So I recently read that the following passages are completely different because of the lack of quotation mark at the end of paragraph one: vs. In the first example, Jules is speaking both in the first paragraph and the second. In the second example, since the first paragraph has an end-quote, the second paragraph is a new speaker - presumably Al. Does anyone have a reference to this rule? And if it is a rule, would you actually use it, or would you avoid having the reader relying on tiny end-quote marks to make it clear who is speaking? Even if the lack of end-quote mark is noted by the reader, would your average reader be aware of this rule to understand the implications to the text? Does it make sense to divide a character's speech into separate paragraphs when there is no amplifying information offered between them?
This is a rule. I see it all the time. If someone is speaking and what they are saying spills into another paragraph then you leave off the end quotes in the first. And I would like to think readers do know this. I'm not going to search for a link to prove this. I'm pretty sure that's something you can do on your own if you want. But I am sure I know what I'm talking about with this.
It's a guideline, and many a publisher will use that format (dropping the closing speech tag to show the dialogue belongs to the same speaker, even though it's on a separate line. It just allows for natural paragraph breaks in dialogue.). Here's something from the Editor's Blog about it. Scroll down to Multiple Paragraphs of Dialogue.
It looks like that link might be private - it won't open. This is the first I've ever heard of this as a writer or reader. And while it makes sense, it isn't something that I would rely on without other context, like contrasting speaker tags in follow on paragraphs. In part, because books are not always perfectly edited and may simply be missing the quote mark.
That is a danger—missing the end quote—and for that reason I wouldn't use this device very often—especially not with one or two-sentence paragraphs. It's more useful when somebody is telling somebody else a lengthy story, etc. But leaving off the end quote is the convention. It's probably better, if you can tag it in some way, though. That's where action beats come in handy. Here's a section of one of my chapters where I employ this dropped-quote tactic. My character Joe is speaking at the start of this passage. He's telling Jessie some stories about his past. I've indicated the places I've used the dropped end quote in blue :
I'm familiar with it, but I don't think I've ever used it. Of course, I don't think I've ever had call to use it. I don't think I've ever had a character giving enough of a speech that a paragraph break was warranted, not unless there was an action during the break.
I'm sure I've seen it all the time - like when a character is giving a lengthy speech, and that speech is divided into paragraphs. I just think it is dangerous to rely on it for back and forth conversation where few or no quote tags are used.
First result from searching for "quote multi-paragraph" on duck duck go: http://baxtercommunications.nl/quotation-marks-multi-paragraph-rule/ Previous thread here on the topic: https://www.writingforums.org/threads/punctuation-of-multiple-paragraph-speech.12088/ Apparently it's in the AP Stylebook as well: http://www.gatehousenewsroom.com/2016/08/25/ap-stylebook-punctuation-guidelines-quotation-marks/ RUNNING QUOTATIONS: If a full paragraph of quoted material is followed by a paragraph that continues the quotation, do not put close-quote marks at the end of the first paragraph. Do, however, put open-quote marks at the start of the second paragraph. Continue in this fashion for any succeeding paragraphs, using close-quote marks only at the end of the quoted material. -- http://nationalpunctuationday.com/quotes.html I was so young when I was taught it, I don't remember not knowing it. This thread coincidentally appears right after someone incorrectly criticized one of my workshop entries for using this standard quotation technique.
I have characters tell stories at a few points in my WIP -- in one case, the story is 5000 word long. So of course I use multi-paragraph quotes. Someone might argue such in-the-story story telling is "wrong" or something. Or that it should be done as a flash-back, or by the narrator. It could be done that way in some case, but if you haven't read what I wrote, you can't really say. For me, it was important that the story be infused with the story-tellers POV. How the storyteller feels about the story is important: one long story is about how a man met his wife. The other is the history of the family of the person telling it. Both stories are world-building; one of the stories includes a lie that matters a lot to the plot.
You don't need to defend your approach! The idea that every character should speak only in clipped one or two-liners isn't universally helpful. There are many times when people speak for a long while, without interruption. That's when these multi-paragraph quotes are needed.
Yep. As Frozone says: He starts monologin'! He starts, like, this PREPARED speech about how feeble I am compared to him. How INEVITABLE my defeat is. How the world will soon be his! Yaddah, yaddah, yaddah. Yammerin'!
That shouldn't happen, because nobody uses this device for short choppy statements like that. Try this instead: Turning to Al, Jules said, "We are out of toilet paper. And that's a problem." "Sure is - especially when you consider our finances. So - Sears catalog?" "If only!" This was a sore point with Jules. "They went online this year." "My bad. Sometimes I still feel like its the '80s. Not much has really changed in the way we live," Al said. "And I don't know if what has changed is better. Change without improvement." He decided to stop this conversation, before it descended into constant moaning about things they couldn't do anything about. "Ah, yeah... You want me to run to the store? I have change in the car for at least one roll."
It's useful in the right circumstances, though. I don't think the OP (you) was offering those short sentences up as wonderful writing examples, though. Weren't they just used to illustrate where the quotes would come in a paragraph change?
Yeah, it's not the quote mechanics that were the problem. It's an issue I see a lot in the Workshop: not knowing when to start and stop paragraphs. If two sequential sentences (whether in quotes or not) are closely related, it's not good to put a paragraph break between them. I blame the education system. Back in childhood English class, I was taught how to paragragh in the context of non-fiction thesis writing. Every paragraph started with a first sentence that expressed the main idea of the paragraph, then two or three elaborating sentences -- that's what I remember being taught anyway. But paragraphing a narrative? I don't recall being taught that. The thesis-type structure won't work. I'm not really sure what all the rules are for narrative paragraphs. I know some guidelines: keep related things together, don't let the paragraph go too long, change paragraphs when someone else starts talking or acting. There's probably more. But paragraphing deserves it's own thread, I think.
Along with other recent 'rules' for writing, I think people are being told to keep paragraphs short because it keeps people turning pages. (Me? I turn the page when I come to the bottom of it, however long it took me to get there ...but I'm admittedly an old fart.) This, as usual, has been carried to extremes. I've seen writing recently (in workshops) where nearly every single sentence is a separate paragraph. This drives me doolally. Add that to the confusion about how to attribute dialogue in the first place—the speech and the speaker should always be contained in the same paragraph—and the whole thing ends up a bit of a dog's breakfast.
You mean like: This, as usual, has been carried to extremes. I've seen writing recently (in workshops) where nearly every single sentence is a separate paragraph. This drives me doolally Well, it could be worse, right?
The example is just to illustrate that you can use a rule correctly to create something that is not easy to read correctly. The rule exists to allow you to correctly punctuate, but isn't proof against creating passages that are unclear because you're relied overly on punctuation alone.
Yeah, I see what you're driving at here. However, this wasn't so much an exercise in bad punctuation, as an exercise in bad paragraphing! The punctuation was correct. The paragraphing was borderline incoherent.
Actually, all the paragraph breaks are natural speech pauses, usually involving a change in emphasis: "I miss the '80s. "Anyway, I'll go shopping." That's one person expressing two different ideas with a pause in between. You could also do it with "...", but that can also imply something else, like unheard speech.
It really makes for a difficult read, though. There are lots of other ways to indicate a pause. Including saying: "I miss the 80's," Al said, scratching his arse, making Jules wait. "Anyway, I'll go shopping."
Yeah, I've had issues same as @OP. You'd clarify in the text if you could, 'she continued...' But now I'm agonising whether my 'she' ^^ should be upper caps? New para saves the day... ... My other tourette is 'Did she say "bullshit"?' [nb shouldn't use tourette as s/hand slang]
