A Moral Question about Food

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Snicket, Feb 25, 2013.

  1. Teodor Pravický

    Teodor Pravický New Member

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    Well, Tourist, I think the cop is abusing his uniform for his own sake and will not take long time before I find out he is working with local criminals. But what about he is a good guy who has just good relationship with local climate? People like to do favors to each other, I don't mind if customer gives me bottle of vine, but I will then charge him for the mistake he made. Thanks to this I don't feel responsible for stupid favors that could turn out really bad.

    I still can't see your point. People are there for themselves, right? If I would own the restaurant, I wouldn't charge officer who helps me keep things quiet around, but might be dangerous for me if he demand that stuff by himself. Still, people ale learning and next time I might see the cop even reject some favors.

    Having this illusion about people that escalate things up, never change and do only bad things might be worse for you than for themselves.
     
  2. The Tourist

    The Tourist Banned

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    Teodor, the problem is the seductive nature of the slide. The "coming back" is painful. It almost broke me.

    At the age of about 35 I realized I had to change. Not only for myself and for my (now) wife, but 14 of the guys I rode with had died for various reasons, including a foolish turf war. Fortunately I ran into a restaurant owner who nurtured my spiritual outlook.

    But then came "the wages of sin" remunerations. I made a list of the people I had wronged, and called them. I could only do two of them per day, at best. Suddenly those 'minor' decisions of character--so easily laughed about--now had to be fully repaid.

    (I was so embarrassed by my conduct that during this period my forum(s) handle was "Ichabod Poser." Biblically it could be translated as "lying coward.")

    It's one thing to bang a guy's wife, steal a pocketful of French fries or tell a "little white lie." It's another to look back upon your entire life and face the man you have become.

    Why do you think I'm so strident with easy riders here? There's a simple answer, I know all too well what is in store for them.
     
  3. Teodor Pravický

    Teodor Pravický New Member

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    Tourist, i know you own some guns and sharp knife, the question is if you have guts to use it ;)

    I think nobody with some perception have it easy, you turnout from ignorant felon to some kind of hippie because you could see what have you or what might have you done. I know people that are just to be "good" for everybody and is really hard for them to accept any other way, because mostly they are just a bunch of pussies.

    Well if you prefer the easy way just because something hurts your feelings, then I think you must forgotten who you really are.
     
  4. The Tourist

    The Tourist Banned

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    Well, it's not that I have forgotten who I am, and humorously, I did not become a hippie. This example is more of about how you have to stop hitting yourself in the head with a hammer.

    In other words, do any of us really benefit from duplicity? Who really gets hurt? Do you live better always taking short cuts as well as someone else's possessions?

    For some of my teenage years and all of my young adulthood, I did what I wanted to, and succeeded. What could be better than that?

    Well, living healthy, getting married and being loyal, doing simple honest work and paying my debts leaves me feeling better than ever before. And you don't have to be a wuss and give up the joys in life. I still ride, the boys are just as tough, just better men.

    I have also found that my story is not unique. I've listened to dozens of guys who teetered on the abyss, and managed to step back.
     
  5. Teodor Pravický

    Teodor Pravický New Member

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    We don't ride bikes in here, its not good for the enviroment ;)
     
  6. jwideman

    jwideman New Member

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    That's a nice anecdote, but it isn't evidence. Let's put that on the backburner for now.
    Are you me? Are you the OP? Are you anyone in this thread but yourself?
     
  7. The Tourist

    The Tourist Banned

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    I do believe we are looking at life from differing ends. I'm retired looking back. You sound like you're at the beginning of life looking forward to a wondrous human experience, and you should.

    But if you walk through a graveyard and read the headstones you'll see epitaphs like "Loyal Wife," or "Beloved Husband" or "Cherished Daughter." In the final analysis it isn't the status of a person that defines them, it's the way people valued them.

    I'll admit, I'm comfotable in life. If I need or want something I just buy it. But most of the times I don't, because "things" are not how I value life and the interaction I have with people.

    I regret many of the things I did and professed, and how it hurt others and finally myself.

    Don't do the same thing. In the end, shiny stuff is just dead weight, and you cannot go back in time to fix all of the damage you've done.

    The Germans have an expression, "Too soon old, too late smart."
     
  8. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    It strikes me that this is exactly the opposite of the point you want to make. You say you were a lawless jerk back then, and have become a much better person since. Great. But you started by saying that if a person starts off bad, they only get worse.

    I knew some jerks when I was younger, and they're better people now. One was even a cousin of mine. When he was fourteen, his father died and his mother needed time to get on her feet financially, so she farmed her kids out to family members, and we got this cousin for a year. He was a complete asshole. I saw him a few years ago at my mother's funeral, and he made a point of coming over and apologizing profusely to me for how he'd behave as a teen. He's a changed man.

    Heck, I'm a better person now than I was in my teens.

    I think a great many, if not most, people improve as they get older. We get braver as we realize that honesty, generosity, and general decency cost us nothing, but are returned to us amplified. What goes around comes around; we reap what we sow.
     
  9. jwideman

    jwideman New Member

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    I keep hearing that I'm in the middle of my life, but I plan to live forever, so yeah, beginning works.
    I too had a petty theft as a younger. I too did a lot of lying. Mostly to myself. But not the rest. It was not the oppressive authoritarianism that made me stop. It was when I stopped lying to myself and rejected the oppressive authoritarianism. I was no longer lying to anyone about the kind of person I was. I was no longer condemning people just because an authority told me to. And to my surprise, I became a better person. I'm still judgmental. It's my biggest fault. But I've learned not to make sweeping generalizations. I judge the individual by their actions and words. And I try to remember that people can change.
     
  10. The Tourist

    The Tourist Banned

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    Well, they do get worse until something slaps them upside the head. Those are the lucky ones.

    Many don't. The prisons are full of folks who claim it's the world that was against them, that it's always somebody else's fault.
     
  11. Talmay

    Talmay Member

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    I was a little kelpto when I was younger and was never caught. Yet one day I realized what a horrible person I was becoming and stopped. Sometimes it is that simple. Like you said, Tourist, your conscience catches up to you eventually. For someone who went through something similar, you seem quick to condemn people because of the past.
     

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