Greetings my friends! My Story is a dark post apocalyptic tale so we have a colorful cast of misfits and psychos! My greatest dillema is making characters who despite being dispicable and depraved the readers still root for them. Here are a few examples. Bonesetter: A mad doctor who is part of the four horsemen group who harvests bonemarrows of his victims for his dying and comatosed wife. He is holed up in a fortified hospital other than his trait of being a mad doctor. I have a hard time thinking about other sympathetic traits. His motivation is his wife...So I guess im in the clear. Wild: A bandit in the wasteland part of the Four Horsemen group.Famous for his unhinged brutality and is a serial rapist. My vision for this guy is similar to 'Vaas Montenegro' (Its hard or impossible to make a rapist likeable.) I want him to be funny and a masculine figure to his group. But Im having a hard time finding a sympathetic trait for him. And sadly I dont know what is a good goal or motivation for him. Which is important since he will join the protagonists group acting like the Gestapo. Im open to your opinions.
Honestly, I can't see anyone rooting for a rapist. Bonesetter I can root for. Kylo Ren and Riddick I can root for. The Guardians of the Galaxy I can root for. Any character damaged by experience and gone astray because of it, but maintaining some code of honor, and showing compassion in some capacity, is someone I can root for. But a rapist? Sorry. You're talking about the epitome of selfishness. Unless, you're raping rapists...
I'm on the same page as the other two, so I'll offer a follow-up: why do they need to be likable? Are they protags? Because you can have side characters who aren't likeable, even ones aligned with the heroes. They can be unrepentant evil fucks, just don't ask me as a reader to cheer for them. Have your ever played Borderlands 2? That game has a great villain - he's completely awful, in part because he's convinced that he's the hero, and people largely love him as a character while hating him as a person. He's incredible fun to interact with and incredibly satisfying to finally beat. Maybe that's more what you want - a love to hate, can't wait to see get what's comin' to'em type. Just a thought. Because as they stand now, yeah, I don't see any redeeming quality for Wild.
I don't see anything remotely likable about these two as written. Bonesetter has potential but if they're victims, with helping the wife as a side benefit instead of the reason, it's still a pretty murky place to get anyone to root for him. You're going to have to do better if that's what you're looking for. The rapist has zero going for him and if he's the protag I'm chucking the book at the wall. And I'm confused about you wanting him to be 'funny and masculine' to his group and hoping that him being a rapist is not the only way you can see him being that. Plenty of men are both funny and masculine and don't feel the need to rape anyone. Like @izzybot said, if they're not the protags I can deal. But there's no way I'm going to like them - especially not the rapist.
Honestly, Borderlands is great in general for characters who're enjoyable assholes. I know it's not a one-to-one between games and novels, since the games let you laugh off horrible shit while you personally set fifteen dudes on fire with you magic powers before throwing your exploding gun at them, but man. There's probably still something to be learned there about character development and empathy. I think.
Rel Relax there is no way in hell Wild is the protag. Thanks for the feedback Wild is going to play an important role later on. Helping the protagonist silence pockets of civilian uprising by rape and pillage. He will also play a part in one of the most fucked up scenes I can imagine. The point our hero stoops low! Hmm..Maybe I should remove that trait. Again thank you!
Unless I'm misunderstanding this, this doesn't sound like a goal likely to receive enthusiastic support from a reader.
Okay, so, first of all, I'm completely relaxed. You'll know when I'm not. Second of all, he's helping the protag by use of rape and pillage? I can only assume that your protag is okay with this? Which, in my humble opinion, makes him a dick too. Just to be clear. I'm all for flawed, damaged, at times controversial heroes, but I think you may be laying him a little too low for him to stand up again, the way it's coming across. All of this above, with the caveat of - write whatever the hell you want. You can't please everyone and trying is pointless. I'm not going to be your audience, but that's okay with me and it should be with you too.
And also, because I failed to mention it before: If you somehow think that raping the wives and daughters of the men doing the uprising is going to quell it, you're writing about a fantasy world that I don't find to be at all believable.
No. It is one thing to root for the bad guy. It is another entirely to try and get me to like them, or find them redeeming. Want to write despicable, then write it raw, but don't expect too many to jump on board with the story.
I believe your issue here is trying to make the character likeable. That is ultimately the reader's decision. My personal reading bookshelf (as opposed to the research bookshelf and the others that dominate the closet I call an office) is filled with characters that I do not like, characters that I would never have a drink with in real life, and a few whom I hate more than any person I have met in real life, yet the books stay because I am emotionally invested in the characters. This is a direct result of the author making the characters real, three dimensional beings with all the flaws and virtues that we all have and letting the reader decide how they feel about them. In short, be true to your characters, spend some time in their heads, get to know what makes them who they are and why. That is your job as the creator - the rest is up to the reader.
Wild was a kind and generous man, and spent much of his time up the orphanage, or entertaining down the old folks home. Then one time the colonel in the audience at that folks' home, he enjoyed Wild's rendition on the spoons, he took Wild back to his room for a 'whiskey,' he said. The moonshine hardly passed Wild's teeth. He gnashed those teeth, his lips turned to snarl, his eyes faraway and evil like a cat. With an axe in hand he staggered door to door, rampaged, ravaged, and raped those 'dames' as he called the bed-bound victims. He awoke among a mess of loungers, of armchairs. The faint scent of urine hung in the atmosphere. But Wild remembered nothing, only his appointment for the birthday party and his date with a florist. ... So I think you can probably 'carry it off,' but I'd use a device, like a Jekyll & Hyde, or mental illness. Otherwise 'rapist' is difficult - and offensive especially when linked to 'masculine.'
I think the trait should stay if it's important to the character and furthering their motivations and the plot. But if you don't see the trait doing that for the character, then I'd say get rid of it. But do whatever you find the characters are doing for you! That's what I always think for my characters when I'm trying to figure out what to keep and what to toss.
I popped into this thread because I've written more than one dickish MC that I somehow have to get the audience to root for. But what's described above is way more than what I would consider being a dick, so I really have no advice here.
Hi Harkness, I have extensive experience of being a dick; unfortunately I am also not likeable, but I can couch you on the first part. Most people are naturally optimistic, they like to see the best in every situation; a pessimist sure breaks that buzz, and there is plenty of bad to break that buzz with. I think the dick part is that simple- just break people's dreams - and even though you are doing them a favour - even though you are letting them down easy - they will choose to blame you rather than their own lack of talent or ability. Stupid people always need someone to blame for their own failures. To be liked (on top of the above) you need a little bit of psychology and a little bit of psychopathy. You need to pretend you have their best interests in heart. It is an unpleasant trick to achieve unless you are heartless, but look at most politicians or company directors for pointers.
The problem with a character like Wild is that they are very one-dimensional. Most, if not all that they do or say is taken at face value. A sociopathic/psychotic personality is not very complex, because they generally lack the conscience and empathy that most people (or so I'd like to think) have. This makes trying to have a sociopathic/psychotic character that the audience can relate to or understand virtually impossible. Think of a villain/antagonist from a popular book series such as Voldemort from Harry Potter. Voldemort is very much a one-dimensional character. He does not develop emotionally or mentally during any point of the story. The best uses of a one-dimensional character are as a plot device to develop the main character and/or "final boss" I won't say that a one-dimensional character is a poorly designed character, just that their connection to the reader/viewer is very limited, and the events they are involved in are rarely meaningful. They do, however, have great impact on the story. Voldemort was exactly this. He made a great and intimidating villain, but he is fundamentally broken, so I can't relate. On the other hand, characters like Lucius Malfoy and Severus Snape grew throughout the course of the books, despite being antagonists. I really enjoyed their interactions with Harry and the rest of the main cast, and felt a connection to them. Their depth as characters made me look forward to more scenes with them. Now, even then, I didn't "like" everything about them and there were definitely parts of their personalities that I outright disliked. Essentially, don't feel pressured to try and make the readers like ALL of your characters. In fact, you can even make characters that most of your readers might not have ANY interest in or connection with, so long as they serve a purpose to the story itself.
Fair point. I guess I have to tone down the violence. I mean the point of being a secret police is being secret. Or! The protagonist can ask Wild to create mayhem and generate support by claiming it is the work of his rivals. But it comes with a cost. Im not even sure if we can call him the 'Hero' at this point. Thanks for contribution!
I have reflected after reading this. You do have a point I dont need the readers to root or atleast like them. I just wanted to create a character that is human. But the side of humanity we rather not speak of. Cheers and thank you for replying to my post!
P.S My title is misleading it should be.. 'How to make a character likeable despite being absolutely sick and depraved monsters?'
Give them a damn good reason for being sick and depraved monsters, no one is born a monster. The problem is... your story probably isn't about why they are monsters and you'll find you're wasting time. Giving the character "Wild" a WHY for what he's doing is probably better than just showing that he does what he does. You could also make him more evil and forget the likeable part. If you can't find anything redeeming in him how can your reader? edit: You could probably also make him likeable, not in the sense that he is inherently likeable, but instead that his presence is "necessary" for the building up of other characters and making them very likeable.
