1. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    Ox/Buffalo/Cattle as Mounts

    Discussion in 'Research' started by DarkPen14, Nov 24, 2019.

    After playing Albion Online for a bit and getting used to mechanics, I realized that my transport ox mount might be within the realm of realistic possibility, aside from being able to carry 2+ tons and the player, but how realistic would it be to use an ox or similar creature, such as a buffalo or a bull, as a mount, or even a pack mount? After some googling, I've come to the conclusion that they might be easier to care for than a horse or mule, but at the same time harder in ways.

    What kind of difficulties do you think would arrive when using an ox or ox-like creature as a mount that also carries a lot of stuff? What kind of benefits? I'm not researching for anything in particular, I'd just like to hear opinions on the possibility.
     
  2. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    During the siege of the village of Bang Rajan in Ayutthaya (in moder day Thailand), one of the men there, Nai Thongmen, supposedly rode into battle on the back of a water buffalo.

    I don't know any instances of cattle being trained to respond to riders. Cattle are herd animals, and tend to go where the other animals are going, which is why they work well in luggage trains. In warfare, I'm not so sure.
     
  3. Cdn Writer

    Cdn Writer Contributor Contributor

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    I worked with someone who owned a farm and raised cattle once. I did ask him why nobody ever rode cows like they did horses. He said the cows wouldn't accept it, something to do with the fact they had four stomaches. I didn't really understand the reason but it isn't done.

    I have only heard of oxen pulling wagons (slowly!) and plows, never being ridden by a rider.

    I guess you could rig up some kind of a stick to hang out in front of the animal and dangle something like a carrot on the end so the animal will "chase" the carrot. Otherwise....

    That carrot rig was something I read years and years ago about a boy who bought a stubborn donkey/mule and took him home to his dad and his dad set that rig up.
     
  4. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    Interesting. Selective breeding is a thing, and if you google "riding oxen" you find pictures of people riding oxen and other cattle. What about the possibility of selectively breeding cattle/oxen/buffalo/whatever into a breed suitable for riding? Perhaps even a stronger breed than before, better suited for tasks requiring strength to pull off, like ploughing fields or pulling wagons, or carrying large amounts of weight and a rider?
     
  5. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    I suspect if it could be done, it would have been by now.
     
  6. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    But why would we have done it until now, when horses are more suited for long distance treks, and we already had uses for cattle as food and utility animals (pows, carts, etc). Someone would have to consciously decide that they want to or need to ride this animal for whatever reason, and either accidentally over the years, such as with dogs from wolves, or intentionally within a few decades, such as the domestic fox, the ox or similar animal ended up being able to bear a rider. Perhaps horses didn't exist in the area?
     
  7. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    There are plenty of places in the world where horses were not available.
     
  8. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    But how many of those had no other pack animal or method of transport that wasn't walking?
     
  9. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    Lots of them. India, South-East Asia, the Americas, much of Japan.
     
  10. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    In the Americas, dogs, llamas, etc were used for the function. Dogs can carry weight and pull sleds pretty easily.
    Asia, I can't find much. They had cattle at least before trade with europe according to google, and presumable dogs of some kind, wolves were basicallly everywhere that wasn't an island.

    Edit: Which again points to, somehow the cattle would have to be selectively bred to eventually produce riding pack mounts, which would probably be a conscious decision. No evidence of such an effort exists.
     
  11. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    Not a lot of dog riding going on.
     
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  12. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    Dog sleds. It turns out it is actually possible to dog sled on dirt. Kick that puppy into 4 Paw Drive
     
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  13. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    Well, I'll Google for accounts of dog-pulled battle-sleds, but I suspect there won't be many.
     
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  14. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    Well, I have no intention of it being battle related, it just seeemed like an interesting concept, ox as a mount
     
  15. Thundair

    Thundair Contributor Contributor

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  16. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    Where cushions are comfy, and straps hold firm.
    :supergrin:
    onward-sir-honkers-theres-fuckary-to-spread-39322783.png
    I am not too sure, most bovine critters are used a pack animals, and maybe
    employed into the service of plowing fields.

    Oddly enough moose do not make for good cavalry, so learned the Russians and Swedes. :p
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_animal
     
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  17. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    It actually is odd, since reindeer can be ridden and moose are bigger and stronger. Lord of the Rings lied to us
     
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  18. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    In which case, I assume you've heard of an ox-cart?
     
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  19. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    I'm not sure if you're just determined that no one would ever put a saddle on a buffalo, or if you're missing the point. Yes, ox are used as draft animals today. that's not the point, and hasn't been for the whole conversation. The point was the realistic possibility of this:
    [​IMG]
    From a video game.
     
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  20. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    If a dog sled counts then an ox-cart counts.
     
  21. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    Show me a dog large enough for the average man to sit on without crushing
     
  22. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    You were the one who says dog sleds count, not me.
     
  23. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    I used dog sleds and an example of an animal that is used both as a pack animal and as transport. No dog can support the weight of a human long enough to serve as a functional mount, especially in the snow. You can put saddlebags on a dog. You can also strap a few dogs together and strap that to a garbage lid for travel, but none of those dogs on their own can support the weight of an adult human.
     
  24. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

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    And what's your point?

    I say that if it could be done, it would have been done. You think it can. There's no proof to support you.

    So fine, it's your story. Build whatever reason you like into it. That's what's great about fiction. If you want buffalo riders and aren't worried about realism, go for it.
     
  25. DarkPen14

    DarkPen14 Florida Man in Training Contributor

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    It has been done. The power of google


    I had wanted to keep this discussion format, based on the possibility, but you've forced my hand. I wasn't even researching for a story, I just wanted to see what was thought, and your rebuttal is "If it could be done, it would have been done." I present the rebuttal to your rebuttal.

    Now, can we please get back to the realistic possibility of actually riding one of these great distances? Across the yard or on a path is one thing, but what about as a functional mount for regular travel between cities or across states?
     
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