When I first joined, I also received an e-mail with links to the information, and another e-mail from Wreybies (spelling?) with a link to the starter PM. Really, it was very easy to find the information and none of it took long to read. I don't know how else you can improve this except perhaps do Jannert's suggestion. Maybe some people don't realize they're asking for critique? It takes a while to really settle in and get the hang of a new culture, and writing forums are, in a way, a new culture. I tried finding the post, but I think it was moved. Do you have a link? I'm curious now . . .
I think this is an important point. While some people straight out ask for a crit (they probably didn't read the PM at all), some just ask for ideas or help with solving a problem/continuing/etc. It might not be immediately apparent to everyone that posting part of a story counts as a request for critique regardless of your purpose of posting it. It's been removed.
If we wanted to be really hardnosed about it I suppose there could be a facility where a newbie couldn't post in any forum until they'd checked that'd they'd read and accepted the New Member's Guide. But something tells me we wouldn't want to be that hardnosed. I think?
On pbp rp boards it is (or was) pretty common to have a thread where newbies have to post to verify that they've read and understood the rules before they can access the rest of the forum. Sometimes there'd even be a hidden password in the rules somewhere (or a riddle and the answer or something cheesy like that) and they'd have to provide the answer. I was never a fan of it, but it's a possible solution? Once the admin saw they'd posted there properly, they'd be manually moved to a member group with full posting privileges, so it'd be more work for the staff.
No, we wouldn't. My suggestion wasn't to force people to read anything, it was to make the New Member's Guide easier to find and refer to, if need be, when questions arise. I know that, at some point after I'd joined and become a full-fledged member, I wanted to check what the New Members Guide said about number of posts required before starting a thread (I had forgotten.) And could I find the New Members Guide? Not without a hell of a lot of searching. I naturally chose Members as the place it was probably lurking. It wasn't. I eventually found it, under "Information" ...but that was a category that wasn't immediately obvious. Information about what? Because it was sandwiched in between Resources and Workshop, I assumed it had something to do with information about writing. I wasn't aware, at the time, that the mods always direct new members to the New Members Guide (with a link, I presume?) so that does make it easier for a new member to do the right thing. But I still think the New Members Guide is hidden deeper than it needs to be.
Following my post here: https://www.writingforums.org/threads/debate-room-not-showing-new-posts.150481/#post-1526419 I don't understand why some forums/sub-forums are listed on the forum index in such a small font that it's hard to find them. I've been here for some months and I've totally missed the existence of the Debate Room until the thread linked above. I do find very complicated to guess where things are. I've got used to it, but why is it so complicated? I have been in a lot of forums about many different subjects and this is definitely the most complicated I've come across. Why not simplifying it with major forums and sub-forums (and maybe more sub-forums under those), all of equal importance? For instance, why are Erotica Fantasy Science Fiction dangling in small fonts below all the other sub-forums in Creative Writing? Shouldn't they be under By the Genre? (And they are, but I don't understand why they should be shown in the index too in tiny font as if they were less important. It's confusing.) The same goes for Autobiography & Memoir / Essays in the Workshop. Etc. What I suggest is simplicity: COMMUNITY INTERACTION The Lounge Entertainment Debate Room New Member Introductions Role Play Book Discussion Writing Prompts SITE INFORMATION Announcements Support & Feedback Articles Etc. Simple and clear. I also think that "New posts" should allow more than six pages. I can't visit that often and I've lost track of many posts I wanted to comment later but meanwhile they don't show anymore on the six pages and I can't find them again. Good for the forum because it means it's very active, but posts may be slipping through the cracks. In short: simplicity more pages to "new posts" So far, that's what I've got. And a request: I like the font size of the posts. Please don't make it smaller. And thanks for the good work.
It is the point I'm trying to make. It's hard to find where things are in general, not just for new members. Most forum indexes present a more simple listing of main topics like I've shown above, with sub-forums nested in sub-forums for those who are interested in digging in. I'm not sure I'm making my point clear enough; I'm not very familiar with the terminology. So I'm linking an example of a forum that I think it's somewhat complex yet easy to navigate: http://www.walkingdeadforums.com/forum/ (However, @jannert and people who mentioned it, I don't think that's the problem with people not reading the rules. I got my PM and read it, and I also made an effort to read the main rules even before I joined. Some people, on the other hand, don't care about the rules. Unfortunately, I don't see that changing.)
The reason for us having those "small font sub-forums" is because we want to separate a subject (like e.g. debates) into a separate forum, but that forum still belongs within the scope of another forum (The Debate Room and Entertainment belong within The Lounge, and Erotica belongs in By The Genre). This is comparable with how that Walking Dead forum has Season sub-forums under the main forum "Episodes". While I wouldn't want to move these sub-forums out and have them as separate top-level forums I do agree that it would help if we clarified that they belong inside other forums (as has brought up in the first page of this thread).
On the top right of a thread are the options "watch thread," "previous thread," "next thread." If you click "watch thread" you'll receive alerts when a new post is made in that thread. You'll also be able to get to it from your profile under "watched threads." You can also temporarily save those threads to your favorites/bookmarks. Hope this helps!
Agreed. Yes, I have to start making a habit of clicking the "watch thread" feature, definitely! But I don't know how to do that other part, how to save threads in my favourites/bookmarks. Not wanting to be off topic from this thread, but how do I do that? I've looked all over the page for that feature and I can't find it.
Oh, sorry! You mean my browser's bookmarks, not a forum feature (right?)! If so, don't bother answering, I got it now. 52 minutes later, lol! Sorry about that.
Thank you for the suggestion. As is, New Members do see a "Rules" Tab that links directly to the Rules in our FAQ. Perhaps I could add a second tab that links to the New Member Guide, or a "New Members" tab with the Guide, Rules, and Workshop Overview. The latest version of Xenforo also offers a different kind of Notice System. Instead of only showing the notices at the top of the forum homepage, I can show notices in other areas of the site that are displayed at the bottom of the page like this: They can be colored/stylized. Perhaps one of these directing new members to the new members guide/rules, and one displayed to new members on the Writing Workshop page could help. Also open to renaming or restructuring the Information tab. This may be true, but highly niche sub-forums can be the lifeblood of a forum. If we have a really good Erotica section, self-publishing section, or sub-forum on whatever topic, that forum can be an area that truly specializes and provides information and expertise no where else on the internet does. We have Google Analytics for traffic analysis, and simple statistics on most popular threads and most popular forums over time, but not based on keyword or topic. That information may be derivable but I'm not sure how. Noted on revised descriptions. I appreciate the suggested breakdown on stages of writing, I've added that to my notes. As for Amazon, I'm not sure why the links are acting all funky. I see a general ad on one computer and a specific book banner on another. We are running a parser, I can try updating it to see if it improves the situation. This is automated and done for easy usability/fast embedding. We have a plugin that lets us embed like 200+ different websites and media types. I'm not a fan of it myself. It can be changed if that's the consensus. @Catrin Lewis - Thank you for chiming in. Your comments are particular interesting to me because I've struggled when trying to incorporate new (but useful) features or highlight existing functionality. In your experience, what has kept you from exploring the What's New tab or the Resource section? If the Resource section was popularized and used it could be a very valueable Resource for the community. But we've struggled me make people aware of it, let alone to create new resources. As for your specific example, "Writing Conventions" is intended to be exactly what you thought it was - the manuscript formatting resource is apparently a mis-categorized resource. "Cover Artists" as a resource category is a little more tricky, because it'd have to be heavily moderate, but essentially the only thing stopping it from being added is the demand for it and members willing to add and review particular cover artists. As of now, I think the most appropriate place to seek feedback on prospective cover art is the Collaboration forum (which it seems needs a new name). This has been mentioned before, I'll try investigated further. Thank you Cogito. I appreciate you chiming in. This is what I'm looking for and is the direction I intend to take the redesign when it happens. Focusing on the fundamentals of functionality and usability.
I'm not sure why you posted this as a rebuttal to my comment. I was saying more or less the same thing you've said here.
I just want to add that we should be careful with using "Feedback" or "Critique" in the title of non-workshop forums. Using these words (and potentially others) might very well cause new members to go and post their stories in the "Feedback"/"Critique Corner" forum instead of the workshop since the title makes it sound like that is where critiques should go.
