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  1. Nightwraith17

    Nightwraith17 Member

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    How much ordinary life should you show?

    Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Nightwraith17, Sep 18, 2017.

    In my fantasy book, chapter 1 is short and starts with a bang, so in chapter 2 I slow down and establish more of a normal day so readers can get a feel of the unique fantasy setting, meet the characters, etc. Something important happens about 5 pages into the second chapter. Before that, it is ordinary life, figuring out what kind of world this is.
    I'm very conflicted. When I cut that, and dive right into more action, and try to fill in the blanks later, I feel that character and setting development is sacrificed. But is 5 pages too dragging? Keep in mind that 5 full pages on Microsoft is more than 5 pages in an actual book.
    Do you enjoy soaking in the setting before getting to the action? Like for example, the first chapter in The Hunger Games, in which something important does happen, but we also follow Katniss in her regular activities from waking to afternoon.
    I just want to know what other people think.
     
  2. surrealscenes

    surrealscenes Senior Member

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    Your fantasy world setting needs to be set at the beginning. Readers need to know how your world is set up.
    Do people go to wells to draw water, or does magic or creatures take care of it?
    You need to show your MC in their everyday life (whatever it is at that point) so the reader gets a sense of who they are.
     
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  3. Nightwraith17

    Nightwraith17 Member

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    Actually they turn on a faucet. I was sick of fantasy worlds where it was all medieval and no technology.
     
  4. newjerseyrunner

    newjerseyrunner Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2022

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    I like stories where the normal lives of the characters are prominent. It helps me relate to the character and care about the character. If I don't care about the character, I probably won't care about the world they live in either.

    Also, five pages isn't really much unless it's a small novella. The difference between five pages and eight in a book that's five hundred pages long is negligible. Furthermore, 5 pages before editing is little evidence that it will be five pages after editing. I tend to write as much detail as I can get in for my first draft, then take the scissors to it. Every story that I've written for any of the contests on this forum started about twice as long as they ended up.
     
  5. surrealscenes

    surrealscenes Senior Member

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    There you go. As a reader, I need to know this up front, as well as what else is 'different' in your world.
     
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  6. Nightwraith17

    Nightwraith17 Member

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    I'm already on my second draft and I've trimmed it a little...just wanted to know how much to trim.
     
  7. Megs33

    Megs33 Active Member

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    i think the best way to know if it's worth keeping is by asking yourself "what purpose does this information serve?"

    let's say your character has OCD. a good chunk of the "ordinary day" focus may be on how she's been cleaning her apartment all morning because it doesn't "feel" right. She might mull over her day and worry over details while scrubbing the baseboards. Her brother might visit and jokingly move a vase that she had meticulously placed dead-center on a hall table, and an exasperated but loving argument ensues after a brief flare of panic. What purpose do these everyday life moments serve? Each ordinary thing that is happening tells me something about the MC, about her mannerisms, about who is in her life and how she feels about them.

    You could talk about a character waking up, getting dressed, and eating a bowl of cereal, and it could be completely unnecessary. But what if he had been up late last night because he's been battling insomnia? now the process of waking up is slow and groggy, and i'm wondering why he's so tired. maybe he eats cereal because it's the only thing he can afford, or he buys cheerios exclusively because his recently-deceased younger brother used to eat them with him every morning.

    i recommend going through what you've written and ask yourself what purpose it serves. are we learning something meaningful about your characters or their world? even something as simple as turning on a faucet as you mention above could offer depth. the handle could be a little screwy, only working if you turn it just right. maybe your character is easily frustrated and hits the handle when he goes to wash his breakfast dishes. his room mate might laugh and joke that it's not fair to pick on a faucet that can't fight back. now i know that the MC is easy to anger, his roommate finds him amusing at minimum, and they lack either the money or the motivation to fix the faucet.

    tl;dr: ask yourself how each moment showcases your character and/or the people around him/her. consider how you could make it more vivid while still remaining relevant.
     
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  8. ghostkisses

    ghostkisses Member

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    I'm unsure of whether this is helpful to you, but I think one time uhh... some dude to do with Sherlock (I met him and I forgot his name oops)... Umm.. It will come to me... Well anyway! He said that when he's writing or whatever he does, if he doesn't feel like what he is writing doesn't show how characters react to one another (so we get a feel of what characters are like), and it isn't a vital piece of the plot, he will cut it completely.

    But I also remember scoffing and going "no way!" and deciding to ignore his advice anyway... But then I realized I'm not actually ignoring his advice bc my "filler" scenes between characters did actually show how characters react to one another...

    MARK GATISS! That was it. Or it might have been someone completely different who said that. I don't know. I have bad memory.

    Also, I feel like if the setting drastically changes then you might want to talk about it more than you might normally so you see that sharp contrast and go "wow, this was such a bla bla place what happened..." and you get an idea of the effect whatever something has had on the setting. Otherwise, I'd talk about the setting a bit less and focus more on characters and their interactions so that we get a feel of their relationships, which of course could intertwine with their everyday life. And cut the filler talk ("hello gladis.. how are you on this fine day? lovely weather we're having!")
     
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  9. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I don't agree that it's ordinary life--every paragraph or two, they refer to the Hunger Games.
     
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  10. SnapFandango

    SnapFandango Banned

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    I think a mistake would be introducing your audience to an inaccurate genre i.e. if you place them in the ordinary worl, then it will jar them when it becomes extraordinary.

    Times have changed and all fluff and filler has been removed, because it is met with resentment. People do not want slow suspense, they want jump scares, sadly.
     
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  11. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

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    I don't think this is a "need". It's one approach, for sure, but it's not the only one.

    Personally, for reading and for writing, I prefer to start where the story starts and fill in necessary setting details later.

    It's a style choice, not a right/wrong situation.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2017
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  12. Nightwraith17

    Nightwraith17 Member

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    Yeah and that's what makes it a perfect balance. We're learning about something of major importance while following people through daily activities. It's the balance I want to strike.
     
  13. Nightwraith17

    Nightwraith17 Member

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    I've actually written two versions of my opening: one with more details, and another one that nosedives into the action. I'm gonna get people to read both and then vote. Thanks, all you guys, for helping.
     
  14. FeigningSarcasm

    FeigningSarcasm Active Member

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    Initially thought this was going to be a question as to whether or not you should write a character doing something mundane like taking a dump (to which my answer is an emphatic yes while publishers cry out in horror NO).

    But it is not- so continuing on a serious foot...

    I think it's certainly important to flesh out the world when you're writing a fantasy. Especially if you've invested a lot of time in constructing the world. I like to be immersed in a new world and just tossing me into an adventure often leaves me confused. There's a lot of wasted potential and I often find myself asking questions rather than enjoying the story. Five pages isn't anywhere near as long-winded as some applauded fantasy authors like Tolkien and I typically recommend steering clear from his level of detail.
     
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  15. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    Define normal?
    GIR Zim Laughing.gif

    Fantasy I think typically starts out with the "normal day",
    and then ends up going into the non-ordinary territory.
    Though I don't see how it would hurt to have it described
    in the 2nd chapter, provided the first is a not so ordinary
    day.
    :supersmile:
     
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  16. Nightwraith17

    Nightwraith17 Member

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    Yes, the first is a very unordinary day so the second slows down a little and lets readers soak in the world before the action ramps up again.
     
  17. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I think that you need something not-so-ordinary to be happening, even if it's not directly tied to the primary plot. The village has been hungry and someone just killed a seal so there's a feast and they'll all be fed for a day. The grain mill burned down. The Whatsit Regulator in the ship has broken and they're not going to be able to complete a run for someone who gets really angry when work for him isn't completed. Something.
     
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  18. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    I totally agree with this post.

    You can feed your readers lots of information painlessly if you do it as Megs33 suggests. Filter the information through your characters.

    How does the setting impact on them? What do they think of the objects you're describing? What about their 'ordinary' day do they enjoy ...or hate? This gives you a chance to set the scenes, but also to develop your characters and get the story moving in a certain direction—but nobody will notice you're doing all that work. They'll just get drawn in to the story.
     
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  19. Lew

    Lew Contributor Contributor

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    I think the first five pages should do something to spark the reader's interest, whether you do that by some sort of action, or by catching the reader's interest in this strange world. My wife @K McIntyre used a very unique opening her first two pages of Parham's Mill. The readers think they know what they are seeing, a perfectly ordinary event - then find it was not, but now ... what is it?
     
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  20. Atrophied_Silence

    Atrophied_Silence Active Member

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    It is definitely a good idea to hook your audience in as soon as possible but also not undermining necessary world building. You want to paint a proper picture for the readers to follow and understand. But as long as the in between action moments are used for character building and immersion I think you will be good. For example: The MC turns the faucet on and washes their hands. They point out the ugly scar that reminds them of an event that caused it.

    Believe it or not the action sequences are not the only entertaining part of the story. The addictive nectar of good stories is always made up of the characters you either love/hate. Hope this helps somewhat
     
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  21. Elven Candy

    Elven Candy Pay no attention to the foot in my mouth Contributor

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    Be careful with starting out with action then slowing down with a "normal day." You can easily make the audience impatient with that. Depending on how it's written, I'd start with the normal day and then dive into the action. I tried to start my WIP with action several times, and my alpha readers said, "It starts with too much action; I want more background." Granted, my characters are dragons so it's not exactly a normal situation, but it still stuck to me that action isn't always the best opening. Heck, my 10 page short story starts out with one and a half pages of "normal day"--that's a whole 15% of the story! I used that one and a half pages to introduce the main character and his friends, and why the readers should care about him.
     
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  22. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    The ordinary is the beginning of the hero's journey, like Frodo in the Shire during the preparations for Bilbo's birthday. We establish that Hobbits are not wistful nor adventurous folk, yet we start at an important event that foretells trouble. Bilbo is the one with the One Ring, and he's making plans to run off with it. In the first of the Peter Jackson movies, everything up to the point where we see Gandalf coming into the Shire and Frodo reading in the woods is prologue, not the ordinary day.

    The story starts with an ordinary time for your main character, but trouble is already brewing. In the Harry Potter books, Uncle Vernon goes about his ordinary day, but notices trouble brewing. In that case, I'd actually consider chapter one of "The Sorcerer's Stone" to be a prologue, and I don't think it was written well. In chapter two, Harry's normal day involves going to the zoo on Dudley's birthday, but trouble is brewing in the background because of his eligibility for Howarts fast approaching.

    In The Hunger Games series, the story begins on Reaping Day, so there's our brewing trouble. But the action doesn't really start until Katniss volunteers as tribute. That's the call to adventure. So you need to juxtapose brewing trouble with an ordinary day, and ramp it up until your main character gets hit in the face with the trouble, and has the choice to either ignore the trouble (let Prim go as tribute) or get involved (volunteer as tribute).

    From there, the action is more drama than melodrama (more talk, less kaboom), but we feel the rising sense of tension leading to the climax, hitting the turning points along the way. I'd say you have the first two chapters reversed. You don't want to start off fast and then suddenly hit the brakes. You want to build momentum, starting with an ordinary day that has trouble getting closer and closer to your protagonist, then continue to build up that tension until the climax, after which you can slow it down a bit. Think Frodo getting rescued by eagles; from that point forward, everything is much slower and calmer than everything between "What must I do?" and "It's done. It's over."
     
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