Male Deaths vs. Female Deaths

Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Marthix2016, Jan 27, 2018.

  1. Marthix2016

    Marthix2016 Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2016
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    73
    That's the way it should be. That's what's happening in my current story right now. Everyone is fair game. Lots of people will get on the wrong side of my villainess and she has a very short temper, lemme just she she will kill and kick the sh*t out of them when she does it. Pain is her form of pleasure.
     
    Cave Troll likes this.
  2. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2010
    Messages:
    15,262
    Likes Received:
    13,084
    Are we talking purely about deaths by violence in this thread, not deaths in general?
     
  3. Azuresun

    Azuresun Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2017
    Messages:
    418
    Likes Received:
    573
    Do you have a source for that? I'm not saying you're lying, but vague phrases like "It is believed...." set off red lights.
     
  4. The Dapper Hooligan

    The Dapper Hooligan (V) ( ;,,;) (v) Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2017
    Messages:
    5,864
    Likes Received:
    10,738
    Location:
    The great white north.
    This is from the Statistics Canada website:

    Police-reported data show that the risk of violent victimization among adult males (aged 18 years of age and over) is comparable to that of adult females. Adult females accounted for 51% or about 152,000 of the 298,000 victims of violent incidents reported to the police in 2008, while some 146,000 victims were male.​
     
  5. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    10,462
    Likes Received:
    11,689
    That's for all violent crimes, though. For sexual assault, from the same source:

    In 2008, the rate of police-reported sexual assault against females (68 per 100,000 population) was more than 10 times the rate for males (6 per 100,000 population), with females accounting for 92% of sexual assault victims in Canada. Overall rates of sexual assaults for female victims are significantly greater than males across each age group (Table 1, Table 2).

    It is worth noting that sexual assaults go unreported to police more often than other types of violent offences, regardless of whether the victim is female or male. According to the 2004 GSS on Victimization, about 8% of sexual assaults were reported to police, compared to about 40% of physical assaults and about half of robberies (Brennan and Taylor-Butts, 2008). Furthermore, male and female victims showed no significant difference in their likelihood of reporting sexual assaults to police.
    That last line is interesting, because I've often heard that men who are sexually assaulted are much less likely to report, leading to underestimation of the number of male victims. But if this report is accurate, that isn't the case. Which, now that I think about it, makes sense. There's absolutely shame involved in reporting a sexual assault for a man, but there's a hell of a lot of shame for a woman, too.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2018
  6. Rosacrvx

    Rosacrvx Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2016
    Messages:
    698
    Likes Received:
    427
    Location:
    Lisbon, Portugal
    Interesting and true. I hadn't thought of it that way.
     
  7. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    Who is sexually assaulting these males?
    Are we talking mostly homosexual relationships?
    How the hell would a woman, even one with some physical prowess have the capacity to assault a man? Sexually or otherwise.
     
  8. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    10,462
    Likes Received:
    11,689
    The terminology is frustratingly opaque - what does "sexual assault" mean? It certainly includes forced penetration (rape), but depending on jurisdiction it can include a lot more besides. Unwanted groping (with varying degrees of force included or not included), etc.

    A physically weaker person can certainly assault a physically stronger person - if a tiny man walks up to a huge man and knees him in the balls, that's assault, regardless of relative strength. And, of course, there are many individual women who are more physically powerful than many individual men. Add in other coercive elements that may prevent a victim from being able to refuse contact, and it's all pretty messy.
     
    Lemie likes this.
  9. GrahamLewis

    GrahamLewis Seeking the bigger self Contributor Contest Winner 2023 Contest Winner 2022

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2017
    Messages:
    2,853
    Likes Received:
    4,901
    Location:
    an oasis of PC midst right-wing extremism
    Currently Reading::
    Zen Flesh, Zen Bones
    Seems to me you haven't read enough. Without trying to dredge up names, I think I've read many books with female deaths. P.D. James' A Certain Justice comes to mind.

    I suggest it's all up to you. It's your world you are building. Every character is unique, though I think sociologically speaking men are more likely to be involved in violent activities than are women. But those are generalities. Women die in shootouts, kidnappings, hijackings, robberies, revenge killings, life insurance scams, arson (on both sides of the action). If your story is consistent, you can have as many "cool" death scenes as you wish for each and every character of any sexual persuasion -- though I think no character will him- or her- or theirself feel it to be cool.
     
  10. Marthix2016

    Marthix2016 Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2016
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    73
    Both. I brought up this topic since I've considered it while writing my own stories, especially my most current one. Wondering whether how I portray a particular character's death...whether male or female...will impact my audience...I don't necessarily want to make a particular character's death "softer" because of their gender. It just seems female character deaths are quicker, less painful, and softer than male character deaths...at least in most of the stories I've read and shows I've watched. Given what has been said in this thread so far, I can see why given the trope. I think a lot about my main villainess in the story because I feel her death should feel one that is justified given how many people she's killed under her command and especially at her own hands...I don't want her death to feel quick or soft. Given all the pain and suffering she causes in the story, she deserves a hard and painful death. I want it to pull at reader's emotions too. As I write the ending scene, I see part of myself in my villainess and I think she is very human and easy to understand but her mindset is twisted up on what she thinks is right. I don't want readers to necessarily 'hate' my villainess even though she does a lot of terrible things but I want them to feel saddened by her story too. I want her to be one of those villains where readers feel a little bit sad by her death. I don't think there is any way I would have her survive at the end of the story...I want her death to be a very important part of the story and I need to do it perfectly right. That's why I brought this topic up and see what people say, it's helped me write part of my current story's ending. I want to thank and appreciate everyone who has replied to this thread and shared their thoughts on this. It's a very important subject matter to me and I want to portray deaths in my story in a presentable way.
     
  11. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2013
    Messages:
    3,406
    Likes Received:
    2,931
    By performing sex acts on him and/or forcing him to perform sex acts on her against his will.
     
    Lemie and CoyoteKing like this.
  12. CoyoteKing

    CoyoteKing Good Boi Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2017
    Messages:
    781
    Likes Received:
    1,562
    Location:
    Kennel
    Man, I just don't understand this thought process. Not trying to offend, I just don't get it at all.

    You don't need to physically overpower a person in order to hurt them.

    One time I wrote a story where a male character is sexually assaulted by a woman. Someone wrote me a message telling me the story was "unrealistic" because "women don't do that." I wasn't really sure what to say, so I didn't say anything at all.

    [Sorry for the derail.]
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2018
  13. The Dapper Hooligan

    The Dapper Hooligan (V) ( ;,,;) (v) Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2017
    Messages:
    5,864
    Likes Received:
    10,738
    Location:
    The great white north.
    If you're drunk and she's sober: that's sexual assault.
    If you say no and she keeps going: that's sexual assault.
    If she sticks her hands down your pants without you agreeing to it first: that's sexual assault.
    Coercing someone into sex using threats of violence, blackmail, et cetera: that's sexual assault.
    Sexual assault is not just someone forcing yourself on someone that's fighting back with all their strength.
     
  14. GrahamLewis

    GrahamLewis Seeking the bigger self Contributor Contest Winner 2023 Contest Winner 2022

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2017
    Messages:
    2,853
    Likes Received:
    4,901
    Location:
    an oasis of PC midst right-wing extremism
    Currently Reading::
    Zen Flesh, Zen Bones
    One additional comment. In real life people don't always, in fact rarely, die a death proportionate to their actions. From what I see, anyway. Poetic justice is nice, and it does happen, but when I read of a character dying that way, it usually seems forced, like a fairy tale. Are you trying to be realistic, or trying to write a morality play/story?
     
  15. Dragon Turtle

    Dragon Turtle Deadlier Jerry

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2018
    Messages:
    453
    Likes Received:
    878
    In addition to the many non-physical-strength-related situations people have already brought up... you know it's possible for a woman to be physically stronger than a man, right?
     
    Simpson17866 likes this.
  16. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2013
    Messages:
    3,406
    Likes Received:
    2,931
    And capable of using weapons like guns, knives, bats...

    Or taking unarmed fight training.

    Or catching the man off-guard.

    Also: none of these are mutually exclusive.
     
    Dragon Turtle likes this.
  17. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2016
    Messages:
    22,569
    Likes Received:
    25,885
    Location:
    East devon/somerset border
    Although at the risk of straying back into rapey ryan territory its harder to coerce a man to have full sex against his will because if he's unconcious, drugged, drunk , or terrified he's not likely to get an erection .... of course its still possible to perform sex acts etc, but full intercourse less likely.
     
  18. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    But there's the technical aspects of penetration... you know? How does a woman force a man to get an erection, and then have sex with him? It just doesn't make sense to me. Yes, I've heard of men who're battered by wives, or a girlfriend... but really, does that happen so often that we should care about it?

    I mean I've had many times in my life wherein I've dealt with an unwanted or inappropriate erection... in high school during Geometry Class, at my Grandmother's funeral, on the It's a Small World ride at Disneyland... but I can't imagine it under the circumstances you've outlined.
     
  19. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    Sure, but not so often that we need to turn it into a crusade.
    Are there men's support groups for this sort of thing? My god, I hope not.
     
  20. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2013
    Messages:
    3,406
    Likes Received:
    2,931
    Less likely, but not impossible. Strangulation, for example, cuts off blood flow to the head, and fluid dynamics says that when you restrict flow to one part of the system, you increase flow everywhere else.

    A lot of women who rape men get away with it because the assumption is that since he was erect, therefore he wanted it.

    What.
     
    CoyoteKing, Dragon Turtle and BayView like this.
  21. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    10,462
    Likes Received:
    11,689
    How many times does a crime have to happen before the victims deserve support and compassion?

    I'm not sure if you're just being deliberately provocative here, or if you really think there's a connection between the frequency of a crime and the trauma of it.
     
  22. Dragon Turtle

    Dragon Turtle Deadlier Jerry

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2018
    Messages:
    453
    Likes Received:
    878
    It is possible for a person (no matter their sex organs) to be aroused but not want to have sex. There seems to be a misconception here that rape typically involves a lot of struggle and fighting and terror, but that's just not always the case. There are a number of reasons why someone might not consent to sex, but not resist violently.

    And like others have said, you can have sexual assault without penetration.

    I don't know? How prevalent does something have to be for us to care about it? Men being abused by female partners is not a problem of the same scope as male abusers, but I personally am not going to shrug it off. It's never okay for someone to abuse someone else. I'm not calling for a crusade against female abusers specifically, but already one of the aims of feminism is to fight back against the culture of toxic masculinity, and part of that includes standing up for male survivors (i.e. creating a society where men aren't shamed for coming forward... or for joining support groups).
     
  23. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    Sorry, I've not a once come across such men who've been battered to any great extent by a woman. I'm sure it must happen, but no, such a man would not receive any sympathy from me.
     
  24. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    We live in decadent times indeed when we get all weepy over men who can't handle themselves around a skirt.
     
  25. Lemie

    Lemie Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2015
    Messages:
    1,836
    Likes Received:
    2,778
    Location:
    UK
    You're trolling, right? Because people with your attitude are one reason why men are less likely to report abuse in different shapes and form.
     
    CoyoteKing likes this.

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice