1. John Calligan

    John Calligan Contributor Contributor

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    Physics, White Holes, and the Beginning of the Universe

    Discussion in 'Research' started by John Calligan, Aug 12, 2018 at 7:54 PM.

    Full disclosure, I don't know if I'll ever write anything to do with this. I'm just kicking around an idea.

    To the brain trust: is there any reason why the amount of matter spit out of a white hole should be equal to what created the black hole on the other side?

    If the universe is flat and particles all arise from vibrations in different fields, is it reasonable to suggest that a black hole born from a single star would cause a disturbance in space time so significant that the explosion of the white hole would produce the most powerful vibrations possible across all fields--meaning a single black hole of any size could give birth to an entire universe?

    If the answers to my ignorance exist but are too complicated to explain, can you point me at the theory?

    Thank you
     
  2. SolZephyr

    SolZephyr Member Supporter

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    Standard disclaimer: nobody knows what really goes on past the event horizon of a black hole; there are several different theories, some of which even remove the singularity and thus the possibility of white hole formation.

    Now, addressing your questions:

    1) A white hole will spit out as much matter/energy as its corresponding black hole consumes. This doesn't just include the initial matter from the black hole's formation. If a black hole is swallowing up a bunch of neighboring stars, the white hole will spit all that out the other side as well.

    2) A white hole will not create a universe with any more energy than what goes into it. The law of conservation of energy still holds true across universes (at least according to known laws). It might be possible that a white hole will give birth to a new universe, but unless the corresponding black hole is resulting from the collapse of a large universe, the new universe will not be large (in terms of matter/energy concentration; spacetime itself will likely increase indefinitely for as long as the black hole/white hole pair exists).

    That said, white holes exist only mathematically, as far as we know. Without any real instances to study, there is plenty of wiggle room in terms of speculation for what might happen if one were to form.

    Hope that helps.
     
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  3. John Calligan

    John Calligan Contributor Contributor

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    It does, and that's what I thought.

    Check this out though:

    The zero-energy universe hypothesis proposes that the total amount of energy in the universe is exactly zero: its amount of positive energy in the form of matter is exactly canceled out by its negative energy in the form of gravity.[1][2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-energy_universe

    So when the blanket gets shook out on the other side of the black hole due to the infinite curvature of space time, why not more of nothing?
     
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  4. SolZephyr

    SolZephyr Member Supporter

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    The problem with this is that the idea of a black hole forming a white hole in a separate universe directly clashes with the idea of a zero-energy universe.

    When a black hole forms, the gravity of all the energy put into the black hole would stay in this universe. The energy that gave rise to that black hole, on the other hand, would now be in a separate universe. This leaves a negative balance on the energy in this universe and a positive balance in the new universe (that together sum to zero). In other words, the zero-energy universe hypothesis would need to be extended to a zero-energy multiverse form (not that there's anything wrong with that; we are talking presently untestable hypotheses after all).

    edit: I forgot to answer part of your question: the impact of infinite space curvature.

    While theoretically black holes and white holes have points of infinite curvature, these "points" are exactly that: infinitesimal points. Just as a black hole doesn't destroy the universe for having an extremely localized infinity, a white hole shouldn't create one for the same reason.

    However, as it seems you are looking for a way for this to happen, you could try coming up with a creative solution that is not disprovable by current scientific theories.

    Why not introduce an inter-cosmic medium that black hole-white hole wormholes puncture upon creation? Such a medium, while purely in the realm of science fiction, could hypothetically provide the energy boost necessary for generating arbitrary-sized universes with any white hole's creation. The mechanisms for how this would work would be purely speculation, of course, but sci-fi hinges on speculation.

    That's just the first idea that popped into my head, though. There are probably better ones. There might even be something I'm missing regarding actual theories on white holes. I'll admit that I haven't devoted much time to learning about them, as I see them as more of a theoretical novelty than anything else.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2018 at 2:37 AM
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  5. John Calligan

    John Calligan Contributor Contributor

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    @SolZephyr good stuff, thanks for the input! I appreciate it.
     
  6. SolZephyr

    SolZephyr Member Supporter

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    :superagree:
     
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  7. Some Guy

    Some Guy dilettante assassin! Supporter

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    How about:
    As the black hole turns gravity on itself it pierces the Void, and drags dark matter and energy from the Void, to feed the white hole. Then you can bake-your-noodle trying to figure out why any universe can have an infinite number of black holes, but only one white hole.
    Have fun with that!
    Ooooh, how about a 'null hole', absolutely nothing in it, repels all matter and energy, except for one point at one time. Once inside, you cane go to any point in any universe, at any time, including yours. (Bake mind at 350 degrees until golden crust forms!)
     

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