1. SoulGalaxyWolf

    SoulGalaxyWolf Active Member

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    Trying to make sub-plots?

    Discussion in 'Dialogue Development' started by SoulGalaxyWolf, Dec 28, 2017.

    As I'm writing my novel, I'm writing individual scenes for it (since I downloaded scrivener with the free trial). I realize that in a lot of them it's like I'm shoehorning the "conflict" in the scenes. And sometimes it seems as though nothing is really happening. It seems to have empty dialogue, although I'm trying to get the characters to get to know each other more like, there's a point in the story where my two main characters have to wait around to protect the creature and I thought it would be a good time for them to get to know each other better.
    #
    I know there are ways to make the readers know the character's with something happening, but I also like those types of things where character's (and people in general) have a conversation with each other about serious topics, or about themselves. I'm wondering if I could make it interesting while nothing physical is really happening so long as I have the purpose of getting the character's within the story to get to know each other?
    #
    I'm wondering if character development could be a sort of plot point? or sub-plot? I'm trying to develop the character's relationship since it's about relationships more than the actual plot point of the story which is Kelly trying to find her parents and save them, but I don't want it to be flimsy because I'm trying to focus on the character development.
    #
    The two main characters out of six of them I'm thinking of having some sort of romantic tension but at the same time I still don't want them to get together at the end.
    I basically want to write a story that has a similar atmosphere as "The Raven Cycle" by Maggie Stiefvater. Since her main characters could be described as "loving each other" but they're a group. I hope this makes sense.
    #
    So, in short this novel is a complete mess XD
     
  2. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

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    Can you think of scenes in the Raven Cycle that didn't include something that advances the plot? That doesn't have to be ALL the scene does (and probably shouldn't be all the scene does) but I think the plot is what pulls everything together and makes it make sense. So there would be scenes in which the characters talk a lot, and get to know each other, but they're still doing something plot related, as I recall.
     
  3. crappycabbage

    crappycabbage Member

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    Dialogue is great, but there can be too much of a good thing. Anything in too large doses usually gets boring after a while.

    When you say "physical", do you mean "action"? Because action can be really small and still create plenty of tension. The campfire can smoke something awful, or one character is paranoid because they think they heard something in the bushes, someone cuts themselves sharpening their knife collection, or find their sleeping bag invaded by earwigs... Something small going on gives them stuff to do while talking and it breaks up the dialogue here and there for an easier read. Their reactions to the action reveal stuff about the characters, and probably in a more earnest way than deep conversation does.

    But you decide what works for your own story in the end, so please disregard this if it doesn't help. :)
     
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  4. SoulGalaxyWolf

    SoulGalaxyWolf Active Member

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    @crappycabbage & @BayView
    Thanks, both of your inputs helped a lot.
    The scene I mentioned in the post includes the creatures actions and the characters reacting to it's cuteness and interacting with it. It does show Kelly's and Eli's character more but what you both put made me think about the scene itself more to make it better.
    I will keep both of your advice in mind while continuing my story. I appreciate your time in writing a reply. :)
     
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  5. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    Keep in mind that your chapter needs to be carefully choreographed so that the tension escalates to some end. I had quite a time with one such chapter wherein two characters who've been separated for six months during tumultuous times (the French Revolution) are reunited for a short spell. The conversation begins as you'd expect, with the two very happy and relieved, and making up for lost time... the conversation covers a lot of ground and imparts a great deal of backstory, almost entirely within dialogue. Only the older of the two (French courtesan) understands the weight of the conversation, and in fact this will likely be their final time together. The younger one (12 year old girl) doesn't realize just how serious things have gotten, and that she is being groomed to take up the cause.

    I certainly couldn't have the two characters just sitting about talking, not for a 8,000+ word chapter. They have to be doing something. Valerie (courtesan) is getting ready to attend a play at the opera house where Rosemarie (12 year old girl) lives with her uncle. Rosemarie is helping Valerie dress up for the occasion... but nothing is filler or fluffy. Every last thing they do and talk about is directly related to the story to come, or has some symbolic or metaphorical aspect to it. I suggest that you figure out exactly what you want to do in your pivotal chapter and make a list of those things that need to be imparted to the reader, and find ways to do it that aren't so obvious or feel contrived.
     
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  6. deadrats

    deadrats Contributor Contributor

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    I know everyone works differently, but part of the problem might be that you are trying to write scenes that will piece together in a story rather than trying to tell a story. I'm sure some people could make it work the way you are doing it, but I know I couldn't.

    If you already feel like you have to shoehorn conflict into your story, well... subplots are just mini conflicts along the way that add something to the overall conflict. Character development is not a plot point or subplot.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2017
  7. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I feel the need for examples. It’s possible that your scenes have more plot meaning than you think they do. It’s possible, of course, that they don’t. :) But in that case, we might be able to offer ways that they could have plot meaning.

    Conflict definitely doesn’t have to be physical. And it doesn’t have to involve raised voices or arguments.

    I have a scene where He pours a glass of wine for Her. On his part, this was an instance of courtesy above and beyond his obligations in the situation. She should have been honored and flattered. Instead, she pushed the glass slightly away from herself, rejecting his gesture—in this case, rejecting it in the form that he made it, because he should know darn well that someone of her culture wouldn’t drink wine. In fact, the gesture was likely a test to see if she would act on her own traditions or be intimidated enough to ignore them.

    My point is: conflict. Now, it’s my job to set up the reality sufficiently that the reader has at least a chance of seeing the conflict inherent in that glass of wine, and I may not have. But it’s still an instance of conflict without big action.
     
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