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  1. DPena

    DPena Member

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    Too much exposition?

    Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by DPena, Feb 15, 2019.

    I'm a novice writer, and I'm a little over 20,000 words into my book, which is a semi realistic sci-fi and while I haven't had a ton of story development yet at this point, I do feel like I'm laying down a lot of exposition, both in a narrative sense and through character's thoughts and conversations.

    I don't really even know what I'm asking, but I guess what I'm wondering is if it's better to just lay down all the exposition at the beginning and then move on, or to reveal little bits of info as they're relevant to the story, at which point it feels like I'm pausing to explain a situation every time something new arises.

    For example, right now in my story, it's winter in my post-apocalyptic setting, and I'm using a character's visit to the (decomissioned) restroom to introduce the sewer system, which will play a role in their escape at a later time. So this character's visit to the restroom turns into this multiple page explanation about the sewer system and why it is the way it is. Later in the book, it will be relevant information, but at this point in time my reader just might think i'm padding the word-count with useless info.

    Is this the kind of info that's just best left until it's needed?
     
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  2. Earp

    Earp Contributor Contributor

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    I'd say description should appear when it's needed, and not before. In your sewer example, I'd wait until the escape to describe the sewer, if for no other reason than that the reader might forget what it looks like.
     
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  3. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I find myself wondering if you will ever need that much detail about the sewer system.

    Example:

    "This is olive oil. It's made from a bitter fruit that grows on what's called an olive tree. Olive trees grow in temperate climates and like acid soil.... (etc., etc., etc.)....it was traditional to 'beat' the tree to get the olives, but that often resulted in a lower harvest the next season.... (etc., etc., etc.)....in Italy olive oil is more often used in the south, while the colder north uses butter for similar purposes.... (etc., etc., etc.)...cold-press is best, but... (etc., etc. etc.)"

    for six pages, to establish the presence of olive oil in the area of the story.

    Versus:

    Setup:
    Jane asked, "Would you like some olive oil on that? Pressed from my Uncle Josh's own farm."
    John blinked. "You grow your own oil, too?"
    Jane pushed the bottle across the table. "Yep. Got three barrels in the garage. So when's your mother's wedding?"

    Payoff:
    Jane looked around wildly. "We need to deprive the alien larvae of oxygen. What can we use?"
    John said, "Hey! What about dumping them into those barrels of olive oil?"
     
  4. EdFromNY

    EdFromNY Hope to improve with age Supporter Contributor

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    20,000 words in and not much story? Not good. Even in sci-fi, where world-building is important, you need to be developing your story at the same time. The world building only matters if readers are engaged in the story.
     
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  5. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Returning to add: One way to sneak on maybe a couple of paragraphs about the sewer system could be to have something break, and have your character be responsible for organizing getting it fixed--with that responsibility tying to the main story.

    Scenario:

    Your character just got a new job working for the local VIP, his first assignment is planning for an inspection visit by a higher level VIP (and that visit will be what causes an infectious disease to get into the area--the higher level VIP's daughter will be sick and infect someone--which is the main plot or a major subplot), and he's horrified to learn that the sewer is backed up and it must be fixed NOW! so he has a conversation with the boss of maintenance for the area, who explains--briefly!--why it can't be fixed instantly.

    I'm sure none of that actually fits in your specific story, but you see what I mean?
     
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  6. Mckk

    Mckk Member Supporter Contributor

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    That you explain the sewer system because it becomes relevant later in the book is good. That you spend several pages on it is not. Turn it into a mini scene and drip-feed. Maybe your character finds a bunny stuck down a dried-up drain hole and she wants to get it out - you'll naturally have to explain the sewer system as the character goes this way, and the reader will know exactly why it's relevant and it is relevant right now. But don't just plonk a bunch of non-character-related info that takes several pages in the middle of a scene.

    Every piece of info should to some extent be relevant right now, not only later. That later on there's a bigger picture is good and natural. But while having something that is only relevant later on is fine, I'd say the amount of space you can reasonably devote to it significantly decreases.
     
  7. peachalulu

    peachalulu Member Reviewer Contributor

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    You should use foreshadowing so it doesn't become - eureka! solution at the last minute. But if you go on and on - readers are going to see what you're up to and be unimpressed as in oh, he's going on and on about the sewers, it's obviously going to be important. Or they'll get bored and skim. I'd keep the info light, interesting and include some relevant character detail to make the scene interesting and not just a plot point.
     
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  8. Thomas Larmore

    Thomas Larmore Senior Member

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    DPena, I don't see how you could have 20,000 words and not have much of a story. By this stage, you should be done with the first act, if you are using the three act structure of writing a novel.
     
  9. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    So what you're asking is a belly-busting banquet of exposition is better than a continual parade of savory hors d'oevres enjoyed over time, separated by other entertainment. Personally, the banquet would make me fall asleep and then wake feeling too stuffed to enjoy anything else.

    Don't starve the reader, but keep him hungry for the next morsel.
     
  10. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    Well, as a reader I don't mind exposition, as such. BUT ...and this is important ...if you want the reader to remember the explanation further down the line, you need to make the initial presentation interesting and enthralling enough so they will.

    If you have a character needing to use the restroom, and the character has a few adventures 'down there' in the sewer system that will fix the layout and workings of the system in the reader's mind, then that's great. That's the way to do it.

    If you just lay it on like an encyclopedia entry, not only is the reader likely to start skimming, but they won't remember details when the time comes. So make your blocks of exposition count by giving it them chance to do something else as well. Develop the character, or create a problem for the character, or fix something memorable in the mind of the reader about the setting and circumstances.
     
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  11. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

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    I agree with others saying that this feels like too much exposition overall, not just too much at one time.

    Have a look at your favourite books in a similar genre and see how they handle things. If you have a good used bookstore handy, buy cheap copies of good books and then destroy them - use different coloured highlighters or draw lines through parts or do whatever else it takes to make it clear how the author is mixing things in.

    (And if you find sections that you need to highlight in two separate colours, like sections that both move the story forward AND explain the world... those may be the best sections to emulate.)
     
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  12. X Equestris

    X Equestris Contributor Contributor

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    Honestly, this probably depends on how long the novel is going to be overall. Three Act structure usually has the First Act end around 25%, so a 30,000 word 1st Act is fine if your novel is going to be 120,000 words long. Not so much if your novel is going to top out at 60k.

    That said, I absolutely agree a story should be moving along by 20,000 words.
     
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  13. DPena

    DPena Member

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    Thanks for the replies, everyone. All good points. Sorry it took me a while to reply.

    Not far off. In the story, there are four towers that are connected by the sewers. In times past, sections of the sewers were walled off to prevent people from sneaking between towers, with only small openings to allow the flow of... stuff. It's winter now, and the small openings tend to freeze over, causing things to back up. This is what I'm using to describe the network of sewers and tunnels. Someone has to go down and get things moving again.

    I mean, I *think* the story is moving along at a decent pace. If anything I thought maybe things were going a little too quickly. Most everyone's answers here though have eased those fears a little. The events in the story so far are small things that seem insignificant at first but will eventually set in motion a much larger conflict. I don't believe I'm anywhere near the end of the first act though (I don't even know what the end of the first act should look like).

    What I mainly meant was that at this point in the story, there hasn't been any major events yet. Nothing that will have the reader enthralled. That's mainly what is worrying me. What if the small events I've laid out so far aren't interesting enough to keep them reading?
     
  14. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Do you have any events that feel important, even if they're not at the core of the main plot of the story? I think that you do need to have some stakes, something that the characters feel are very important and therefore the reader can identify with.

    For example, Die Hard is about criminals taking over a skyscraper, but it starts out with a man dealing with trouble with his marriage. Tremors is about underground monsters, but it starts out with Val and Earl's unhappiness with their lives and their decision to take the big chance they've been thinking about. Star Wars is Star Wars, but Luke's story starts out with typical teen angst and unhappiness. Volcano has Tommy Lee Jones getting custody time with his daughter after the divorce, and we see his over-dedication to his job.

    And so on.
     
  15. DPena

    DPena Member

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    In a way, yes. The tower that the majority of the story has taken place in so far is its own community. It has its own social structure, job system, crude form of government, etc. Everything that happens here is the world to these people, and the story revolves around three people that, independently, break free from this society and realize how petty and absurd it all is.

    Two have left already; A young adult male is sent out on a delivery to an out-lying settlement and doesn't return. The pressure is put on another man, the one who sent the kid out on this delivery (it wasn't exactly on the up-and-up), and it puts him at odds with a social bigwig, which results in the man assaulting the socialite and fleeing the tower on his own accord, before punishment can be dealt. The third person is a young adult female who is basically putting up with the fallout and power vacuum that occurs as a result of the man leaving (he had kind of an important job). She is the reader's eyes and ears to the goings-on in the tower. She will eventually be forced to flee as well when the "big event" takes place.

    Right now, there's a lot of bickering and pettiness happening in the story. I guess it comes from being around some people in real life who just can't live without drama. In the end, it's all going to be blown to shit, metaphorically and literally, and all those large problems will be insignificant by comparison. The "big event" will hopefully take the story in a totally unexpected direction, in a good way. Again, hopefully.

    I just need to keep it interesting and not bore the reader to death before I can deliver!
     
  16. exweedfarmer

    exweedfarmer Banned Contributor

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    I don't care what color the sky is. I don't care that the desk is made of mahogany. I don't care if the writer even knows what mahogany is (most don't.) Tell me something really important to the story Right Now!
     
  17. making tracks

    making tracks Active Member

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    It sounds like an interesting story to me. It reminds me a little bit of The Wind Singer, that book also starts with more minor drama within a walled city to show the political and day to day climate.

    In terms of exposition, I personally find it a bit irritating if it's done too long and obviously. For example I was watching a TV show called Scandal, and in the last series there was a scene where two characters do something 'bad' but you're not sure why. The next scene was one of them saying to the other 'we did xyz [all the things needed to commit bad deed and repeating the deed you'd just seen] and we had to because xyz [important reason which explained their actions]' and the other character replies 'I know all this, I was there, it was my plan.' This information was obviously important to the plot but the way they presented it was soooo forced and obviously 'we need the audience to know this' that it just takes you completely out of the scene. I know it's a bit different because the tv show didn't have the option of a narrator to explain this but this kind of conversation does happen in some books too.

    I much prefer it being worked in a bit more than that. In books I think a bit of explanation is fine as long as it doesn't seen crammed in and keeps the flow, and doesn't go on too long.

    I do agree with this for the most part but I think with things like escape plans you have to be careful it doesn't come across as too Deus ex machina and too convenient. I quite like the Chekov's gun approach (when a seemingly small detail becomes important later) but this is done a lot so won't necessarily be a surprise to the audience.
     
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  18. The Piper

    The Piper Contributor Contributor

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    @DPena you've got enough here:

    "In times past, sections of the sewers were walled off to prevent people from sneaking between towers, with only small openings to allow the flow of... stuff. It's winter now, and the small openings tend to freeze over, causing things to back up. This is what I'm using to describe the network of sewers and tunnels. Someone has to go down and get things moving again."

    to let your readers know pretty much all they need to. If you can work that in to some dialogue, a little internal monologue, and jazz up the wording a little, there's absolutely no need to go into a multiple-page description. With the amount you've given us here, I'm interested. Any more, I'd be bored. If we NEED to know more, bring a little more in gradually.

    And if you've spent a few pages describing what I've quoted above, then it's maybe worth looking at the 20,000 words you've got so far and see if you can't condense any of that, too.
     
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