Dealing with ideas

Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Daniel, Jul 7, 2006.

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  1. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    In defense of Purple Prose...

    "Certain producers of plain prose have conned the reading public into believing that only in prose plain, humdrum or flat can you articulate the mind of inarticulate ordinary Joe. Even to begin to do that you need to be more articulate than Joe, or you might as well tape-record him and leave it at that. This minimalist vogue depends on the premise that only an almost invisible style can be sincere, honest, moving, sensitive and so forth, whereas prose that draws attention to itself by being revved up, ample, intense, incandescent or flamboyant turns its back on something almost holy--the human bond with ordinariness. . . .

    "It takes a certain amount of sass to speak up for prose that's rich, succulent and full of novelty. Purple is immoral, undemocratic and insincere; at best artsy, at worst the exterminating angel of depravity. So long as originality and lexical precision prevail, the sentient writer has a right to immerse himself or herself in phenomena and come up with as personal a version as can be. A writer who can't do purple is missing a trick. A writer who does purple all the time ought to have more tricks."
     
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  2. deadrats

    deadrats Contributor Contributor

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    Um... Writing for the sake of writing? That's not what poetry is anymore than any amateur writing. And that's not everyone's approach. And I imagine your statement is somewhat of an insult to those who take and write poetry seriously.
     
  3. Mink

    Mink Contributor Contributor

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    I think both are vital in writing. Without one the book often falls apart or leaves the reading wanting more. I read a book that had a great story line, but the writing was lackluster and on par with a ninth grader so the book was nearly ruined and I couldn't make myself by the second book even though I was intrigued by the developing story. On the reverse, I read a book that had beautiful sentence structure and word usage, but the story was bland so it was a chore to finish the book.

    I write in a more in-your-face style 90% of the time, but those are works where that suits and I still try to have decent sentence structure with occasionally fantastic word choice. The 10% I choose to write in a more flowery style to help the plot be pushed along and to create a certain atmosphere in a person's mind. Throughout both writing styles I try to have a well developed plot and to have well developed characters. I want readers to enjoy every portion of the story instead of one or the other.
     
  4. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    In terms of lighting a fire which is more important oxygen or fuel ...
     
  5. Rani99

    Rani99 Member

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    I was thinking about the right answer to this question and I came up with one, but with the same as everyone else. Sometimes there are great stories because of the interesting plotline, even though poorly written. And it's easier for me to read stories like that, which are written very simply because English is not my first language. And there are stories with no interesting plot line, but if an author has an amazing talent to write a story beautifully, that I read only because it sounds amazing and then I think how the English language is even more beautiful than I thought. But I can't read the whole book only because of a beautiful language, the story must engage. So my answer to this is that definitely, the plot is more important.
     
  6. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

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    Fuel ;)

    Chlorine Trifluoride is a better oxidizing agent than oxygen, and can burn things that oxygen can't :twisted:

    Back to the actual question, I've generally found that strong ideas written poorly hold my interest longer than good language that isn't about anything.
     
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  7. newjerseyrunner

    newjerseyrunner Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2022

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    I also prefer idea over language. Interesting language can be refreshing, but it gets old quickly. Songs and poetry are good for that kind of writing. For short works like that, the language is most important, I can name many amazing songs that are literally about nothing: Lucy In the Sky, Bohemnian Rhapsody... I just don’t think it holds up when going over five to ten minutes of focus though, brains like interesting things.

    Same reason people en mass tend to prefer pictures of things and often get confused by abstract art. As a painter, I enjoy studying the brushwork and the color bleeding, most don’t, so of course there is a group of people who really get off by whimsical language too.
     
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  8. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

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    I actually thought Bohemian Rhapsody was a fascinating combination of Albert Camus' The Stranger and Charlotte Perkins Gillman's The Yellow Wallpaper :)
     
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  9. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    I think you have to know the type of songs Freddie Mercury was writing at the time, and the few years preceding Bohemian Rhapsody to know where his head was at. Where Led Zeppelin was mining Tolkien for inspiration, Freddie was inspired by classical literature and Greek mythology. The March of the Black Queen, Seven Seas of Rhye, Nevermore, The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke, Ogre Battle, and finally Bohemian Rhapsody are all in the same vein... sort of.:)
     
  10. CAR0527

    CAR0527 Member

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  11. MikeyC

    MikeyC Active Member

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    Why is it I get the vast majority of my book ideas, from characters, to plot, anything - late at night?

    So, i have to wake myself up, write the damn idea down, then it takes me forever to get to sleep again. Mostly because i am then thinking about that idea, which spawns more ideas, and i have to write those down too.....

    I really like me sleep - arrrghhh!

    Rgds
     
  12. Commander Vimes

    Commander Vimes Member

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    I always tend to get mine when I'm at work unable to do any writing! But luckily I am usually at a computer and can jot the ideas down and email them to myself to look at later. Have you thought about taking your laptop with you to bed?
     
  13. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

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    I get a lot of good ideas when I'm in the shower. Also when driving.

    It feels like fate is out to get us, but I expect these are just times when we aren't distracted with anything else and our imaginations have time to roam a little bit. It's hard to get great new ideas when you're already busy thinking about five different things in your daily life.
     
  14. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Maybe try meditating during the day? It might get your brain to the same place.
     
  15. GlitterRain7

    GlitterRain7 Galaxy Girl Contributor

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    I feel like I'm more creative at night as well. Actually, that's usually when I write.

    Not sure if this could be a solution for you or not, but maybe take a smartphone with voice recording capabilities or a recorder to bed with you and just record the idea. That way you don't have to get up really or pick up a pencil.
     
  16. badgerjelly

    badgerjelly Contributor Contributor

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    Likely because your best ideas surface when your ego is at its weakest.

    What is that word for night time thinking/study? Lu ... lucan... lubr... ? It’s really annoying me!

    Got it! Lucubration.
     
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  17. izzybot

    izzybot (unspecified) Contributor

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    I've seriously considered buying a waterproof notebook and pen to keep in there. Not sure how my roommate would feel about that, though ...

    I know for me, writing started off as daydreaming, and as a kid I would always tell myself stories in bed to get to sleep. Eventually I just started writing those stories down and putting more work into them and such. I still end up thinking about plot stuff before sleep, but I've gotten pretty good at taking minimalistic notes that are just enough to jog the ol' memory come morning. I've also put effort into remembering and writing down dreams, which I think helps you sort of train your brain to focus on things like that while still being fuzzy from sleep. I dunno. Conjecture.
     
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  18. deadrats

    deadrats Contributor Contributor

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    I don't write ideas down or keep any sort of running list of projects other than what's in my head. Ideas are cheap and let's face it, we're all going to have more ideas than we could ever possibly write. I figure anything worth remember will stick around. The things I forget... Not too worried. There are always more and new ideas coming. When it's time to write, I trust the good ones will be there.
     
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  19. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

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    You may find it different with novels... they're a bigger project and there's a lot of figuring out "how am I going to make X fit with Y without totally destroying the credibility of Z?"

    If I figure out a solution to a problem of that sort, I absolutely want to be SURE I remember it!
     
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  20. Homer Potvin

    Homer Potvin A tombstone hand and a graveyard mind Staff Supporter Contributor

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    Is alcohol involved?
     
  21. MikeyC

    MikeyC Active Member

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    Haha, only G&T's at the weekend. ;-)
     
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  22. deadrats

    deadrats Contributor Contributor

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    Yeah, I was thinking of my novel. Isn't everyone who is writing a novel always thinking of their novel? I've jotted down notes only to forget about them until I realize I didn't need them anyway. All I'm saying is that we are always going to have more ideas than we need or could possibly use. My first test for new ideas is whether or not I remember them.

    Edit to add: I think people can have just as many short story ideas. And you can write more of them quicker. But, still, too many ideas is too many ideas regardless of the form.
     
  23. OurJud

    OurJud Contributor Contributor

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    The answer is quite simple. It's because you're not trying to think of ideas etc, and your mind is free to wander without the constraints and pressure of forcing an idea on yourself.

    I would wager the vast majority of all creative ideas happen when the person isn't looking for them.
     
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  24. flawed personality

    flawed personality Contributor Contributor

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    For me, it's not just writing. Design ideas crop up as well, and that really is a pain, because that needs to be drawn out, rather than just written. For written ideas, I keep my phone to hand, and type them in and save them as draft text messages. I currently have 40+ on my phone atm. Some are story ideas, some is stuff to look up later, and a few are lyrics from songs that I hear that pique my interest. I also have a list of character names. :rolleyes:
     
  25. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

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    Same with the witty comebacks to conversations you had during the day, or even the day before. They don't come at the right time (of COURSE) and they don't come while you're still busy/agitated. They come when you've found some peace--and when it's TOTALLY too late.
     
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