1. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    How would a high fantasy world perceive 'technology'

    Discussion in 'Setting Development' started by naruzeldamaster, May 24, 2021.

    I'm talking even like 'normal' real world technology, computer servers and the like.
    And before you say it, yeah I know 'they can perceive it how you want them to' but this is more of an open discussion rather than a should I/shouldn't I question.

    In one of my dumb ideas that's bugging me right now the 'fantasy' world is a simulation on a planet wide scale, and the real 'modern' world is in ruins, though there are still survivors that live among the fantasy world.

    One of the sillier things that happens in the story (It's inspired by the Tales Of franchise) is that they fight a giant mechanical whale creature. NARWA11. And yes the Narwhale song plays during the fight. The characters attribute the song itself to psychological torture lol Having a hard time deciding if I want them to fight a Nyan Cat bot as well. And yes I know these two ideas are silly as F* but that's the point, it's a bit of levity in a story that's typically centered around dealing with Grief. (in fact the main baddies are the embodiments of the five stages of grief)
     
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  2. Joe_Hall

    Joe_Hall I drink Scotch and I write things

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    I think Arthur C. Clarke summed it up best “Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic”

    Imagine Julius Caesar's reaction if you put him in the passenger seat of a modern sports car...then teleported him back. He would probably describe it as a magic chariot.
     
  3. NigeTheHat

    NigeTheHat Contributor Contributor

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    They'd perceive it a way that made sense in their context, so for high fantasy, that's probably magic and gods. A Nyan Cat monster would probably be filed under something like 'that's a fucking weird dragon'.

    The film Cowboys vs Aliens is quite a good reference for this. We see the bad guys as aliens because they've got a spaceship and advanced tech. The cowboys don't have any concept of a sci-fi alien but they understand religion, so they call them 'demons'. The word 'aliens' isn't ever mentioned in the film.

    FWIW this sounds awesome and I wish I'd thought of it. This is definitely the dumb idea you should write.
     
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  4. Robert Musil

    Robert Musil Comparativist Contributor

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    Another good reference might be "Rome Sweet Rome". It's basically what @Joe_Hall said about putting Caesar in a sports car. Except in that case it's time travel, a US military unit from the 21st c. goes back to early imperial Rome. Maybe analogous though.
     
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  5. Lazaares

    Lazaares Contributor Contributor

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    It really depends on the technology level of the high fantasy world proper. There's quite a few high fantasy worlds where certain technologies wouldn't really matter much (some even exist already). For example, characters in the warcraft universe wouldn't be much perplexed if shown a passenger car or a fighter jet, since they already have those.
     
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  6. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    Yeah, I'm thinking that too.
    Though I still have no idea how to describe a computer terminal from that perspective. I suppose I'll work that out when I get to writing it.
    One of the character's 'name' is 'AA113' which isn't really a joke per say, but a reference to Pixar. (I think that's the number anyway, that thing you can spot in almost every movie if you're looking for it)

    I guess I'm more asking how to integrate it into their depictions. They could see the old world as an advanced race and attribute them to angels (there actually are angels in this world, elves and demons too) and possibly even gods.
    I think they would have some idea of what that technology is since there are a few 'scholars' from the old world lurking about. They're often seen as a little...eccentric, and for some cases that's putting it mildly.
    Thing is this concept comes up a lot and I don't wanna just copy what everyone else does.

    That's a good thing to think about, in many tales of games they do have technology, just not 'our' technology. The explanation for it's power source is magic though.
    I haven't decided yet how much technology I want the fantasy world to have. I'm thinking of stuff that would only work with magic, like a teleporter device.

    I'm also deciding on what to call the old world in the fantasy land. Morytha is a cool name but it's already used in Xenoblade 2

    What I'm trying to avoid is taking too many notes from other ideas/sources. I know it's literally impossible to be entirely original, but I'd like to put my own spin on it if I can.
     
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  7. Xoic

    Xoic Prognosticator of Arcana Ridiculosum Contributor Blogerator

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    "How would a high fantasy world perceive 'technology'?"

    ... It depends. How high is it? :supercool: :supergrin:
     
  8. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    Approximately 420 feet into the air.
    And yes, that's a double pun :p I am not sorry.

    I'd say it's closer to your stereotypical high fantasy setting with occasional high tech stuff. (they have stuff like beam katannas from studying the ancient tech) they have analogues for things like computers, but it's all magic based.
     
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  9. Lazaares

    Lazaares Contributor Contributor

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    I meant it rather literally; goblins in the warcraft universe power their industry through oil, drive cars and have HR staff in their army (Or to be specific, GR staff). In the MMO you've quests where you have to help them commit insurance fraud.

    Point of the matter; the assumption of "High Fantasy = medieval" does not always hold. The very goblins I mentioned above partook in an inter-planetary invasion of the demon home-world, but also fought magical fumes in the orc homeworld and faced eldritch horrors in the great cosmic war between light and shadow. Their portrayal is not far detached from our modern world, you could even say it's a satyre of 21st century America - but the world at large is definitely high fantasy with more traditional races. Thus, if you approached a human and explained to them the concept of an ICBM their reaction wouldn't be some awkward primitive grunts, but a remark on the fact it likely is a goblin technology and you should be careful with it.

    A less extreme example would be the project I'm working on, set in a fantasy world with technology level equivalent to 1800s Europe. If my characters faced a mechanical whale, their reactions would already be vastly different than "pure medieval" characters - considering they know what an ironclad is.

    The closest world to the description you have provided that I can think of is Adventure Time, although it's more a children's tale than anything serious. They don't usually react with much amazement to creatures like that; they are quite common in fact.
     
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  10. Accelerator231

    Accelerator231 Contributor Contributor

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    Yo dude. Sorry for the late reply. So anyway I was once interested in such a thing, too. So I read upon a few things. Like Fanny Kemble, and things like' the world the railroads made'.

    So here's the thing: People when gazing upon technology that they're unfamiliar with, tend to try and put it in comparism to what we already know. Fanny Kemble did this, comparing the Rocket, the first steam locomotive engine, to a mare, with 'coal as oats' and 'legs that are great cast iron wheels'. She first of all, described how the journey was incredibly swift and smooth, the speed of the train, and whatnot.... the first of many passengers, in fact.

    Same thing here:

    "There is a great people who made spirits. Not through normal means of the world, but through things like song, dance, language, and protocol. The songs and commands reference each other, providing the pathway and mind of the spirit. And the spirit, like many other such spirits, need a vessel, and these people created vast vessels and avatars, like our pots and shamans, using crystal and glass and metal. And like many spirits their crafted spirits are clever in some ways, and stupid in others. The spirit could not think very well, but it was good at numbers and counting, and obeying its orders, and it was good at remembering, and could recite and reproduce the things it had seen. And like many spirits, it could be in multiple places at once. Thus this great spirit was created, and used, both as a source of information and as a great messenger for the People, reproducing the images and words it had seen and heard, often doing scut work, retrieving great knowledge and books whenever commanded to."
     
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  11. Eliszabeth JA Stevens

    Eliszabeth JA Stevens New Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: May 31, 2021
  12. Oscar Leigh

    Oscar Leigh Contributor Contributor

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    I think relevant to what Accelerator said it would be in reference to their own concepts. And therefore one of the key questions is what is the technology and magic that the fantasy world has like? Use those as references.
     
  13. Accelerator231

    Accelerator231 Contributor Contributor

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    And just what social forms do they have? In fact, do they have the concepts of like, schools, writing, literature, choirs, storytelling, etc... and in what forms?
     
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  14. Leleluv

    Leleluv Member

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    In some stories technology is created solely to combat magic or simulate it. I don't know much about your fantasy world, but are you integrating real magic in your world? If so, is the magic exclusive to a select group? Will most of your magic mechanics rely on offense? If these are also true, I'd assume that normal people would feel intimidated enough by magic to use technology to level out the playing field. Technology in reality is our closest link to the fantastical. If you're including fantasy races in your story, maybe they are the threat that humans are trying to protect themselves from.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2021
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  15. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    I've decided that the threat is elder gods (so Cuthulu and shit though not explicitly those particular gods, but they're elder god level)
    They developed science to counter the magic, they managed to repel the elder gods at the cost of making all the damage to the planet near-permanent.
    They then domed up what was left of humanity in biomes and began the fantasy world experiment. Eons passed and eventually the fantasy became reality, developing on it's own and forgetting the original world existed at all.
    While the 'fantasy' world has magic, it's rooted in science, the various glyphs for magic spells have mathematical formulas in them. (though many are purely nonsensical, the more powerful ones are real formulas, like E = MC Squared)
    The important thing to note, is that by the time the story actually starts, mankind has forgotten science exists at all, as well as technology. They do have magical technology but it's more in line with what you'd expect in a fantasy.
    The Yokai for example, started out as gene therapy to evolve humanity to survive in absurd climates. But it eventually became quite literal.
    Elves were experiments to elongate the lifespans of the average human. (with varying levels of success)
    Angels are literally just the survivors of mankind's original form, they do the whole 'angel' bit because the 'modern' mankind is more likely to believe an angel over a scientist.
     
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  16. Leleluv

    Leleluv Member

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    Honestly, that all sounds amazing and I would love to read a story like that.
     
  17. Fervidor

    Fervidor Senior Member

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    Short answer: "What sorcery is this?"

    Long answer: It depends on a lot of factors that can vary greatly depending your particular fantasy setting, which by definition can be whatever you imagine it to be. How superstitious are these people? How curious are they about new things? Are they more likely to be intimidated or impressed by modern technology? What are their cultural values? How advanced is their own technology? How common and available is magic, and do they have magical equivalents to our technologies?

    I mean, they might have magical space vessels and use enchanted pocket mirrors as smart phones. Their cities might have anti-dragon shields capable of withstanding nuclear weapons. If you go very hard on the magitech angle they may even consider to be the primitive ones.

    Or they're still in the iron age and believe everything we do is witchcraft, or whatever.

    Well, I mean, wouldn't the people in the simulation still have historical records of the old world, and a way to leave if they need to? You'd have to invent a reason for why they'd just forget all that stuff, which would be very undesirable if your whole world literally maintained by technology. Someone would have bothered to write all that stuff down.

    Also, why would they decide to live in a simulation of a high fantasy setting just because the world ended? Was it all just set up by a bunch of D&D nerds or something? I mean, if you're going to live in a simulation there's no reason to make it as comfortable as possible. Is this all an elaborate Fallout-style social experiment?

    Then there's stuff like people in the simulation being unable to kill each other, because why would you ever program that in? For that matter, how do they procreate? A lot of stuff like that you need to consider.

    Basically, having a cool idea is great and all, but the hard part is ensuring it all makes sense.
     
  18. naruzeldamaster

    naruzeldamaster Senior Member

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    To answer your question about it being a 'simulation' it is but it...isn't.
    What's 'simulated' is the altered history of the world, the fact that actual magic exists etc,
    But everything that was organic beforehand is...organic. Humanity wanted to forget the horrors brought on by the elder gods so they retreated into a fantasy. Literally just the fantasy stuff is simulated through elaborate machinery and other technology.
    As for why it's a fantasy world to begin with, kind of? Before the downfall of man several factions prepared weaponized tools with varying forms of inspiration to face the elder gods. It just so happens that the group (who were essentially a bunch of highly intelligent Otaku) that created the tools capable of repelling the Elder gods were, to be blunt, nerds. Their logic was the only thing absurd enough to tackle absurd gods was something equally dumb/bewildering, and Memes seemed like the perfect outlet for that. So they literally weaponised shit like Caremeldancin and Nyan Cat (among other things) to both anger the elder gods (which somehow worked, because fate has a sick sense of humor that way) and repel them. Hell, even the strike force is named and designed after tropes seen in anime and stuff. The name of the operation was Valkyrie Profile, which is a JRPG from a while ago. Though that fact has little to do with the plot, just a tiny reference.

    I agree the hard part is making it make sense, which is why I'm working out the looser details over the finer ones first. After all the first half of the first chapter is dedicated to the world ending more or less and I gotta have a good explanation hah.

    The collapse of humanity is roughly about...maybe 20% of the plot? It's more of an elaborate excuse for the fantastical things to exist and why mankind would want to re-write history. I'd argue that nearly everyone being driven mad by elder gods would be a pretty good excuse to want to start from scratch again.
     
  19. Trubbshore

    Trubbshore Banned

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    They would be agog.
     

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