1. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    What character trope/archetype are you most tired of?

    Discussion in 'Character Development' started by naruzeldamaster, Apr 30, 2022.

    I know there's one that I'm slowly seeing more and more often. Particularly in Japanese media.
    On one hand I like it, it's sometimes amusing, but they never do anything unique with it.
    I don't know what it's called, but it's the 'I am stoic and have zero emotion or I'm super seri-OMG IS THAT A CUTE THI-fuck, uh, never mind, carry on.' kind of girls.
     
  2. Not the Territory

    Not the Territory Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

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    Noble savage trope, mainly because the character ends up being a collection of creeds idealized by the modern civil man with the pretense that people are corrupted by civilization and not mere human failings in general. I think its existence is self-contradicting.

    Make no mistake, I do like it when characters have to be at odds with each other's values (and come to understand each other better and grow through that conflict), and adventurer-meets-tribal is a great example of that. A Mary Sue wearing a bone necklace doesn't do it for me, though.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2022
  3. QueenOfPlants

    QueenOfPlants Definitely a hominid

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    I am tired of the "overprotective alpha male" that is a stable of Romance. It just annoys me so much.

    It often leads to scenes like: OPAM tells female lead to not do a thing, because it's too dangerous, female lead does it anyway to show that she's "strong" and then OPAM has to rescue her. While simultaneously scenes where that goes the other way are missing, because somehow the female lead is never more competent in anything than the OPAM. *roll eyes*

    I prefer characters that can judge the capabilities of themselves and each other realistically, so yes, in some instances one character will have to take the lead or protect the other, while the other follows the lead. And it's great if that goes back and forth, according to situation.
    In other situations, they can just let their partner/love interest decide for themselves how much they trust themselves to do and have confidence in that judgement. That's much more healthy and interesting.
     
  4. Joe_Hall

    Joe_Hall I drink Scotch and I write things

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    Women in Refrigerators. Characters, especially women, should matter for more than something to die or be harmed so the male protagonist has something to be pissed about.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_Refrigerators
     
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  5. Fervidor

    Fervidor Senior Member

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    I dunno, I try not to think about it that way.

    Like, more importantly, what is the trope/archetype meant to actually meant accomplish within the narrative? And could you portray the character in a way that feels fresh and creative while still doing so?

    Sure, sometimes it's a genuinely harmful, tasteless and/or archaic trope that should be done away with. (Women In Refrigerators, for example.) But other times it's worth taking a closer look to see if the problem is actually the execution rather than the trope itself. Point is you need to take a step back and actually think about this stuff.

    It's called a kuudere, if you'll pardon my weeaboo. Also known as a "defrosting ice queen." Compare the tsundere who is similar but far more sanguine and explosive.

    The idea behind both archetypes is basically the same: The behavior is a defense mechanism against emotional vulnerability. The tsundere accomplishes this by being aggressive and bad-tempered, attempting to scare any potential threats away. The kuudere does it by being cold and emotionally distant, hoping this will discourage anyone trying to connect. Either way, these characters are scared of getting emotionally close to others - they won't open up because they fear getting hurt. They are inherently lonely individuals who subconsciously reject the one thing they actually need to be happy. That is, at in theory, what's supposed to make them attractive.

    See, they're basically like cats: They may act aloof or asocial, but that's because they're very picky about who they get close to. So, if you do manage to coax some affection out of them, it's very rewarding. Plus, once you see how vulnerable they really are, it triggers you protective instincts.

    Now, maybe you don't like how this type of characterization is usually done, and that's totally fair. We should question if the standard approach is really the best, or at least if it's the best for our own way of telling stories. That is fair.

    But it's still worthwhile to try to understand why it became a popular trope in the first place. And, perhaps, find a way to write this type of character that works better for you? Food for thought.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2022
  6. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    @Fervidor
    Don't get me wrong, I do like Kuudere more than I like Tsundere.
    Though I do like a good Tsundere when they don't immediately go all punchy. (a couple of my favorite characters happen to be Tsundere, but they aren't overtly violent)
    The only thing I don't like about the "typical" Kuudere is that they always do the 'cute fluffy thing is my vulnerability' gag. There are so many other possibilities, video games, music, actual 'girl' things (fashion etc), yet every single time they go with the 'I'm secretly into cute fluffy things and I hate it' I guess I'm more just tired of the same boring joke rather than the trope itself. It's especially bad when the character hates that they like cute, fluffy things, but also want to be seen as stronk and dependable. Personally I'd find it more attractive if a strong and powerful lady was able to expose her feminine side or show what she really likes. Personally I think it humanizes a character when they are OK with being strong/powerful and loving cute/fluffy things lol

    In general though I feel the same way with lots of character archetypes.
    Everyone always goes for the obvious joke commonly seen with x or y stereotype. I guess I'd just like to see more experimentation and (in the case of Tsundere and Kuudere, Tsundere especially) some genuine justification for their behavior. (in universe, not so much why the writers do it)

    I feel the same way about hot spring scenes, most of the time they only exist for fanservice. And depending on the anime/game they always play out in the same way. (I've lost count of the ones where the girls start comparing the size of their tits, I'm sure some girls do that, but like not when the mens hot spring is like right next door I'd imagine lol)

    I've been writing a Kuudere myself, depending on your smell (as in animal scent, like humans have for dogs), and personality, she takes varying amounts of time to 'warm up' to you. The key difference is she's overreliant on first impressions painting a picture, so she can take a while to adjust her view depending on what kind of first impression you make.
     

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