The art of the story

Discussion in 'General Writing' started by ScaryPen, Oct 9, 2007.

  1. cazann34

    cazann34 Active Member

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    I think you've already answered your own questions. Short sentence can control the pace and tone and can convey a sense to urgency for the reader. But can also be confusing if they don't makes sense. A sentence should have a verb and make sense or have some context with the other sentences around it. And yes, I would say that DO NOT will have more impact than DON'T in certain circumstances because it can show the word more harshly as if in a command.
     
  2. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    how it affects my writing is to make it an enjoyable, comfortable 'good read'... since i vary the length greatly and throughout my work...

    i'm constantly having to tell my clients and mentees to stop writing paragraph-long sentences and when using a fragment, to make sure it's making sense...
     
  3. peachalulu

    peachalulu Member Reviewer Contributor

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    I like a mix. Long sentences with short ones. I also think it depends on the mood you're trying to convey. I read somewhere
    that the best sentences are the ones in which you can say without taking two breaths.
     
  4. thewordsmith

    thewordsmith Contributor Contributor

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    The length of your sentences can change the pacing, the mood, the temperature, the energy ... Pretty much everything in a scene can be controlled by the construct of your sentences. This combination of 'ingredients' can also help determine whether you've got a great story or simply show 'promise'.

    Bear in mind that a good story is something like a roller coaster. It has its ups and downs. If the story was all on one level - no change of pace - readers would quickly get bored with it.
     
  5. Intentionally Blank

    Intentionally Blank New Member

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    I agree with the above. I always use a mix of simple, compound and complex sentences, and of varying length. I actually had a reader tell me some of my sentences are too long, so I've focused on making my sentences shorter and more readable. I tend to like big things, and I write a lot, and sometimes have a lot to say, which is why I have big sentences. I have to pace myself sometimes.

    And yes, a novel's pace should change. But not wildly; that's difficult for the reader (I know when Chris write the first Eragon book, he went fast and then suddenly very slow {some of the critics picked up on certain "boring parts"} but I cut him some slack, 'cos he was, well... 15*). It depends on your writing style really. I like to put some action in the beginning, slow down a bit, and then gradually speed up again.

    *I guess that's a bit rich of me, considering I'm 14 myself.
     
  6. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Sentence length correlates fairly closely with slowing of pace. Modulating sentence length is a factor to consider when you are tuning the flow of your novel. Save the meticulous description for the slow waiting scenes between high action.

    You may feel that more periods slow down the flow, but that is rarely the case. Short choppy sentences also mean more verbs and fewer modifiers. Keep it crisp when things heat up.

    And above all, remember that a sentence should convey a single action, thought, or idea. Don't make it try to play the role of a paragraph.
     
  7. P.V. Moyer

    P.V. Moyer New Member

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    Okay, so, I've been working on the starting of a story. I recently reread it, and not sure what it classifies as, and if there's much of a market for it. As much time as I've put into it, if I don't think there's much market for it, I can use the base plot and characters for a thriller, since I believe I'm stronger suited to writing a thriller novel. I have set a goal for myself to complete NaNoWrimo, and if I decide to restart a new novel based on this one, I want it to be what I focus on.

    Two young brothers witness the murder of their father in southern
    Italy. Discovering that the killer was a cop, the boys and their mother relocate to New York, but one is seperated. Fifteen years pass before they are reunited, but in dire circumstances. One of them is now an FBI agent, while the other is highly ranked in the organized crime ladder. The younger brother, the FBI agent feels for his brothers rage and instead of turning him in, works to cover up the various crimes.
    At some point, they have a falling out, and a price is set on the younger brothers head. In due time, they set up a meet to put their past behind them. As the younger brother arrives for the meet, a different agent, who had been watching them both, takes a shot at him. The older brother dives in front and sacrifices himself.
    Then a possibility of 2 endings.

    Or, use the base plot of 2 brothers, going seperate ways at some point, time passes and something happens lol so on and so on.

    Sorry for the long read.

    So it boils down to, is there enough market, or any market for a crime/mob semi thriller, or might it be better versed as a thriller?

    Thanks in advance.



    ,
     
  8. captain kate

    captain kate Senior Member

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    There's always a market for something-depends on the buyer. As for story idea, they've all been done before, so you're take is what matters. Even my novel has been done before since it combines "A Most Dangerous Game" with "Die Hard."

    Best thing to do it make it the best intro and story you can do.
     
  9. Thromnambular

    Thromnambular New Member

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    I'd try to write something that I REALLY want to write, rather than force myself to produce something that supposedly has a market for it. I think if you love it enough, you'll find the inspiration you need to make it a success.

    A combination of The Most Dangerous Game and Die Hard? I'd be all over that. Do want. :O
     
  10. P.V. Moyer

    P.V. Moyer New Member

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    I love the story either way it goes, I just figure in a world where it'll be hard to get a book published no matter the context, id like to give myself any advantage I can. :)
     
  11. captain kate

    captain kate Senior Member

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    That's what I meant, there's always a market for something, just depends on how many buyers and the access to publishing houses. With the advent of e-books, whose sales are not dropping despite people crying wolf, there's a market for anything well written. However, even if one puts their story out as an e-book, which an independent author can do, it still has to be a great product in order to sell.

    No magic bullets in writing I'm afraid. My novel's finished, and just going a hard copy edit, it's losing 14-23% of words per chapter, leaving me to, more then likely, add 10k to a story that finished near 100k. So, it takes a LOT of work to get one ready to put into the market, e-book or traditional. But then, I'm of the opinion a author should keep their e-book rights (amazon alone pays 70 cents on every dollar) for better profits per sale, while pursuing traditional publishing for paper.

    By the way, edited and re-edited opening scenes, are my current blog posts.
     
  12. MightyPen

    MightyPen New Member

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    I have to agree with pretty much everything that's been said. There's always a market for something. If you believe in your own story then hopefully readers will see that and will appreciate the story for being well written. But just as Captain Kate said, there is a bit of a journey in getting yourself fully immersed in the 'market waters' so I'd say keep at it and hopefully you'll enjoy the ride!
     
  13. P.V. Moyer

    P.V. Moyer New Member

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    True true. Well, I do appreciate the knowledge that you have to share.
    I saw that Kate, it definitely looks like a long journey. I hope the best for yours.

    I think, that what's getting me flustered and confused, as well as limiting my thinking and focus lately is that I'm thinking too much about it. Suppose I should just relax and enjoy it now before I actually have to think about the next steps.
     
  14. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    YES!!!

    meaning what, ck? :confused:
     
  15. robertpri007

    robertpri007 New Member

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    I've used several methods, but not happy with any of them I used to keep a series of post-ums, and then notes thumb tacked to a story board. One per chapter.
    Neither worked well. I now keep a doc file just for timing, to keep track of the days, and a brief paragraph about every chapter.

    Without this, I once had the characters go to lunch twice in the same day. At times, I have the plot advance far too much for a single day, and rewrite to add a day.

    Just wondering about other methods. I am more than willing to try another one.
     
  16. shaylyn

    shaylyn New Member

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    I personally write down every day that's in my story, almost like a calendar then paraphrase the important parts of each day.

    Like this.

    friday- met jack/Ryan gets caught

    saturday- first day at tree house

    sunday- Arie is missing

    monday- Arie comes back in the morning/helps melody/ david dies/ anna comes

    tuesday- everyone planning to leave/jack kiss/anna dies/go find matthew/sleep in motel

    wednesday- visit matthew/leave ryan message/return without matthew/sy is gone/romance

    thursday- leave/ stopped by Ryan/Paulson is killed/ catch adams/finds out ben is still alive

    friday- ryan dies/watch company/root kills adams



    Obviously this doesn't make much sense to anyone else but it makes perfect sense to me :)
     
  17. Thromnambular

    Thromnambular New Member

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    If this is really posing a bit of a problem...

    Have you tried putting together a detailed calendar? There are tons of planner/calendar apps out there, though I'm not sure they'll be of much use, since you probably can't just make a custom calendar with whatever dates you want.

    Maybe you could try a spreadsheet? A cell for each day, make a comment on the cell to put your info for that day.

    Like this thing I made for the sake of example:

    [​IMG]
     
  18. robertpri007

    robertpri007 New Member

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    Normally, it would not be a problem for me, but I like to write spy/espionage/thrillers. It's often a challenge to keep track of all the building action from all the various characters. They are often working independently, and I can't have Bill begin to see minor clues about Sam's activities until the timing is right.

    Your idea of a spreadsheet is a very good one--thanks. Odd that I never thought of that because I have worked with Excel for decades. I could even expand it to a linked database and clicking on one character would display their history in chronological order. I will work on this, and thanks. The posting was not a waste.
     
  19. psychotick

    psychotick Contributor Contributor

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    Hi,

    Usually it hasn't been a problem for me, but in my current WIP I'm having the devil's own time simply because I've got communications time lags. Pigeons only take a few days to reach their destination, but couriers could take weeks on horseback, and trader caravan's months. It's not so much what happens when that's the problem, its the what do people know about what happened when that's urging me to pull my hair out.

    Cheers, Greg.
     
  20. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    What's wrong with using a calendar? There is plenty of software that you can use to print out daily, weekly, or monthly calendars for any given range of dates.

    Or you could use a time line on a whiteboard.

    Personally, I've never had a problem with timelines, but if your story is complex enough to need one, there are any number of ways to organize events.

    Look into business time management techniques and tools. They may even hep you stick to a writing schedule!
     
  21. Selbbin

    Selbbin The Moderating Cat Staff Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    As mentioned, a schedule on a calender (Physical or digital) is a good idea. Plot the length of time the messages, or whatever, take to reach a destination, and also plot when the relevant people react to make sure that they match up. You can do this with lines, or notes, or both. You can also make constant notes in the draft using red (or whatever) text to keep track of who is where. It depends on how you like to stay organizized (A little Taxi Driver in joke there).

    Timelines on A3 paper also works well for some writers, plotting how long each even or activity takes place in relation to each other.

    Luckily I don't need these tools as I can keep it all in my head. I usually go backwards and forwards to check on my timelines and co-ordination of events. I always keep track of where my characters are, and what they are doing, even if they are not on-screen / in the scene / in the chapter.
     
  22. B93

    B93 Active Member

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    I like timelines, with a parallel line for each major character and perhaps the McGuffin. I can draw arrows between them to indicate interactions, and those arrows can incorporate communication lag.
     
  23. FirstTimeNovelist91

    FirstTimeNovelist91 New Member

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    I like the idea of timelines. I need to start utilizing them!
     
  24. Birmingham

    Birmingham Active Member

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    Do you ever stop in the midst of a story due to being jaded with it? I mean, you live with your own story more than any reader ever will. You tell it to yourself over, and over, and know a lot of the scenes before you even write them. Is it good to take some time off? Or is it dangerous because you're then less likely to return to your story?

    And during that break, what do you do? Read? Start committing to a new story?

    See, I have this idea, I had it for a while, and now I"m at a point where all of the big twists and original ideas that just "came to me" are pretty much over, and I'm shifting gears, and the characters have all finished planning their moves and are now going to actually commit them. So even though many of the characters surprised me, I now know what each and every one of them is about to do. There are always surprises, but they'll be very minor at this point. So, even though it might be exciting for a new reader, to me it feels like a story I've already read or watched, and is mostly predictable (predictable to me the writer. Not to others, necessarily). Do you find yourself in a position like this? Do you take a break when you do? Do you return to it? And what do you do in the meantime? I guess the best thing would be to read.
     
  25. shadowwalker

    shadowwalker Contributor Contributor

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    That "predictability" is exactly why I don't outline or plan before writing. However, to your case - don't take a break. Not at a point where you're feeling bored because then it will just be a chore (even if subconsciously) to go back to it. Keep writing - but allow yourself to deviate if the occasion arises. Just because they've planned out all these things doesn't mean someone or something won't throw a spanner into the works (as my Brit buddies say).
     

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