1. Malum

    Malum Offline

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    Submitting 'Imperfect' Manuscripts

    Discussion in 'Agent Discussion' started by Malum, May 7, 2021.

    I'm sure there's probably posts I could look at about this but with all the recyclable topics of people asking others to plot their novels for them I hope this isn't an issue, although I would appreciate any relevant links and advice.

    I finished my debut novel in 2015, first draft. For some reason amidst all my self-destruction I developed a sort of prose that is excruciating, but one I deem necessary for the novel to be completed to my own satisfaction - I know it is possible, but the means in which I garner the motivation to go about it aren't healthy and I'd like to think that having edited around 20,000 words to near perfection out of 88k I could send in a sample to agents.

    The plan was to go independent, but I either want to be motivated to get this obsession either completed or momentarily disregarded and I'm hoping it may be possible to sell the promise of my soul to the industry. I know nothing of approaching publishers, agents, or even advocates for that matter and my main question is whether the manuscript being 'unedited' entirely would be a big turn off if I go about pursuing this methodically.

    I know it cannot be edited by external sources, as it is not only the prose that is the issue. Also, with the subject matter of Apartment 7 being as direct as it is...I don't have a clue what the genre or audience is. I hear that PMs don't work right now but I genuinely thought I’d get emotionally crushed upon registering here - that is kind of what I wanted in a way.

    I posted the synopsis elsewhere but I would appreciate some personable insight, if anyone has the time to spare. I don't wish for this to be perceived as a plug...but I hope I have garnered some good will following my evil critique spree. That surprised me too.

    Haven't thought about publishers, don't have a clue where to start. I've seen a lot of smoke screens in people and whilst I appreciate the anonymity on here, some guidance would be appreciated. I am happy to take off the mask, on occasion.

    Jimmy commits suicide and awakes trapped inside of his apartment. The divine nature of his confinement soon becomes apparent to him. Unsuccessful in escaping himself, a lone television is his only distraction in this prison, chronologically displaying the seven periods of time most influential to his demise.

    Watching this point-of-view production, Jimmy describes each sin-fuelled episode and reflects upon them in first person, in a contextually enabled duality of tenses. The psychological implications of eternal regret are exhibited syntactically. With his constantly increasing tendency to integrate multi-syllabic rhyming and phonetic symmetry in his claustrophobic rhetoric, I hope to convey his mental degradation to the reader. It blends dark-comedy whilst addressing a major issue in today’s society….

    Again, sorry for the self-indulgence and thanks for instilling an absolute fear of myself into me.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2021
  2. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    Not an expert but this sounds like literary fiction, but could be fantasy or mystery depending on the plot.

    Edit: I'm probably the last person to give an opinion on this, but I'll get the ball rolling.
     
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  3. Malum

    Malum Offline

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    Thank you. Definitely fiction. Too many people in my small town think it is a true representation of me, rather than an exaggeration intending to step back from cynicism... I don't know. The behaviour of most people around me IRL switched upon me garnering some confidence from this forum. It's been a weird 6 months. They were happy when it was my ill stupid book.
     
  4. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    When I say 'literary fiction' of course I mean in contrast to genre fiction, but I'd be interested in what other forum members have to say based in the synopsis.
     
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  5. B.E. Nugent

    B.E. Nugent Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    No idea about publishers. I've sent stuff off to magazines and publishing houses but mine is not a success story. I googled publications and went from there.

    So.....not at all helpful. I'm really just posting to say I want to read yours when it is published.
     
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  6. J.T. Woody

    J.T. Woody Book Witch Contributor

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    i'm in the same boat you're in.
    I'm going back through my 135k manuscript and making minor edits (cut this scene, tighten up grammar, address weird spelling, etc.). So far, I've edited 200 pages. I still have about 270 left to do. its taking me longer, because im hand editing a hardcopy. then i'm going back on my laptop and editing the digital copy.
    I have enough to submit, but im on the fence about submitting a an "incomplete" edit....

    in terms of publishers... I'll share with you what another member shared with me
    (i'll edit it in my response when i find it)
     
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  7. Idiosyncratic

    Idiosyncratic Active Member

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    The trouble with that is that it's the agent who decides what you send them and on what timeline. While many ask for the first X pages with the query, if they like that they might ask for the full manuscript, and they want it within a day or two of asking, not after you finish editing. If you don't send it asap, the chance is gone.

    If you decide to send the full mostly unedited manuscript, well, agents need to eat, and they don't get paid until the book sells. Some agents do editorial passes, but there is a big difference in time and energy needed to help edit a polished later draft and a first draft. When given the option between two books with the same potential earnings, but one is polished and the other isn't, the polished one is going to win every time. And since agents get hundreds to thousands of queries on a regular basis, there will always be polished ones. while I'm sure there is someone out there who's gotten an agent with a first draft, they're lightning in a bottle.

    On the note of the synopsis, while it sounds interesting, it is not a synopsis. A synopsis goes through every major plot beat and twist, including the ending, in plain language and is typically 500-1000 words long (based on what the agent or publisher asks for). It looks like it could be a start to a query, but is too short for that as well. Check out the blog Query Shark for some good examples of queries. Additionally, the second paragraph telling about what you're aiming to accomplish and how your prose choices reflect that is not something you would include in either a synopsis or query, let your sample pages speak for themselves. It definitely sounds like literary fiction though.

    Best of Luck!
     
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  8. J.T. Woody

    J.T. Woody Book Witch Contributor

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    i couldnt figure out how to insert a quote into an edited post.... so here it is:

    in terms of publishers, i find books that have similar themes and genres (i know mine falls along the lines of SF/F, but its not HARD science fiction and its not adventure/magic fantasy, but definitely has spiritual elements). I look up the author's agent and add that agency to my list. I also look at the publishers that have published my favorite books. Tor, for example, has published the majority of what i like to read. I'll also go on Tor.com and look at new releases and who their agents are.
    I have a 3 tier list of agents/agencies now
     
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  9. Malum

    Malum Offline

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    Thank for for your encouraging words as always, I don't want to half-ass it and it's just a case of getting across what I'm trying to pioneer. Really need to get well again and find the drive I once had. I never mean to wave away such kind words but the impact some self-assurance has had on me hasn't been all that good. It's still taking some getting used to. It's a weird one.

    Me too. Two further edits handwritten notebooks and then digital, I find jig-sawing the sentences in paragraphs and editing the vocabulary/content to be too much of a task at once so it's more the content than the formation. It works well, whenever I can bring myself to do it. Handwriting is great.

    Yeah, I don't feel entirely comfortable putting the whole synopsis out there (on here, anyhow as it does have a methodical structure), either confident/paranoid as I may be. This is a comfort to some extent as there has been years of retrospect and occasional polish. It's just a shame my standards have continually risen each year. That is valuable information to me though and it has made me think twice about jumping the gun on approaching publishers. There are definitely levels to polish if we're talking literary fiction and I need to stop pressuring and worrying myself.

    That is exactly what I needed, in terms of a strategy in approaching this. I'd be inclined to rush in somme frenzied spam in my younger years. I appreciate it, a lot. Thanks for all of your responses. I think it may be appropriate for me to look specifically for the most appropriate of agents and send out a few probes in its current state and then maybe relocate myself and finish the damn thing. Yeah, I imagine attachments are a big no-no in the industry now. The idea of remote access viruses terrify me half the time. Looks like it's always going to be literary fiction the voice in my head torments me to make. I have my own domain for it and such but organisation of files and a personifying them to each agent is something I will bare in mind - no half measures, it seems. I will probe a few options.

    Thanks again, to all of you.
     
  10. SapereAude

    SapereAude Contributor Contributor

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    I experienced that, indirectly, a number of years ago.

    I had a friend (who has since passed away) whose older brother had written a book. My friend knew a literary agent, who agreed to take on the book as a favor to our mutual friend. After somewhere between six months to a year, the agent couldn't find any publisher who was interested. At that point, the author died. The family (my friend, the author's widow, and one of the author's daughters by a first marriage) decided to "self" publish the book as a memorial to the author.

    The problem was that none of them knew anything about publishing, or even had a computer. At the time, I was editing and laying out a newsletter for a non-profit organization on whose board both my friend and I served. So they asked me if I would take on the book as a favor. Silly me, I agreed to do it. There was at the time just one physical copy of the manuscript, which my friend retrieved from the agent and turned over to me. So, after typing the whole thing into a computer file, I then started to think about editing. Oh ... my ... gawd! It was a mess. It took a long time to edit it, and I didn't do nearly as much as I would normally have done. The author was a scientist and, like many (dare I say "most"?) scientists, he wrote almost exclusively in the passive voice. Normally I would have changed much of that to active voice. In this case, because the book was to be a memorial, I elected to maintain it as close as possible to what the author had written, making only the spelling, grammar, and punctuation changes that were absolutely necessary. And that was still a lot.

    My point in this meandering saga is that it's not a surprise that no publishers were interested. The manuscript that was being "shopped around" was so far from being ready for publication that I'm pretty certain they took one look at it and said, "NEXT!" I think the lesson is that the manuscript should be in at least a semi-final form before approaching agents. It's not just a timing or scheduling issue. There are a LOT of writers out there, all trying to get published. If you hope to be noticed out of the piles of queries and manuscripts agents receive on a daily basis, you really need to put your best foot forward. As someone once said (or wrote), "You only get one chance to make a first impression."
     
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  11. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    Did the agent even read it? Wouldn't he tell the author "Hey, you got to change this stuff to have any chance at publication"? Of course, maybe he did and the author/scientist just didn't know enough to realize what a deal breaker (no pun intended) the style/voice was.
     
  12. SapereAude

    SapereAude Contributor Contributor

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    I don't know. I also don't know how long the agent had the book before the author died. All I know is that they couldn't find a publisher, and I was handed a can (box) of worms.
     
  13. Hammer

    Hammer Moderator Staff Supporter Contributor

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    As others have said, yup, sounds like Lit Fic to me, and potentially a good read. Definitely dig deep and finish the editing though - you need to that whether it is self-pubbed or trad-pubbed, so just do it. Obviously if you self-pub you might want to consider a professional edit too, but that will be an easier (and therefore less expensive!) task if you and the editor are polishing a diamond not a turd.

    I might be unusual, but I love editing. How many times do you read a book and think yeah, I get it, but I would have written... well editing is your chance actually to do that! Brilliant. And the best bit is that you can do it time, and time again without ever getting bored (actually that's an exaggeration, but it can be enjoyable if you have the right attitude (write attitude?))

    Ouch.
     
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