I would like some help with themes in characters. So I‘m writing my novel and this story has several themes but the main one is about life, how to life it and how to find meaning in it. It‘s what most of the characters struggle with. I have two issues with this. First I don‘t want to turn my characters into stereotypes. The second problem is the question whether I‘m giving every opinion a fair chance. So I‘d like to ask for feedback and possible additions/improvement. If you don't want to read the entire summary below, I'd still appreciate general advice on this issue. Short summary: The world is divided into several countries. All over the world there are two gods that are being worshipped, the goddess of life and the physical & the god of death and the spiritual. In one country a king chose to kill all supporters of the god and he called them as evil. People grew afraid of them. Only a few survived the tragedy. Hundreds of years later the common folk of this country doesn‘t even know about the god anymore. Travelers are strictly forbidden from mentioning the forgotten god’s name. Only the royal family and the church know about his existence. The story starts with a diplomat from a neighboring country who visits. His country strongly believes in the god‘s power but has never forced this belief onto others. A few days after his arrival the archbishop of the goddess‘ church gets murdered. This is how the story starts. Protagonist: Born as a commoner‘s son, he grew up quite normally. His father wanted him to take over his business but his son wanted to become a royal knight. He was a prodigy when it came to handling weapons. He passed an exam to become a knight and trained his entire youth to fulfill his dream. There he become friends with the prince and several knights. He was supposed the become the prince‘s aide. However on a mission he was forced to kill a friend that had betrayed them. He was traumatized. He still hallucinates about his friend who is usually calls him a murderer in those illusions. He strongly believes in the worth of every life and that everyone is the hero of their own story. Therefore he thinks everyone should choose their own fate and accept the fate others chose. He thinks there is not right moral choice, just a subjective one. So in his opinion meaning can be found wherever you create it. Around town and in the royal palace he is very popular. He works for his father‘s business. [On different note: The protagonist is meant to show that murder is not to be romanticized. Someone who kills but doesn’t feel anything, is insane. This a personal peeve of mine because so many novels make murder look trivial.] Prince: Born as the only heir to the royal throne, he was always under a lot of pressure. He does not live for his own sake. His main focus is his country and it‘s people. His father put him in charge of the country’s security and therefore he is known as a great defender who can get any revolt under control. He tries to save people but sometimes he has no choice but to kill in order to save the weak. People call him a hero because he saved several small villages from threats. They believe he cares. However he is lacking in his ability of handling people. He has asked the protagonist to become his aide regardless of whether he can fight or not. The protagonist declined. The prince believes that happiness can only be achieved by sticking to clear rules and morals. Ones that everyone accepts. That is the only way to protect the weak. So meaning can be found by believing in higher power and given your dreams to them. Love interest: Her mother was one of the god‘s children (just a name; they aren‘t actually related) whose ancestors died in the tragedy. Therefore she has rare abilities that were never meant to manifest. However her parents died. The archbishop found a young orphaned girl and brought her to the monastery. When he found out about her true nature, he become obsessed. He forced the girl to awaken to her power. She tried resisting but was unable to do so. She despises the archbishop, his son and all their allies. She is known around the country as the archbishop’s daughter that he loves and cherishes. People believe she locks herself in the monastery even though is forced to stay there. She usually wears long clothes, gloves and a veil to hide the scares she got when they tried to force her to awaken. Furthermore they make her wear a cloth around her eyes because that’s where her power lies. The archbishop made up the lie that she's blind. Her goal is to rid the world of gods and any kind of government. She believes a good society can only be formed when people are forced to put their hopes and dreams into their hands. She is both an anarchist and hedonist. For her there’s no meaning at all and therefore it cannot be found. The trick is living regardless. While she’s not the main antagonist of this story, she does have goals which conflict with the protagonist. Friend: She has been friends with the protagonist for a while. She is also the prince’s fiancé. Her parents are nobility and she also grew up under a lot of pressure. However she was never able to satisfy her parents. They put her down which her made really insecure. She is genuinely a good person and wants to do her best but is afraid of trying because she feels like she’ll fail anyway. She is in love with the prince but he pays her little attention. The protagonist has supported her and usually encourages her to push her boundaries. They have a very nurturing relationship. She believes a good society can only created when people work together and show each other kindness. She believes that there is true good and true evil. However she thinks that every evil can be become good. So for her meaning can be found in happiness and happiness is created by altruism. Knight: She isn’t very tall and she doesn’t look very intimidating. She is incredibly beautiful. However she always wanted to become knight but people rejected her because of looks. She is female. She is small and she is way too beautiful to get hands dirty. All her life she tried to gain recognition for her skills but people only ever concentrated on her looks. That’s all she is ever reduced to. It made her a hermit. She tries to avoid other people and believes that in the end you’ll always be alone. That’s why she puts herself and her own desires first. She works as the love interest’s aide. These are the main characters. There are more and other views or different nuances of these views but this is what I got. Any opinions or suggestions? Thank you in advance.
The key to having interesting characters is to give them differing views and personality traits. After all, if every character feels the same way and shares the same interests, stuff gets boring quick. So from a cursory glance it looks like you're doing well on that front. You clearly have them seeing the world in different ways. Is the Prince the antagonist? It reads like he could potentially be the most diametrically opposed to the protagonist. I guess because it comes back to your questions They don't seem like stereotypes, because they all read as being shaped by their experiences and differing backgrounds. They don't seem one-dimensional or obvious. That can't really be answered with what you've given. How their stories play out, how their journeys end, how the subject matters are explored during the book. How they are changed. That's the only real way to answer that question. That's also the one guarded word of warning I have - Characters need to change, learn, grow, uncover truth, lies, or be shaped by their experiences of the story. That didn't seem to be hinted at in your character breakdowns. But don't take it as a knock, you already wrote a ton about each of them so Im not assuming you haven't taken that into account. The best advice I can give you is in plotting and examples. If your intent is to give every opinion a fair and equal chance in your book, you can't leave it to writing like a panster, you need to take control, plot it out and make it happen. Readers learn and experience best by physical examples, not by being told stuff in narrative. That means if my character is cheeky, I don't just tell the reader she is cheeky, I make her perform a physical example, which proves it to the reader and sticks in their head more. Physical examples are stronger for that reason. The same applies to their morals and opinions on the world. Write a list based on Ying and Yang. Black and White. Light and Dark. 'Right' and 'Wrong' for the differing opinions you want to come across in the book. Protagonist - 1 physical example event happens to him that proves his world view right. - 1 physical example event happens to him that proves him wrong. How does he interpret both events and fall on the side he does? The reader is witness to both. They then either agree or disagree with the protagonist. You gave them a fair choice of Ying or Yang. There might be a right answer, there might be a wrong answer in the reader's opinion. What it should do well is highlight that your character chose one way because of his upbringing and experiences in life, making the reader see why he chose the choices he did in those events. So that, even if they disagree with the character, they at least understand him. And why? Because you gave each side of the argument an equal chance. Repeat the same process for the other characters or other opinions/themes/subjects. Then you fit these events into the overall plot (or build it around them) and without a shadow of a doubt, you can put your hand on your heart and say you gave each side of their opinions a fair chance. Just remember - you will NEVER please everyone on that count. Ever. So just make sure you are satifised. Hope that helps some, @Coppe !
Thank you so much! You’ve made some really great points. First of all I didn’t even think of a good and bad list for each view but I think it’s a great idea. I’ll definitely do that. I also really appreciate your advice about how I can give physical examples which put the different world views into perspective. I will use that for sure! Thank you! As for character development, yes, I have composed a journey for each of these characters. Some are less fundamental and others are life-changing. I’m also currently working on my outline. I wish I could just write like a pantser but that doesn’t work for me. This story also has a lot of layers which need to connect neatly. I need an outline or it’ll be a mess. The prince is somewhat of an antagonist. He’s driven by his desire to protect the weak and create a great country for his subjects. I know he has quite a few bad qualities but he is someone who truly cares. This is what makes him so unstable. This strong wish for a better world corrupts him. He is willing to sacrifice everything for this world he envisions. That’s why he helps the antagonist. However the antagonist betrays the prince and leaves him with nothing after the prince sacrificed everything (including the protagonist). The prince has to reevaluate his actions and beliefs. He always had a title but now that he is left with no family, no loyal servants and no friends. That is his journey throughout the first part of this story. In the second part he’s actually supposed become someone who represents hope. He supposed to become a truly strong character. Someone who I believe would be a great leader. When I came up with this character, I thought of the song “Holland Road“ by Mumford & Sons. In fact all my characters have songs
Im new to this site, but every time I'm reading something and want to comment I see Steve rivers making some insanely insightful comments so it's pretty difficult to add anything. But I'm something of an expert in moral dilemmas as my life has been full of them. So ughm, I'll throw something in too: When you talk about life do you mean the value of a human life? Plus the meaning of life? If so, man you chose a bit of a topic didn't you? I think it's a mistake to use this topic trying to be objective and fair. I think it's your responsibility as an author to use this opportunity to write a thesis for your own beliefs. Otherwise why would you want to write? Now I don't mean just write what you believe. I mean use this opportunity to write about what it means to you. Then challenge yourself and your beliefs by throwing it on the ringer. Absolutely destroy yourself in it. Test your theories and find out what would happen. That's your story. I say this because it's much harder to try to write about things you don't understand. A vegan trying to write like someone who eats meat is objectively going to fail. You could do the research and understand the theories, but you wouldn't be able to understand on a fundamental level. But trying to write like someone who is learning about meat is totally doable. So pick 2 or 3 characters you understand because you relate to them and then you test them hard by using logic you learn from 2 or 3 character you just started to develop. It's hard to do and it's like fighting against your own instincts the stronger you feel about it, but that's leads to the greatest increase in your own personal wisdom. I personally see morality like a piece of metal. You grind it with knowledge and occasionally very rarely, you learn something and you decide it's time to change the shape and then you reforge it. Hope this helps.
I need to balance out this Ying with a Yang. Taken from Adam Bolander's thread about How to spell "Ghoul"? in his next Clown Hunter book... Balance restored.
@Chromewrite Thank you for your reply! Yes, both are discussed in my novel. It was actually never meant to be about the meaning of life but as I developed the story and my characters, that's just how it ended up being. I still think you can still enjoy the story without caring about both of these themes. In the end I wanted to create characters that feel real. Characters that stand for something, just like we all do. In the end this story is very character driven. You've made some great points. I agree with you and I appreciate your advice. The prince, the protagonist and the love interest are the most important characters in this story. They also all have a part of my own belief only intensified, almost like a caricature. I created other characters as well to show how each view can get twisted. Personally, I think it's a mistake to separate the belief from the person when in truth they are intertwined. I really like your idea of questioning my own beliefs. It's a great way to go about and it will create a great contrast. I will try to incorporate this into my story.
Ah it was not really a critique to say the topic was too big or anything, I just think it's a bit of a daunting prospect at least for me and I'm scared to write about anything like that but you go for it! But reading what you write about character driven fantasy, I'd like to recommend a book called: Tigana by Guy Gabrial Kay. I honestly don't remember much of it (ironic if you read the book) but I think he pulled off the scale of plot pretty well while that only being a back drop to the characters and their motivations themselves. It's a fine line between characters having large motivations and being hysterical and Tigana did achieve it somewhat. Just the ending did end up feeling slightly cheesy in my opinion.
