1. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Looking for feedback on my concept

    Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Viserion, Feb 19, 2020.

    The story I’m writing starts with the main character’s hometown (part of a foreign nation that raids the Empire) being destroyed. His family is mostly just killed, but he and his brothers are enslaved. The younger brother is sent to work as a scribe, and the MC and his older brother work on the farms. The older brother is burned at the stake after getting caught in the room of the farm overseer’s daughter.

    The MC (Elenxes) strikes up a friendship with a guard about his age (17) and the two plot an escape. The duo makes off with a fair amount of silver, escaping when the overseer dies. Elenxes suggests that they go to the Rim, where he came from. He also discovers that he can transform into a dragon on occasion, but I’m not sure how best to add that.

    How does this idea sound?
     
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  2. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

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    My question is: What is the impetus for the guard to help Elenxes?

    Seems like a really risky move. You haven't said a single word that mentions it, but I immediately smell a romance. :love:
     
  3. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    No comment, but I can say that that’s not the focus of the story.
     
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  4. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Well, assuming there's a solid motor under the guard's caprice, then cool.
     
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  5. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    No comment, but I can say that that’s not the focus of the story.

    Edit: Ignore this, accidentally posted it again.
     
  6. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    I assume this means that he shouldn’t just be driven by ambiguous romance? In that case, yes.
     
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  7. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

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    In this case I'm referring to the caprice. I get that maybe you want to keep some of these cards close to your chest, but all I'm saying is there defo should be a card that answers to that guard's reasoning. When I read your post, that risk the guard is taking is what jumped out at me, so there should be a solid drive (the motor) behind that choice. That's all I meant. ;)

    ETA: I just saw your second post. Yes, that. ;)
     
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  8. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Arsien (the guard) is also motivated by sympathy. He knows Elenxes saw his brother burned alive, and given his kind nature decided to help.

    He later sticks around to make sure Elenxes doesn’t use his power for evil.
     
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  9. The Multiverse

    The Multiverse Member

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    Within storytelling, there are a wide variety of mechanics that can be employed to bring out transformations. Either he's born with the innate ability and it surfaces during puberty, or gains the ability later through direct contact with a dragon or drgonian artifact. Contracts with creatures or spirits of said creature have been used for transformations as well. Said mechanics almost always exist within a trial that pushes the character's body/mind to the breaking point. May times the trial is far too much for the character to handle and while they fall into dispair the powerup reveals itself and the character overcomes the trial reborn so to speak. Though these mechanics are commonly used in trials, its important to note that trials can begin because of these mechanics being discovered. An example, the MC tramsforms into a dragon, but the dragon's instincts are powerful and difficult to overcome resulting in him doing something that makes people afraid of him. The powerup would create his trial and he would have to overcome the obstacle.

    Just throwing out ideas. Hopefully you find something to fuel your imagination here.
     
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  10. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Thanks!
    My concept was that he’s always been odd-feverishly warm, never ill, but the power emerged later.

    Here’s a description of the dragons in the story:
    Dragons are serpentine reptiles. Their upper lip has a notch, like snakes. Two longer horns crown their heads and smaller thorns mark their jaws. A pair of black fangs extended below the lip. Thorns ran down the spine, two shorter ones between each longer one. Three talons adorn their wings, and the webbing has three fingers supporting it. The chest is armored with a single plate, and ribbed scales cover the belly. Gauntlet-like scales cover the legs, and birdlike talons arm the feet. The tail has a row of curved spines on each side. Thick scales fill the gap between the armored plating of the spine and belly. Smoke rises from the scaly hide.

    Edit: It’s also taboo to draw dragons with eyes. It’s believed that would create a new dragon.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2020
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  11. The Multiverse

    The Multiverse Member

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    Ah. Its an interesting idea. However, don't forget weaknesses. Dragons throughout lore have always shared a common weakness. A scale on their chest that grows in reverse of the other scales. It usually marks the heart or some other vital weakness.
     
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  12. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Cannibalism and the fact that they destroy the magic that makes them live kept their numbers low, are their main weakness. Several dragons were slain by arrows piercing the eyes, and they don’t swim. One, Ormyr, died in a collapsing pyramid.
     
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  13. The Multiverse

    The Multiverse Member

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    Sounds more like Wyrms than Dragons. Dragons have always been extremely intelligent, often being refered to as superior lifeforms. Subspecies of dragons like Wyrms and Wyverns lacked the higher intelligence that dragons possessed. Though i should say, i'm a bit true to lore until i hit gray areas where you can finesse details as you like.
     
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  14. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    They are intelligent, but not human. They had no concept of language, peace or mercy. More like ASOIAF dragons than Smaug.
     
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  15. Fervidor

    Fervidor Senior Member

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    Well, I'd assume it happens when he's in some dire situation where turning into a dragon serves as a kind of instinctive defense mechanism. It's probably more important to figure out why he can do this, though.

    Honestly, if it were me writing this, the hero turning into a dragon would probably be a very central, plot-vital thing and most likely a major part of the reason I decided to write the story in the first place.

    I dunno, I've never been a fan of very specific, strangely convenient weaknesses like that. How does a huge magical apex predator even end up evolving such a feature? Kinda like how vampires are extremely powerful yet for some reason have like five or six very easily exploitable weaknesses, almost as if specifically designed to give normal people a fighting chance.

    I much prefer just making the antagonists very, very dangerous to compensate.

    Though, one option is to make the transformation itself very taxing or risky, not something the MC can do at will, and possibly have it so he can't fully control himself while in his dragon form.
     
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  16. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Well, the reason he can shift is deliberately ambiguous at first. It doesn’t fit in the basic laws of magic, just like the Dark Lords. The first Dark Lord (the Iron Emperor) was completely void of magic, and no Sorcerer could touch him. The second Dark Lord (the Blood King) was the creator of blood magic. Armies rose at his command, and the dragons were created by him.

    The third Dark Lord (the Inferno Prince) has not been born, but legends say that he will be a lord of fire.

    The MC being capable of becoming a dragon is the main driver of the plot. The transformation drains magic in a large area, and when he reforms anything on him is burned to ashes or melted. He’s also practically comatose after a transformation.

    This, but less extreme, is the typical result of him going out of control. Early in the series, he’s barely capable of killing a few people. At the end, he’s virtually unkillable.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2020
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  17. J.D. Ray

    J.D. Ray Member Supporter Contributor

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    When I read your first post, I thought, "he should leave out the dragon bit," but now I see that it's a core feature of your entire world, not just this story.

    Regarding your description of dragons, I hope that's a clip from your notes and not an infodump you put in the actual story. If the latter, break it up and distribute it around ("show, don't tell" as the admonition goes).

    Have you considered having him make at least an initial change to dragonhood when he watches his brother being burned? It seems like a good overlap, a good trigger.

    BTW, you asked if we liked the concept. Concepts are best reviewed when there's a story context. What's the story about?
     
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  18. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    It’s from my notes. At the time of the story, the last dragon is 200 years dead, and all that’s left is bones and skins. The most people know about dragons is “they’re unholy abominations that obliterated kingdoms”.

    Good recommendations, I’ll post a more detailed overview soon.
     
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  19. GrahamLewis

    GrahamLewis Seeking the bigger self Contributor Contest Winner 2023 Contest Winner 2022

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    Short answer: as concepts go it's fine. But concepts are the easy part, almost anything can be made into a good story. The key is in the writing. Bring it back when you have put it some of it into writing.
     
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  20. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    Hi Viserion - Mod hat on here. I'm afraid you can't post your actual work here for feedback—so I've deleted the previous very long post. That will need to go into the Workshop, once you've fulfilled your requirements for posting there - two weeks' membership, 20 or more posts around the forum AND two critiques of other people's work on the forum.

    Once you have your 2 weeks and 20 posts done, your status under your avatar will automatically change from New Member to Member. You can get a head start on your critiques now, though, if you haven't done any yet.


    New Member Quick Start


    You are allowed to discuss the details if your plot on this thread and get suggestions—and so far so good. You've got quite a bit of feedback on your ideas. You're well on your way to fulfilling the Workshop requirements as well, so just keep going. It won't be long before you can post in the Workshop. :)

    If you don't have a copy of your post, I can restore it to you in private.

    Cheers for now,
    Jan
     
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  21. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Fair enough.
     
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  22. J.D. Ray

    J.D. Ray Member Supporter Contributor

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    I read the piece before Jan deleted it, and will have some feedback for you when it shows up in the workshop. Ping me when it gets there so I know to look for it.

    Conceptually, I think the premise is a good one; that you have something to work with. I'm still not clear on what the story is, but I've been under a bit of a rock lately and may have missed your explanation.

    Looking forward to seeing more.

    JD
     
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  23. Fervidor

    Fervidor Senior Member

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    Well, I would expect so - always a good idea to keep things a bit mysterious at the start. It's just that you made it sound like the dragon thing was and afterthought that and you hadn't figured out how it fit into the story.

    So, magic can only affect other magic things in this setting?

    I like how they all seem to have their own personal style going on. Is there any formal connection between these guys, or do they appear independently of each other and "dark lord" is just what people in this world call particularly powerful warlords with anomalous magic abilities?

    So, basically a desperation move he's only want to use if there was no other option. Will he eventually learn how to control it and use it in a less destructive manner?
     
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  24. Viserion

    Viserion Senior Member

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    Magic can affect anything except dragons and the First Dark Lord. Dragons just eat magic, and the First was completely immune to anything magical at all. Eventually, the last thirteen Sorcerers just had a person stab him between the ribs.

    No formal connection, but the Blood King claimed the mantle of Dark Lord thousands of years after the First. Interesting thing, the iron raiders the MC comes from worship a trinity of Iron, Blood and Fire.

    He will learn to use it better, but it will always be a dangerous, destructive power.
     
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  25. Fervidor

    Fervidor Senior Member

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    Ah, so he was literally a void for magic, rather than just void of magic. Gotcha.

    You'd expect that would have been the first thing they considered once they realized magic doesn't work on him.

    Now I have this amusing mental image of a bunch of wizards tossing spells at the guy while he just stands there laughing, and someone goes: "Guys, just stab him!" But the wizards are like: "But we already tried the the magic blade spell, it didn't work!"
     
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