I think this is a pretty good point! People have multiple traits, and to go extreme one way or the other we'll just make the person a 1D unlikeable asshole. Either too whiny or too macho. Who is most serieses are seen as the joke character that you're not supposed to like. To the o p, your character can be a tough Warrior and still be a woman. It might be interesting if she going for some bravado thing and it's kind of learns how to be secure with herself
Not in the movies. Comic books can get away with this kind of stuff, but the moment you have a live action representation of the same characters, things get real different. Non superhuman characters such as Batman will usually perform superhuman feats, such as lifting and throwing an enemy several meters away from themselves. You won't see that in the movies. Human characters in comic books also survive getting hit by characters with super strenght, and then come back for more. If you saw in The Avengers Hawkeye getting punched by Hulk and then get up, you'd call bullshit on it (And I kind of call bullshit on Black Widow getting shoved by Hulk and somehow not break a single bone when she hits the wall, mind you). In comic books that's normal, so to take the comic book description of the character and apply that to the movies (Or in this case a book) doesn't make any sense. The OP didn't ask about "feminine attractiveness" in regards to female warriors, but I'm still pointing this out to avoid a common mistake that many writers make. Having a female warrior is fine, but if you then describe her as super hot and thin, with all the guys dropping their jaws the moment they see her, with everyone infatuated because of how pretty her soft, unhurt, definetely-not-a-warrior's face is, then you're treading into nonsensical and cliched territory.
That could be. There are male characters who get away with this, however. It might be interesting to have a female character like that as a sort of commentary on how such male characters behave and are accepted. Of course, if you’ve ever read Best Served Cold, by Joe Abercrombie, Monza Murcatto is pretty much an asshole and still gets away with being the MC. There’s not much to like about her.
And that would still leave all of the peak human abilities plus the tech. Her build is just fine for the background offered. On a side note, TV and movies face limitations when it comes to casting. If they have to choose between acting skill or a more muscular build, they'll generally go for skill. Literature, comic books, and video games don't suffer this limitation. You're talking about a problem that doesn't exist in OP's creative medium. And considering you concede there are male characters that likewise get away with similarly unrealistic feats, I'm not sure what you're trying to get at anymore. Fiction is idealized, and that's not a problem within reason. Somebody who's a skilled enough or lucky enough combatant may not have a "warrior's face". Gotta say, I find your fixation on this puzzling.
If you're going to state opinion as fact, I'm going to point out what it really is. A woman who fights isn't necessarily going to look rugged. Neither is a man. These things are a spectrum.
In the story I'm writing, my protag is an antiheroine. You can view her as a female warrior. I've actually drawn several pictures of her. Yes, she's beautiful yet she has a lot of battle scars on her body...arms, back, legs, abdomen (usually covered up by her clothes....she likes to hide them because she tries to keep them a secret); she's not what you would call 'thin'. She has a strong build, not bodybuilder by any means. Lean and tough. She earns her respect from those surrounding her, men and women. There will be no guys in the story gushing about her hotness or whatever. In her story, I want to veer away from romance and things like that. Her life and story isn't about that. I want to focus on comradeship and alliances in her life. I agree with you that in movies and books these days cliche territory would be having the dudes drop everything when they see this super hot chick that can deck anyone she encounters...even though that chick may look too thin to do anything. I know in video games these days they even have all these chicks who are wearing very 'exposed' armor and generally have skinny build and arms...how is that believable? if they're supposed to be this unstoppable badass fighter? Lots of the chicks from Final Fantasy and lots of JRPGS are like this. They are actually wearing the equivalent a swimsuit for their armor and can one expect that to shield them from bullets, arrows, swords, etc.? I know game makers market these games for sex appeal to the male gamer but c'mon. I would rather have a realistic female warrior to play as versus some chick whose running around in very revealing armor. A great example of a brilliant female warrior is the new gal Kassandra from Assasins's Creed Odyssey. She's built tough, she has muscles and scars, and has armor appropriate for her time that matches that of her male counterparts. I love when people give respect to the female characters and be realistic. The new Tomb Raider games since 2013 have made Lara Croft into a more believable person. I never liked the games beforehand where they had her as a skinny supermodel that could do all this crazy stuff. If Lara is jumping around like Nathan Drake is in Uncharted, she obviously should have some muscles in her arms and legs. She shouldn't be skinny and she should have a few scars on her after all the hell she's been through for these new games since 2013. New Lara >>>>>> Old Lara Anyway, end of little rant. Just hope this helps the OP with her story. Make your characters believable and that way they won't be cardboard one-dimensional.
Thank you for your input. I mean she sounds rather tomboyish...very tomboyish...but I know that is who she is inside and out. I know a lot of female friends who used to be tomboys growing up and during high school and they kind of grew out of that. However, a young adult woman can still be a tomboy, right? Yeah, there will undoubtedly be a few readers that will say “Oh...this chick acts too much like a guy” or something equivalent. To those readers, look...this young woman grew up with a rough childhood and she grew up with a father that raised her this way to be a fighter. She developed a thick skin. She will have her moments where she’ll get angry, cry, happy, laugh, etc. She is first of all a human being, I don’t want to think of her first as a “female character”. She is a character and this is her story. Women like her may not be very common in real life but this is who she is. She is not afraid to stand up to male opponents and take them on in a fight, whether that’s fist-to-fist or swordsplay. She can stand her own. She trains incredibly hard and has a passion for what she does. She has a confidence inside her that will be extremely hard for her opponent to snuff out. She isn’t scared, though she will have her moments too.
That’s how I want my protag’s world to feel like. Don’t label the characters in the store as “male soldiers” or “female soldiers”. They are “soldiers”. My protag is a soldier who happens to be a woman. I love TV shows that don’t play to stereotypes. Attack On Titan is definitely an anime that treats both males/females equally. I watch that show and I don’t even think about Mikasa being any different from Levi or Eren or Jean. On that show there is no division between men and women. There are equal amounts of men and women soldiers on that show. I think it’s very respectful and nice to see. A few other shows that do a great job of doing this is The 100, Legend of Korra, Avatar the Last Airbender. I think most people can watch those shows and honestly not even have male/female roles come up as an issue in their mind. As a female, it feels really good knowing that we have shows like this.
In my protag’s world, I feel males and females both comprise this group of knights in equal numbers. My protag isn’t the only female serving on her group of knights. Everyone in her world is given an equal shot and opportunity. I believe everyone who acts around her respect her for who she is and becomes as she matures and becomes stronger with her training and journeying. When a commoner or typical person sees her all suited up in her armor, they wouldn’t say anything like “Why is a woman serving in our group of knights?” Or whatever. My protag isn’t this unnatural young lady that can do all these amazing tricks and crazy fighting skills. No no no. She isn’t perfect by any means. I don’t want to make her singled out if that makes sense. She wont be the only female serving in her group of knights. About the dress code for people in her society, a woman would typically go in a dress or wear one. Even when she’s not in her armor or working and she goes to a party event or relaxing at home, she would rather wear a nice set of jeans or pants and a nice shirt or something. She doesn’t care to show her skin...she’s a bit of a private person. She would hate to wear heels to anything as they ruin her feet (she’s tried them on before). She has her own likes and dislikes as everyone has them. Would society in general find her or treat her as unusual, an outcast? Certainly not. People won’t call her out for acting a certain way. I love her for who she is as I know exactly what she would do in any given situation. “You fight like a guy” “You fight like a girl”...no no no...”You fight like a warrior” that’s the way her world will sound and it will be fully believable and my protag is part of that club.
A point of curiosity: You're referring to "knights" and to "jeans", which suggest two very different technology and pseudo-history levels. Is this essentially modern technology?
I have problems with authors and people who act like a female character has to be masculine to be a strong female character, not authors and people who have/ like a female character who is masculine. If you were saying that she could only be strong as an extreme tomboy, I would be mad, but you're not saying that. Strong female characters who are masculine and strong female characters who are feminine are equally valid. I think your character is fine. Also, on things that have been said previously on this thread, some men are attracted to extremely muscular women, while others are not. Men all find different things attractive.
I have to admit since you mentioned it...I'm a dude and I'm attracted to muscular women. Not bodybuilder type but that girl Jacqueline Carrizosa is like the perfect type for me. No doubt, she is shredded and she looks damn gorgeous. She ain't a professional bodybuilder. Just loves to workout a lot. She's an auto mechanic and a dirt bike racer as well. She survived a really scary accident and got run over by a vehicle and broke two parts in her back and lost a kidney. It's remarkable she survived. She attributes her strong body for allowing her to survive that. She is an inspiration for everyone. If one wrote a female character like her, she would definitely be considered strong in multiple respects.
To be honest, I believe some men are very intimidated by muscular women (extreme or not extreme). As a girl myself, I get a bit angry when these dudes need help lifting a heavy object and say “Oh, we need to get another man to do this”...I don’t like it when people in general treat women like they aren’t very strong. I am fairly well toned myself and I love helping people lift heavy things...like help lift a refrigerator into a pickup truck for delivery or something like that. Even at my work, lots of my fellow female coworkers will shy away from anything that has to do with heavy lifting, even if its a team lift item. Yes men can do the job but don’t count out the women. Some of us have some meat on our bones and we work hard for it. There is one gal I work with though that is a beast, she’s like one of the guys. And she acts like it’s no one’s business...she doesn’t show off or anything. Just wants to help out her fellow coworkers. And of course she is a tough one, has nice arm strength.
Sorry about the confusion there...was late when I typed that. Haha...I was just saying when she’s not all suited up in her armor and has it off her leisurely clothes would be the equivalent of jeans or regular pants or whatever. Could see her wearing pajamas and slippers at night to relax herself. She would probably sleep in bed naked as long as it’s warm inside her bedroom...she lives alone single so be by herself. On her feet all day for her job, she needs a lot of “me” time
I’ve drawn my protagonist. She has some very nice and toned muscles but she is not a bodybuilder. She ain’t no supermodel with stick thin arms. Boulder shoulders but absolutely not bodybuilder type...she is not extremely muscular...regular muscular. I find her very attractive for who she is inside and out. She has some rough battle scars on her back that may not look so nice but she keeps those covered up with her clothes and armor. She can handily go toe to toe with a trained male fighter because she believes in herself, she has a very big confidence. Like you say...it’s all about experience and knowledge too in addition to physical stats. She may not have the biggest physical advantage over every male but she develops enough experienced and knowledge over her training to defeat some of her opponents.
My dude, if she's too masculine then a lot of the women I know IRL are too masculine. Not liking dresses is not special. Not wearing heels is not revolutionary. Being able to compete with men is not actually uncommon. Where you make your mistake is in failing to see her as an individual who is not confined to averages and generalizations put forth by people who more than often have no experience with athletics outside of high-school PE. Furthermore if you actually look into history it wasn't nearly as misogynist as movies like to depict. Most of the struggles depicted in fiction are the plights of a romanticized upper class. The life of a surf or commoner was very different from that of royalty and the social roles a lot more flexible. There have always been women farmers, women soldiers, women entrepreneurs and women scientists. There were women that passed themselves off as men and were only discovered when they died or were accused of buggery. You really don't have to look hard to find a plethora of trope defying examples. There were even women tyrants and despots. I would worry less about the gender presentation of your character and their placement on a bell curve and more on their reasons for being the way they are. If you want her to be knight, don't make the path t0 that goal easy. It only becomes unbelievable if she doesn't fight hard enough to get there. If she's physically bigger and stronger than average so be it. There are women who are bigger and stronger than average and there always have been. Now what are the repercussions of that trait? How does she deal with them? Is that how people deal with said issues in real life? I personally am not a fan of the whole virginal princess trope in general and would find a common woman that doesn't want to spend the rest of her life doing hard labor and conspires to be a knight to gain wealth and status (or to get revenge) much more interesting. If the knights at the time were from wealthy families and hadn't done a single honest days labor, I have no doubt that a woman that spent her entire life working the fields would whoop their asses. And it's not I think unbelievable or cliche. That's the direction I would go in if it were my story but it is 100% possible to tell a compelling story about a virginal princess knight. You just have to come up with good explanations for her behavior.
Nope. Like it has already been stated treat her like an individual and write her that way. It is not like there aren't bad ass woman who hang with the guys on the field. I will let someone address their thoughts about her personal sexual exploits though. Good luck.
Thank you for your input. Made me think about things differently. Now....a virginal princess. Hmm...I mean I could keep all the sex/romance stuff out of her story. Maybe she will, maybe she won’t. She will have relationships with others but more comrade-like or friends/family. Not necessarily romance. She can still be with someone and not have kids and stuff. I feel if I were to keep her a virginal princess knight or write her like that, I would have very good explanations for her behavior.
That's a good point. You just end up with the female equivalent of an 80's action movie lead, with nothing to them but stylish violence and cool one-liners, and maybe a bit of angst that justifies why they're shooting people. Fun if you just want to watch fight scenes and stuff blowing up, but not terribly interesting as characters.
Spoiler: Possible NSFW This is the body-type of my female princess knight. Obviously, she has some very well-defined arms, pretty solid legs, and an amazing core (I don’t think this picture does the gal in the photo justice...she has a very well-defined six pack). I don’t find this particular female athlete in my post here gross. Dang, she is absolutely stunning. Wish I had a body like hers, I’m working on it. But back to the point, my philosophy is to treat her as an individual on the battlefield. She won’t be the only badass chick in this army of knights she joins. She will work extremely hard to get there and knowing what she looks like...her build...I even drew her on a piece of paper and I am an experienced drawer...all that helps me know who she is. She isn’t a stick-thin arm fighter. She has boulder shoulders and actually look like she can kick anyone’s ass. She is not perfect but she likes to be fearless.
Dude. That chick is totally a lean mean fighting machine. My antiheroine would have a similar body type to hers. That girl you have in the photo is obviously muscular....I don't know how tall she is but she seems like a big girl as in she's very strong, lean, tough. She definitely isn't what you would call "skinny". She has some meat on her bones. Those tattoos on her arms make her look even stronger too. Definitely a well-built person. She is more ripped than a ton of guys I know at work or where I live in general. If you were to make a character out of this lovely gal and put her in a fight, I think people would be very intimidated by her. And the way she would carry herself in battle would be a important point to mention. Confidence in yourself to fight definitely shows and can effect your opponent. Thank you for finding this photo of thing lovely young badass woman. Inspiring. She works very hard for those muscles she rocks on her body. I think people jump the gun that females will get big and bulky when they lift weights or work out...I wouldn't call her bulky...big maybe just because she has boulder shoulders and a muscular build.
