USMC Commands

Discussion in 'Research' started by Sclavus, Sep 16, 2017.

  1. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    Tbh we'd have sealed it off and not gone near it - thats what the WHO/CDC are for.
     
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  2. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    Yes, but this is fiction, and my soldiers are mercenaries. Hence, they're going into a biologically contaminated battlefield, but they're not stupid. They realize they'll need some protection. The contagion is spread through bodily fluids, but has a short life outside the body. Without another host to cling to, it'll die within a few hours.
     
  3. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    At minimum you'd want a full NBC suit and mask (which incidentally are horrible to wear - unless you are into rubber )

    If you were paranoid and money isn a problem you might want a full blown Drager suit and respirator (they are about 2 grand a pop)
     
  4. Arcadeus

    Arcadeus Senior Member

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    Military Oriented Protective Posture (MOPP) gear. There are multiple levels to the gear depending on the threat.

    There's certain procedures for putting on and taking off the gear.

    I'm not sure how technical you want to get.

    M50 joint service general purpose mask is the mask that is used however at the very least. It can have different canisters depending on the type/size of particle you are trying to protect against.

    (Also, little pet peeve of Chemical soldiers. They are Protective Masks and not Gas Masks.)

    Likely is would be MOPP 3, which is
    -Overgarment
    -Mask and hood
    -Field gear
    and
    -Overboots

    The only thing not included is the rubber gloves, which would make firing a weapon difficult.

    There's a lot more that can be said, I'm just trying not to say un-needed information.
    The gear fits in a small back-pack like pack called an I.C.E. pack. (In Case of Emergency pack)
     
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  5. Arcadeus

    Arcadeus Senior Member

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    If there's a dangerous enough threat located in the area, we'd probably drop artillery or bomb it, trying to avoid civilian casualties as much as possible.
     
  6. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    Just to clarify Arcadeus and I are talking about the same thing, US forces call them MOPP , British forces call them NBC .. we all called them fucking horrible noddy suits
     
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  7. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    tbh if you've got an outbreak of zombie plague in an isolated area of the Us, a tactical nuke could be the way to go
     
  8. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    My second-favorite scene in World War Z:



    Where was it?

    Who set it off?

    Does it really matter anymore?
     
  9. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    My story involves an alternate history in which we--the United States--went to war on all rogue nations, not just Afghanistan. That war has gone on for 25 years or so by the time we meet our protagonist. We activated the draft, and even then we've been strained. Our stateside military presence has been operating on a skeleton crew, meaning that if you needed the National Guard, you'd get 2,000 at most.

    That's where Michael Sterling of The Pantheon Group introduced his "Time Served" program, training prisoners within certain parameters to fight, mostly to bolster stateside forces. No one wants to drop a nuke on the city, because the war is already unpopular enough. It would be political suicide, and there have already been bans on the right to assemble because protests turn into riots. Cities like New York, Detroit, and LA are already under some kind of martial law because of that.

    The Hellions are the "true believers" of the Time Served program. They are the elite, 99.99% former military, and they get top shelf treatment from Sterling (who is obscenely rich). Since this is near future with alternate history and technology, I could come up with a more "tactical" MOPP 3 suit--something with gloves that still allow for firing a weapon.

    Mostly the Hellions would be driving infected civilians toward non-infected civilians and documenting the results before covertly eliminating both groups. They would be dropped inside the city and set up a base of operations in a location that's potentially hostile. At some point, their own organization leaves them for dead.

    I'm seriously considering having the Hellions trigger an e-bomb that shuts down most everything in the city so they can move in without having to worry about what news crews will report. Then they could just go for wholesale slaughter rather than having to be covert. They still wouldn't nuke anything, though, because their boss and his colleagues want to test their new bioweapon on Colorado Springs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2017
  10. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    We used to just wear double layers of latex surgical gloves with our NBC suits - the theory was if its good enough for surgeons... The gauntlets were useless in that you couldn't use a weapon or a radio or basically anything .... that's what you get when your noddy suits are made by the lowest bidder

    That said we never had to go into a full biohazard environment - the closest we came was handling body parts in Kosovo ... when you are handling decomposed human remains you definitely don't want it getting on you , okay they died from violence, but that doesn't mean you won't catch something deeply unpleasant.

    Likewise we used surgical masks instead of the NBC full face things because the latter are so unpleasant to wear
     
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  11. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    One way Jonathan Maberry gets around some of the problems created by using gear made by the lowest bidder is to have his government group call on "friends in the industry." In that way, they don't just get bulletproof vests, they get Saratoga Hammer suits. They can get whatever they need because their leader "has a friend in the industry," whatever industry it happens to be.

    I've done something similar for my antagonists in The Pantheon Group. The Hellions have cutting edge gear because there are resources in The Pantheon Group to supply it. The suit they'll wear is one that's sleek, flexible, protective, and reasonably comfortable. It'll have all the function of MOPP 4, but allow them to fight CQB if necessary.
     
  12. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    Is there a slang term for inspections/contraband searches in the military? I'm assuming there might be a scenario in which a platoon leader or what have you might have reason to suspect his subordinates are hiding liquor or some other substance.

    Context:

    Vincent and the guys in his homeless shelter usually go out to "the yard" for smokes after dinner. They're finishing up when Vincent sees an unsettling lone figure standing in the street. It's not unheard of, but there's something about this figure Vincent finds unsettling. In short, he thinks it might be a zombie, and he'll turn out to be right, but he doesn't want to cause undue panic among the other guys. To distract them, Vincent will turn to his boss, Padre, and casually announce, "You know, it occurs to me we haven't done (a search for contraband) lately."

    This will have the effect of making the other guys in the yard groan and gripe, but it will also get them inside to their bunks. Padre will have followed Vincent's subtle but intent gaze at the figure, and see what Vincent is playing at. Get the guys inside, quick and quiet. This could be nothing, but it's probably something.
     
  13. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    If I can just pop in with one thing that's been troubling me; you're saying that these guys are (or are going to be) elite special ops types, but that they start off as prisoners at Leavenworth or some similar institution.

    The Venn diagram of elite operators or people suited to that life and prisoners has a very, very small overlap. Most people in prison are fuckups of one sort or another. You could try and put them through SEAL training, but even with the motivation of it being better than the stripey hole, you're probably going to get a whole bunch of substandard soldiers who will get massacred the first time you let them out of the gate.

    Just my 1.78 cents (the yen is still pretty weak, sorry).
     
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  14. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    You're right. I'll have to give this some thought.
     
  15. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    Okay, so I think I've got it. The Pantheon Group isn't anything more than a conglomerate of private military contractors. They introduce the program that allows prisoners to "do their time" in service to The Hellions. The training probably isn't as difficult as SEAL training, though people probably would say that. At any rate, The program is open to all prisons, with some selective criteria about who qualifies.

    In my story, let's say there are four million prisoners nationwide (the current number is actually around 2.2 million). Let's say that 500,000 qualified prisoners are interested and get accepted for training.

    SEAL training and similar programs are partly designed to get people to work as part of a team. Some of the training is instructive, but some of it is meant to weed out those who don't really want to be there. Hellion training is different in that it's almost all instruction. If you shoot, fight, sneak, and blow shit up well enough, you're in. Yes, you have to be physically capable, but they don't care if you're smart, as long as you do what you're told.

    Training would be like a mashup of prison and boot camp, except if you do anything that potentially puts people in danger, you don't get reprimanded or court-martialed, you get shot dead. Recruits would be exercised, trained to shoot and fight, trained in infiltration and evasion, but for all that training, they'd probably get torn to shreds if they went up against regular infantry. They think of themselves as SpecOps, and they do some of the things SpecOps do, but they don't do it with the same efficiency.

    The Hellions have been sent to combat zones to support the military presence there, but they've got a reputation for taking a perfectly good combat strategy and fucking it with a train. They're fanatical, unprofessional, arrogant, and protected from on high against inquiry, arrest, and so on. They'll beat the shit out of untrained civilians, but an Army sergeant, Air Force captain, and two old farts with SAS/SBS background leading a few dozen civilians are enough to lay waste to scores of Hellions. It's an advantage for the protagonists of my story, without making it too easy for them.
     
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  16. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    If you can find it, read Mouthful of Rocks by Christian Jennings. It's a bit old (and it's been decades since I read it), but it covers French Foreign Legion training from the viewpoint of a recruit who's more than a bit of a fuckup himself (he ends up deserting). True story, might give you some insight into how one successful military unit deals with educating not "the best and the brightest".
     
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  17. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    I'll do that. Thank you. I love reading about military training and history. I've been contemplating setting up some kind of military structure for my protagonists as well, to give Vincent a promotion.
     
  18. Sclavus

    Sclavus Active Member

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    Since we've gone far afield from just Marine Corps commands, I'll put this here. It concerns the MOPP 4 suits. As I understand the MOPP system, it details what gear is worn, what's carried, and what is or isn't readily available. To create a futuristic MOPP 4 combat suit, I looked at what the current gear is. A lot of it went over my head, but I got the gist: several protective layers with space for (theoretical) breathability.

    The idea I have is to combine combat boots, pants, gloves, shirt, mask, and helmet into one piece. The uniform is in fact several layers:
    • The outermost layer is what I call "chamelouflage," pronounced as "kuh-meel-yo-flage." In essence, it uses implanted cameras to change its coloring to that of the closest solid objects. It doesn't render the wearer invisible, but it's close. This layer also contains the same function as M9 paper, to detect a variety of toxic agents. The exterior is also flame resistant and bullet resistant.
    • The outer layer of the vest has MOLLE loops, pockets, and what amounts to an integrated combat vest. Rather than strapping on holsters, canisters, bags, and so on, a wearer may store all their gear directly into and on the suit.
    • Beneath the outer layer is a layer that conditions the inside, making it hotter or colder based on the user's preferences. This is controlled by a switch in the sleeve, where the battery is also housed. The battery is designed to last the lifetime of the suit.
    • The inner layer is cloth and padding for comfort.
    Every piece of protective gear is stitched together or otherwise connected, designed to be sleek and flexible for maximum combat maneuverability. The mask is integrated with the helmet and provides full head protection along with communications and total air filtration, serving as a gas mask, oxygen mask, and protective mask against NBC threats.

    It will look something like this, though without the gaps in between the individual pieces:

    [​IMG]
     

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