1. Hollowly

    Hollowly Member

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    Remembering that editing and non-fiction "counts" as writing

    Discussion in 'Non-Fiction' started by Hollowly, Jan 15, 2019.

    I'm having trouble lately because I'm trying to get going on a non-fiction project and worry that while I'm doing so and writing it, that I'll fall out of the habit of writing fiction and have trouble getting back to it. Getting myself to write fiction was a hard won habit and it is shaky enough as it is. I'm still trying to write a tiny bit of fiction everyday but it dissipates my energies from the non-fiction, which is the priority. It is the same with editing fiction, I worry I'll fall out of the habit of writing new words and try to work on another, new story, at the same time as I'm editing. I then end up feeling frazzled, unhappy with either because I feel I didn't give them "proper" attention.
    So what I want to ask I guess is do you find you have a lot of trouble switching back to writing fiction after you have stopped for awhile, whether to write non-fiction or to edit rough drafts?
    I know editing is part of the process and needs to be done, I know it should "count" but as a sufferer of perfectionism and OCD my brain just won't quite let it. I'm also a fiction writer at heart and taking this detour to write non-fiction makes me worry I'm making a mistake and should be focussing solely on fiction. Any input would be much appreciated.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2019
  2. Tenderiser

    Tenderiser Not a man or BayView

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    I write non-fiction all day at my job and I can only see benefits for my fiction, no negatives. I'm not sure why you think it would be a problem - can you elaborate?
     
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  3. Shenanigator

    Shenanigator Has the Vocabulary of a Well-Educated Sailor. Contributor

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    I started in Fiction, switched to non-fiction and like you, found it so all-consuming (and enjoyable) that I stopped writing fiction. Now after more than a decade of killing adjectives and "telling" in a condensed summary at the top fashion rather than taking the time to show the story unfolding, I'm writing my first novel. Re-training myself to use adjectives and to show, not tell, and stretching out word counts is a pain the ass, and I wish I'd found time to write fiction to maintain the skill level I had when I stopped.

    My advice? Make time for fiction so you don't lose your fiction skills. You will have to focus more on one than the other at any given time (I suggest fewer projects at once), but maintain your skills in both because they're such drastically different techniques. Every day for fiction is a lot when you're working on a big non-fic project. Cut back to a few times a week, or twice a week, so you don't make yourself crazy. After your non-fic project is one, reverse it 'til you get your next non-fic project, and so on. Had I been smart, that's what I would have done.

    Editing is a necessity for either. There's no way around that. If you're going to be a perfectionist (I can relate), that's where to channel your perfectionism, because the finished product is all that matters.

    Good luck!
     
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  4. Seven Crowns

    Seven Crowns Moderator Staff Supporter Contributor Contest Winner 2022

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    My problem is that I love to edit. I can revise for hours and it doesn't really matter what it is. Then when I look at my yearly word count, it's pretty stagnant, but it's not as if I haven't been writing. I don't really have an edit word-count. Maybe I should? I shudder to think what it would be . . . For me, even the shortest story would total a hundred-thousand words re-read and edited. So a decent year for me is maybe 300k words, but the edit count would be 6 million? (Probably much higher.) Maybe that's what you should do. Keep two lists of your progress. I don't know about you, but for me, the first couple of revisions ARE writing. The first draft, even with an outline, is just a sketch. If you like charting your progress then chart ALL progress.

    My new trick (not sure if anyone else does this) is to edit while I read. Especially on one-star atrocities. I have to finish, and sometimes I have to steamroll over the prose to do it because it's all potholes and washouts.
     
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  5. Shenanigator

    Shenanigator Has the Vocabulary of a Well-Educated Sailor. Contributor

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    For 2019 I'm following Ellen Brock's advice and am no longer paying attention to daily word count. Per one of her videos (I binge watched a bunch that day so I have no idea which one), she said all that matters is putting in the hours and the final output, and that editing and research and anything that goes into that final product count in those hours.

    The reason for ignoring the word count is, this way we focus on quality instead of quantity. As long as we know how many words the final WIP is, the rest of the word counts don't matter.

    I don't edit books when I read, but I edit newspaper and magazine articles...usually the flow of the sentences, and I re-write poorly ended articles in my head.
     
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  6. Hollowly

    Hollowly Member

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    Tenderiser - I guess I think fiction and non-fiction require different skills, though there's some overlap and that by not writing fiction my "fiction skills" are atrophying. Though I can definitely see how writing one can improve the other. I'm curious, you do non-fiction at your day job but when you write in your free time is it mostly fiction or non-fiction?

    Shenanigator - You're experience is really interesting. I know I like non-fiction that's to the point, but with books I like my writing"show don't tell" and a bit more descriptive. I think your advice is sound, keep writing fiction, even just a few times a week. I just have been getting a bit haggard though and had hoped there might be some other way. Also, that advice from Ellen Brock sounds pretty good, measuring time not word count. I guess I just like the satisfaction I get when I see how many words I've gotten in a day, even if those words could be crumby. I'll have to think about that. I think it could help because yesterday I spent almost 4 hours outlining my book but didn't feel like it "counted" quite as much because I wasn't doing actual writing. I could drive myself nuts trying to get in the hours on both actual writing and the outlining and later editing that are necessary. I'll check out her channel. Thanks for the tip and good luck with your first novel!

    Seven Crowns - Yeah, second drafts that need fleshing out and major rewrites can definitely feel like writing "real" writing to me. It's when you get down to the finer stuff that I worry I should be working on new words on something else as well, but I don't want to lose my place in the story I'm working on. I'm curious if with all your editing do you find a case of "diminishing returns" at some point? I know great art is never finished, only abandoned, but how do you decided when you've edited enough? I think you're right and tracking my editing might assuage any guilt I feel. I guess I'd have to count minutes spent editing? I know you don't track your editing, only have an estimate, but how you would track it, since you're deleting and adding words here and there? I guess time is the only way to measure it. BTW, you're a patient one to read one star books for the love of editing. Maybe you can charge people for your services one day. :)
     
  7. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    Me too! I'm an editing machine.
    I don't outline or write drafts as such. I work the living hell out of a page and usually don't move on until I'm halfway pleased with it. Editing is where the magic happens. I still return to my first few chapters and have those "how did I fucking miss this mess" moments.:)
     
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  8. deadrats

    deadrats Contributor Contributor

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    I'm a little surprised to see nonfiction writers hyphenating the word. I write both, but I do agree with @Tenderiser that writing one can help the other. Maybe it depends of what kind of nonfiction we're talking about. Narrative nonfiction takes a similar storytelling approach as fiction. Literally criticism follows a different set of rules, but still requires a certain skill set. But content writing for pennies and car stereo manuals aren't very creative pursuits.

    I'm not sure why you feel the need to say nonfiction is still writing. Of course, it is. You can count whatever you want, but I don't think anyone is keeping score. I don't consider editing to be the same as writing. It's part of the process, for sure, but revision is a whole different ball game for me at least.
     
  9. JLT

    JLT Contributor Contributor

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    Isaac Asimov was prolific with fiction and nonfiction. His method was to write both simultaneously. He'd have five projects going at once, some fiction and some nonfiction. Whenever he got bored with one, he'd move to another. (In the beginning, he had five typewriters in his studio, each with a different writing project. He was delighted with his first word processor, because it meant that he didn't have to move his chair ... he just took out one floppy disk and inserted another.)
     
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