builders run away and an emotional wreck later. I have also seen a wimpy kid take five shots to the face without flinching. You just can't seriously predict it.

    This is made even more harder by not having the details. Is there situation I think I would assume I would be okay will killing 6? Yes. 6 friends? Yes. Is there situations where I would not be willing to kill 6 strangers. Yes.

    So, there is really no good insight I think anyone can get. Not sure which insight you are seeking though, so maybe you have already got what you wanted?
     
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  17. matwoolf
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    matwoolf Contributing Member Contributor

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    If it was mountaineers on Everest, definitely save the four sherpas, and leave the six gross, rich narcissist climbers alongside Greenboots, without oxygen, up at twenty thousand feet, probably leave them a telephone, heh heh. Mountaineers are one of my main prejudices, after kite-surfers. Also...I dunno, better go write a mountain story...

    ...and @1234s story was horrible, y'know, sometimes ugly people are a lot of fun, actually...and if you do choose attractive people to sleep with, how d'you think it looks from their perspective, your jowls and your belly heaving in, and then out of focus, your sweat drips all over the room. Generally that's what puts me off implementing the orgy lifestyle of my fantasies.
     
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  18. King Arthur
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    King Arthur Banned

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    So you're Sherpa Batman.
     
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  19. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    New scenario:

    @matwoolf and I are the two sole survivors of a desert island plane crash- none of the other eight made it. You only have enough room on your motor boat to rescue one of us. Also, Matwoolf ate one of the passengers. Which of us do you save?
     
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  20. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    Would @matwoolf regale me with prose and verse on the way back to the mainland?
     
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  21. 123456789
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    123456789 Contributing Member Contributor

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    If he does, his breath is going to smell like human flesh...
     
  22. Tenderiser
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    Tenderiser Not a man Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    Sorry, Numbers. Hope you can swim.

    :D
     
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  23. Steerpike
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    Steerpike Felis amatus Supporter Contributor

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    I'm sure as a gesture of humanity approaching, dare I say, saintliness consistent with my general character, I'd give you and matwoolf the boat and volunteer to wait for the next one.
     
  24. matwoolf
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    matwoolf Contributing Member Contributor

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    @Steerpike ♥♥
     
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  25. matwoolf
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    matwoolf Contributing Member Contributor

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    upload_2016-6-21_19-56-49.jpeg

    Matchu took a final bite from @123456789's cold corpse, and she turned finally, and she skipped through surf finally, toward the boat finally in her final getaway from Pokemon Throne Island...

    Cannibal Trousers, A Lady Memoir.
     
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