What are you tired of seeing in Sci-Fi movies?

Discussion in 'Science Fiction' started by Uberwatch, Feb 1, 2015.

  1. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    Right, well. While we don't always need to see everything the same way, and may even enjoy and benefit from a spirited disagreement on an issue...

    the forum does not benefit from having "fun" at others' expense, especially in the form of public gloating.
     
  2. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    The true message of Jurassic Park is don't, no matter what, exist in a story written by Michael Crichton. The guy is a monumental technofool. "The computer's down! Therefore, the phones don't work!" "The computer's down! So we can't lock the doors!" "The computer's down! So the air conditioning doesn't work and we're all going to suffocate to death!" (Okay, maybe that one wasn't in Jurassic Park, but I think it was in another of his boneheaded books.) Crichton's message is always "Beware of science gone awry! Technology is the enemy!"

    I'm an engineer with a lot of experience in control system design, installation, and test. NOBODY ever builds life-critical systems with no manual overrides. Full stop. Michael Crichton' universe does not exist.
     
  3. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    So it's ok to have a policy that works in your favor. Interesting.
    Seems reasonable, but not conducive to repeat customers, when
    they pay and then get eaten by the attractions. :p
     
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  4. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    That is truly interesting, and of course it makes sense. The question is never 'if' something is going to go wrong, it's 'when.' Nothing is ever infallible, including technology. So why would an engineer design a system with no fail-safe get-out mechanism?

    I suppose it would be more realistic to have a computer-run system in a story where the manual override doesn't work in an emergency. I'm sure that could happen.

    What about real-life situations, like elevators and sliding doors in grocery stores and other things we have come to depend on (cash registers, computers, ATM machines etc) that don't work during a power cut? Or a car that fails to work because the electrical onboard system goes phuuut. How do you roll down your car windows if the electrics aren't working? How do you get the car started and get it home if the electrics aren't working? I don't think you can hotwire it, the way you used to be able to do with old mechanical cars.

    In a way, I reckon Crichton is playing with our experiences in the real world where things we rely on don't work because some central system has failed.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2019
  5. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    Yeah - can you come work for my employer please

    we recently went to skype for business instead of hard wired phones, via a virtual desktop which is less stable than Theresa May's political career..for 'cost reasons'

    when the computers are down - which happens about twice a week, the phones don't work, the alarm system doesn't work - which also means the panic alarm in reception is out, the photocopiers don't work, and we can't buy anything because its all done via procure to pay

    So far they haven't found a way to make the availability of oxygen or food contingent on the computer network but i fear they would in a heartbeat if they could save a penny by doing so.

    So yeah no competent engineer would ever make critical systems without an override but suits don't always listen to engineers
     
  6. John-Wayne

    John-Wayne Madman Extradinor Contributor

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    Incompetence of well-trained military or police, that seemed to allow some person who's never had any training to be able to evade them. But that may just be a general.

    Oh I know, someone who is new to the force beating a seasoned force-user.
     
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  7. DPena

    DPena Member

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    Eesh. Sounds like you need a new IT dept, to be honest. The computers for a business should not be going down twice a week, no matter what kind of work load is on it.
     
  8. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    Yeah that is a bunch of something, there is no way Rey could take on Kylo Ren
    and when if the old school rules still applied like they did for Luke and Anikan.
    But Disney took a shit on those rules didn't they? :p
     
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  9. John-Wayne

    John-Wayne Madman Extradinor Contributor

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    Yeah, it would be like the fight in Cloud City except this time Luke was Victorious and before Vader fell said Luke I am your father. And then Vader was picked up by a star Cruiser
     
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  10. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    Give it time, they'll turn that event into a musical number on top of all that. :p
     
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  11. John-Wayne

    John-Wayne Madman Extradinor Contributor

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    Yep,

    Funny thing is, when i learned what a Mary Sue was from another story, Empress Theresa, I realized my own character was going down this path and I needed to fix it.


    Thus, a great support/antagonist was born for my MC to deal with. The mercenary known as Tyrus. He not only beat her but also humiliated her, suffice to say she was sufficiently pissed off.

    Basically, Rey needed to lose
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2019
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  12. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    I think the old standard (with few exceptions) is the Aliens always landing or invading
    in the USA. Not really sure who decides that when it comes to ETs coming to Earth would
    specifically come to the US, but I think it might be that they have blinders forced upon them
    by the creators of the movies in large part.
    [​IMG]
     
  13. John-Wayne

    John-Wayne Madman Extradinor Contributor

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    Lol, do understand what you're saying. However, I feel aliens picking America has more to do with the the market audience.

    Or, they just don't believe we would be interested in an alien invasion over the UK or Russia.

    Most of it comes down to who directed it, who wrote it and who the audience is.

    But again, I understand what you're getting at. And don't forget some of the movies do take place globally, are the main character's are American

    ETA: I mean aren't the majority of giant monster movies, done in Japan or at least South East Asia. They seem to love attacking Japan
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
  14. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    That's part of what people liked about District 9, I think. Just a new setting.
     
  15. John-Wayne

    John-Wayne Madman Extradinor Contributor

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    True... True...
     
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  16. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    Okay, two things, both of which were triggered by watching Silence on Netflix last night.

    First, the "spooky montage" intro. This isn't restricted to SF, but it's becoming a really tiresome trope lately. If the movie is going to go post-apocalyptic, just splice together some stock footage of smokestacks, dead animals, the occasional riot, earnest newsreaders, et voila, you have something to keep the audience awake while we find out who the casting director was.

    The second, and this is more in the horror/SF genre, is caloric requirements and life cycles.

    Yeah, I should wrap this part.

    The beasties in Silence evolved in a cave, living down there for god knows how many million years. It was explicitly stated that they were sealed in until our intrepid spelunkers set them free, so what the hell were they eating? And why were they such nimble open-sky flyers anyway (not that that's part of my original complaint, but...) And the whole life-cycle and caloric requirement thing. They're birds (well, flying lizards), they're about the size of large hawks or smallish eagles, and they're ravenous, but they aren't soarers, they're flappers. What the hell are they living on when they aren't mobbing random people? Flying takes a lot of energy. And yeah, it would suck to get mobbed by them, I'm sure it could be fatal, but how damn many of them were living in that cave that they took over three states in a matter of days? Anything that big is going to take a year or so to get to full size (cats do), so it's not like they suddenly bred their way into a multistate flock.

    What the hell are you doing flying air superiority fighter jets around to try and cope with an outbreak of leathery eagles? The Emergency Broadcast System knows that sound is a problem, why are all the cop cars running their sirens. That woodchipper trick? Outbreak would be over in a day if you could get the boys at Massey-Ferguson or whoever makes them to up production. Plus, I noticed that some sounds mattered, but others didn't. Tongues aren't vocal cords you fucking dolts!
    I think I'm done.
     
  17. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    Well all that just kinda reminded me of this. :)
     
  18. Selbbin

    Selbbin The Moderating Cat Staff Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    See-through information screens.

    They look stupid and make no logical or practical sense.
     
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  19. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    I am on the fence with this one.
    Point that it looks 'cool' it isn't practical.
    Point for practical is if you can read backwards
    just as easily as forwards, it is a neat idea.
     
  20. Selbbin

    Selbbin The Moderating Cat Staff Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    Anyone that has struggled reading text over background images on poorly designed websites knows that text on a clear screen with people and objects and movement in the background is going to be a bitch to read. And a passive background like a wall will make it redundant.

    The ancient CRT monitors in Alien still look more relevant than pseudo future invisi-panels.
     
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  21. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    I will have to give you that one. Must be a real pain in the ass
    to read a clear screen with all that background interference.

    I do like the aesthetic for the time it came out (Alien, 2001: Space Odyssey).
    I think we could in the least get away with HD LCD screens without causing
    too much of a rift in practicality moving forward.

    So agreed clear screens are a detriment to functionality overall. :)

    ETA: Clear plastic paper is also a bad idea. (Repo: The Genetic Opera,
    and a few others are guilty of this one). I mean how can they read any
    of it when the words would all blur together? o_O
     
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  22. Selbbin

    Selbbin The Moderating Cat Staff Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    Not to be argumentative (you know that means it will be), but....

    They believe the 2 737 MAX 8s crashed because there was no manual override to the anti-stall (MCAS) device unique to the aircraft. In the second crash, the crew had to de-activate the electrical systems that ran it, which caused a host of other problems - mainly not being able to fly the plane, so they turned it back on and crashed when MCAS pushed the nose down again despite crew flight inputs. They have now updated the plane to have a manual over-ride.

    If some of the world's best aerospace engineers can make this gaff in the 20teens. Why not theme park engineers in the 1990s?

    Secondly, the person who designed the system was the bad guy. So having those issues seems plausible if placed by the very person wanting to exploit it.... there probably was a manual override to some of the functions that only he knew about. But you can't have manual over-ride for everything. Now that's unrealistic. The magic 'make it work' lever.

    Because lastly, many phone systems, even back in the 90s, ran through servers and not through the normal phone system, and where I worked in the late 90s when the servers went down, so did the phones. There wasn't a single 'regular' phone or phone line. There can't be a 'manual over-ride' to computers being off the grid. I don't see why the phones would work when they are all connected into a system that would presumably rely on satellite connectivity via their computer system. And again, a system designed, built and placed by the bad guy.
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2019
  23. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    Point taken. There are, actually, some stupid systems in existence, as you pointed out. There are stupid engineers. There are also stupid managers who push deadlines too hard and stick systems into the field before they're complete and tested. I've dealt with some of them and they make me very angry. Still, Crichton does this kind of thing too much and makes me very angry with HIM.

    You can have backups. That's not unrealistic in the case of the systems in Jurassic Park. (I have worked on exactly one system that, by its nature, could not be shut down in an orderly fashion - any emergency stop procedure would wind up costing far more than just letting shit happen. The only thing to do was to train all personnel to wear the required protective clothing and get out of the way if things go south. This was for an metal foundry and the trick was not to get molten metal on you.)

    Still, in Jurassic Park, Hammond was willing to spend all the money in the world to get his dinosaurs, but only a pittance on his control system. He hired just one guy to handle everything? Now THAT'S unrealistic.

    In a life-safety system, there should be a backup phone line that doesn't depend on the servers being up. And you should be able to manually lock the doors even when the computer is down - that's a no-brainer.
     
  24. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    At one point in my life, I worked in a re-purposed Cold War nuclear missile command and control shelter. The Big Door was always open, and they'd built a wall with an electronic security door just inside of it. On my orientation day, they said "This is the button to close the Big Door. Never push the button that closes the Big Door, as we're not sure if it will actually close, and if it does, if it will open again."

    "Um, excuse me? Why don't you just disconnect the button?"

    "The way this place was built, it's designed not to be possible. At least not on our budget."

     
  25. The Dapper Hooligan

    The Dapper Hooligan (V) ( ;,,;) (v) Contributor

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    But if I'm remembering Jurassic Park correctly (the book, not the movie) that's pretty much Hammond's character. All hubris, and a complete disrespect for other's lives.
     

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