How to get your reader connected with your MC?

Discussion in 'Character Development' started by 33percent, Aug 17, 2018.

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  1. deadrats

    deadrats Contributor Contributor

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    It's not a matter of finding God if there is no God. I think it's wrong and a little disrespectful to think people who don't believe in God just don't know better. You could be just as wrong as you think an atheist might be.
     
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  2. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I've seen that slogan many times, but I really see no reason to think that it's accurate.

    But he's a fictional character. Naturally he would behave in accordance with your expectations.

    You seem to be assuming that everyone believes in God, but some just choose not to worship him. Do you understand that there are people who do not believe that there is a God--not the tiniest whisper of a belief?
     
  3. exweedfarmer

    exweedfarmer Banned Contributor

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    I think that your MC has to be in want of some basic human need which circumstance denies him. Such as, my MC is looking for love in all the wrong places and he cannot find it because he's dead most of the time. Maybe people can't sympathize with the dead part, but they can with the looking for love part.
     
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  4. 33percent

    33percent Active Member

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    I don't want this to be a drawn out religious thread. I was only merely suggesting to live on the wild side by jumping out of an airplane. No, not everyone believes in God. Just life/death situations do give people a different perspective on their life or internal beliefs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2018
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  5. Lemie

    Lemie Contributor Contributor

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    Nope. Sorry. Just nope.

    I was in the middle of a longer post, but no good would come out of it. So I'll just go for a nope and bow out of this thread.

    I'll say though that being an atheist is not about feeling safe or comfortable, it's about knowing there is no "higher power" so you learn to deal with your own shit, even if that dealing is accepting your probable death.
     
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  6. Oscar Leigh

    Oscar Leigh Contributor Contributor

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  7. matwoolf

    matwoolf Banned Contributor

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    I'd endeavour to not start with the character 'waking up' opener. I suppose your script is different but it is one of the - primary pillars of great prat-folly - a very major running joke - the earnest CW pen squeezes out his inspirational prose-poetrie a chapter 1

    The
    dawn light burst through the slats of the Venetian blinds nnng tracing a golden arc over the silhouette of Natalia hump under her sheet yes lovely ehmm she arose, tip-toed through the dust particles suspended in the air, and with her tendrils divine yes she pulled on the drawsting of the Venetian curtain mm. What a lovely, lovely crap I am going to crap, she giggled seductively


    ...

    But I don't see why a character can't be religious? That seems terribly bigoted to say 'I won't read a religious character, not for me.' What about a story set in the 1580s? A case of the 'mes' I feel, the young people and the me sickness is pandemic, very sad. Although, yeah I'd of course agree if it was one of those tracts with the Jehova's Witness type cover, entitled Aaron's Choice:

    'Come on Aaron, try some of this caffeinated soda pop, I'm sure it won't kill you,' cried the ruffians from their dragster. Aaron adjusted his bow tie and continued the righteous path on the footpath toward Bible morning school.'

    I might write that, actually.

    ...

    With the piece I was writing yesterday I saw as the prose became more tangible and the imagery easier to pick up, the boy in the story almost 'took on a life of his own,' levitated from the page and finally became likeable. I believe it's simply a stage in draft. I could view the story objectively until the point he devours his house pet. But up until that point he was theirs, or they, the readers - were in my palm of my hand with their maleable [sp?] eyes mm

    SO, do I stick with gross version - which is critical to original vision, or write something more pleasing?
     
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  8. Oscar Leigh

    Oscar Leigh Contributor Contributor

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    Mate, you're hilarious. Just thought I'd let you know.
     
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  9. Magus

    Magus Banned

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    Athiests are brave until they face the barrel of a gun. I used to be a non believer, I was so sure that this world was nothing but random chance, and that God? Heh, well he was as real as a daydream of my crush and me doing the funky dance. That was until I faced that barrel and I could do nothing but beg and plead and...believe.

    Saturday, December 31st, 2016

    There I was home alone. The wife and kids had set off on one final journey with the inlaws before they packed up and went back down to the states. Here in Canada we have the benefit of the harsh climate making their visits much shorter. I had stuffed myself on fridays leftovers since we held off Christmas dinner until my Brother Jacob could fly out from the west coast where he was spending time with his dog who he has to get put down. Terrible stuff. Anyways there I was, a bloated non believer, finishing off my mother in laws cheezy Macdoogle casserole. I don't know what the hell I was thinking, I could barely stay on my feet as it was and my stomach was protruding farther then it had ever had before. I could feel the gasses inside me swirling, blowing wild like before a winter storm in Thunder Bay.

    I had just finished the last bite when the storm reached the shore and I had to unleash its fury on the poor folk on the mainland. So up I went to the second floor bathroom, my sanctuary. I had just installed a heated seat, and nice bathroom mat which felt so soft and silky between my feet as I unleashed. Everything was set for a perfect exodus, the extra soft Royale rolls I had bought were stocked in the dispenser, the seat was warming nicely and my feet were in heaven. I pushed, and nothing came. Not a breeze, exited the canal. I pushed again and was met with the most terrible pain. The worst pain I had ever had the unfortunate fate of feeling. A woman says giving birth is painful, but I tell you it was nothing I'm sure to what I felt that day. I flailed my limbs, bending back and forth, slaming my fists against the wall in pure agony. A thought crossed my mind that sent the fear of God into me.

    "I'm going to die on the toilet, my son, my wife is going to see me like this when they come home"

    I began to weep, I didn't care about my manhood anymore. I cried so hard between pushes and the pain that came with them that I must have looked like a child who didn't get any presents on Christmas day. This went on for a good 20 minutes before I gave in to my fate. I clasped my hands together and I prayed. Allah, Jesus, Mohammed, Mary, I didn't know who the hell I was talking to and I didn't care. I just needed that divine creator to hear me and grant me relief. I'll never forget that prayer, and I say it daily.

    "Lord above grant me mercy,this pain is for no man to endure. I beg of you Lord, let this gas pass through. Open my anus and let it go, please Lord! I beg of you! Let it! THROUUGGHHHH"

    As I belted out the final verse a whirlwind lifted me a inch off that heated seat, and as the Lords gravity sent me back down with a thud, the turkey and the casserole came shooting out in a bile of evil spewing energy. I must of been out for half an hour, and when I came back to the toilet was empty, my ass was clean and my stomach has receeded back to its normal size. I looked up to the sky and I thanked God for his aid and promised never again to doubt his divine grace.

    When you face down that loaded gun, you come knocking and tell me you didn't pray. N'if you didn't well I won't ever here about it cuz I reckon you'd be dead. Only way you make it out is with a little help, the Lords always got the back of the faithful.
     
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  10. 33percent

    33percent Active Member

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    I didn't bring up religion nor wanted the thread go off topic. I guess I went overboard on my experience of life/death. So, religion is bad juju and should be avoided at all cost? The point I was trying to make, experiencing a serious life/death situation may change someone's belief. We live in complacent lifestyles that we don't think nothing will bad happen to us. Once you're in that hopeless situation it may change how you believe or find a "higher power".
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2018
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  11. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I feel like you are truly unable to understand that some people DON’T BELIEVE in a God.

    I can say, “You don’t think you believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster now, but just wait until times get hard! You may live your complacent lifestyle now, but when it comes down to it, you’ll be running for the colander!”

    But...you don’t believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Why would you believe in him if you’re in danger? Surely when you’re in danger you’ll go to the sources of help that you do believe in.

    People who don’t believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster don’t believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster. They just don’t.

    People who don’t believe in God don’t believe in God. They just don’t.

    Are you unable to parse that?

    Edited to add another example: When in trouble, I’d love to believe in Batman, or Superman, or any number of helpful figures. I don’t disbelieve in Batman because I don’t think I’ll ever be in trouble. I disbelieve because he doesn’t exist.

    My father, when he was in financial trouble, believed he was going to win the Publisher’s Clearing House. Because he needed a belief. But he still didn’t win.
     
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  12. 33percent

    33percent Active Member

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    My cousin is an atheist. I have ones in my own family who don't believe in God. I don't think you're understanding my point. I was merely suggesting people who don't believe in God may change their view on a "higher power" under severe circumstances. If not so be it.
     
  13. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    They might change their view on Batman, too. Anybody might believe anything.
     
  14. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Returning to add that your primary error in logic is the premise that people don’t believe in God because they don’t believe that anything bad will happen to them.

    Is that why you don’t believe in Batman? If you ran into an issue where Batman would save the day, would that make you believe in him?

    No, right?

    What doesn’t exist, doesn’t exist. It doesn’t come into existence because you need it.

    My lack of belief in Batman doesn’t reflect an arrogant confidence that nothing will ever happen to me. Neither does yours.
     
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  15. 33percent

    33percent Active Member

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    Well, the error in your PoV. I see Batman is not a God nor a "higher power" but only a mortal. Serious question, have you been in a life/death situation? in a hopelessness situation? It's easier to write about how flawed or error my logic is. When you haven't experienced such a serious circumstance yourself. There have been plenty of times atheist put in a death ground situation and come out of it believing in God the next. That's how the Holy Roman Empire became, the Emperor had a dream with Jesus and bam turned Rome over its head with Christianity.
     
  16. Oscar Leigh

    Oscar Leigh Contributor Contributor

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    Do you want to derail this thread?
     
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  17. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    All right, all right, leaving the religious stuff behind:

    I think that you have to be able to identify with the character, but at a higher level than simple hunger, discomfort, fear.

    In Game of Thrones, after Arya escaped from the castle her mere hunger was theoretically something we could identify with, but when it was expressed in killing pigeons it was a shrug. On the other hand, her desire for a lemon pastry, so strong that she nearly risked her freedom and her life, was much stronger. That lemon pastry represented everything she had so recently lost—all the luxuries and safety and comfort of a well-loved childhood.

    Hunger Games doesn’t work for me, but all the same I can see the value of complicating Katniss’s motivation. If she’d been chosen, her motivation would be mere survival. But saving her sister from harm gave us that higher level, but still one that we could identify with.
     
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  18. 33percent

    33percent Active Member

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    My father always told me never speak of personal politics and religion in a public place or forum. I now understand why. I will stop as well. Please, excuse my bad grammar in the last reply. I was in a hurry to my theater play.

    Interesting observation, I am trying to remember what scene it was regarding the pastry in GoT. I guess, as, for my MC, everything has been stripped like freedom, safety, comfort. I want to push my MC to the breaking point that he does have no choice but to survive. I do have little things like the Lemon Pastry to represent what he did have in his past life and now it's all gone. Taking everything for granted. Just the connection of having the reader not so like the character but care for the MC.

    As for hunger games, I wasn't really feeling the caring factor for Katniss besides surviving in the games. I guess the action and surviving kept me interested in the book/movie. The triangle relationship of her choosing between two guys was more an of a trope to me.
     
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  19. Carriage Return

    Carriage Return Member

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    Last edited: Dec 31, 2018
  20. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    No, but unless you want to create a debate room thread, I'll leave it at that.
     
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  21. Carriage Return

    Carriage Return Member

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    Last edited: Dec 31, 2018
  22. EBohio

    EBohio Banned

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    How do you connect with a protagonist? Empathy. The protagonist must give us a reason to pull for him/her.
     
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  23. Oscar Leigh

    Oscar Leigh Contributor Contributor

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    I think relationships and ordinary moments are important for MC empathy. The interest and stakes of a character are more relatable, as well as their inherent involving-ness, if the character actually has relationships and ordinary moments that make them feel like a human being rather than just a plot piece, so you can "place yourself in their shoes" as they say.
     
  24. Bone2pick

    Bone2pick Conspicuously Conventional Contributor

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    I often hear folks say that expression when advising how to create and portray a protagonist. And in some stories that's true for me. I could easily relate to Holden Caulfield in The Catcher in the Rye; and I love that character and book. But there are other protagonists—for instance, Alex in A Clockwork Orange—that I couldn't relate to at all, but who I were/was deeply invested in all the same.

    Investment is necessary; I wouldn't argue otherwise. But the way I see it, relatability is merely one path to investment.
     
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  25. DK3654

    DK3654 Almost a Productive Member of Society Contributor

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    I think what Oscar Leigh was trying to say was not really about relatability so much as the audience being able to understand the character, get a sense of how they think and why they are who they are, so that we can imagine being that person even if they are very different because we understand the differences. Villains tend to be harder to understand, not only because their villainous attributes are more incongruous to us, but because we usually don't get to know them in the same way we get to know the protagonists. Protagonists not only get the benefit of time devoted to them, they usually get it first (which predisposes us to them), and they get the story told from their side.
    That is, at least, how I would put it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2018
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