1. vanilla16

    vanilla16 New Member

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    What does "properly" mean in this sentence? :)

    Discussion in 'Word Mechanics' started by vanilla16, Mar 13, 2012.

    I was properly ashamed and managed to be pretty quiet for the rest of the day.

    ^ I saw that sentence in a Grandma's Attic book. x)
     
  2. shadowwalker

    shadowwalker Contributor Contributor

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    I believe in that context it would mean 'appropriately' or 'justifiably'.
     
  3. BlizzardHarlequin

    BlizzardHarlequin New Member

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    Usually people from the UK use properly in such a context that it means 'terribly' or said by shadowwalker above me, 'justifiably'
     
  4. Elgaisma

    Elgaisma Contributor Contributor

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    Pretty much what the others said. Properly means correctly or satisfactorily or appropriately (sp??).

    But as Blizzard said in UK English it can be used for very.
     
  5. prettyprettyprettygood

    prettyprettyprettygood Active Member

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    Shadowwalker is probably right, but I would read that as 'very ashamed' so it may depend where the writer is from- properly/proper is sometimes used to mean very or really here in the uk.
     
  6. Nakhti

    Nakhti Banned

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    In the UK, properly used in such a context = thoroughly, exceedingly, utterly.

    It is often used in British colloquialisms, such as:

    I was proper knackered after running that marathon

    In this sentence 'proper' (note the -ly suffix has been dropped) just means very. It could also be replaced with 'right' and mean the same thing -

    I was right knackered when I got to the top of Everest.

    Hmm, dontcha just love us whacky Brits? :D
     
  7. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    A definition of "properly" in the Concise Oxford English Dictionary is "suitably; respectably." So saying "I was properly ashamed" essentially means "I was ashamed, and I damn well should have been."
     
  8. Nakhti

    Nakhti Banned

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    Relying on dictionary definitions completely ignores context though - a dictionary will only list possible meanings, context will tell you which one is the most likely or only possible meaning.
     
  9. lorilee

    lorilee New Member

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    That was my first thought when I read the sentence.
     
  10. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    Go to the Complete OED and you also find: "Completely, thoroughly; exceedingly, very. Now chiefly colloq." It gives the example (amongst others), "1896 Daily News 18 Mar. 3/6 The accused said he got ‘properly drunk’."
     
  11. lorilee

    lorilee New Member

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    looking at the location of the replies, it does seem to be colloquial, very being how those in the UK read it and suitably for those of us in North America. I guess you would have to know the background of the speaker to know how it was meant.
     
  12. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    Yes -- and I think you'd have to look at time as well as place -- US English and UK English used to be closer, and in the past the "very" meaning was mainstream, not colloquial in the UK. It goes back a long way, so I'd expect it to have been mainstream in the US at one time too. How long ago was the Grandma's attic book?
     
  13. Elgaisma

    Elgaisma Contributor Contributor

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    There is a book called Grandma's Attic it was written by someone called Arleta Richardson who was born and brought up in Michigan.

    She was born in 1923 and first book was published in 1994.
     
  14. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    I took context into account. There were other definitions offered; I used those that made sense in context. I do know how to use a dictionary, Nakhti. :)
     
  15. madhoca

    madhoca Contributor Contributor

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    formal UK English: Minstrel's definition = rightly ashamed/I was ashamed, and so I should have been
    idiomatic UK English: properly ashamed = very/thoroughly ashamed
    in Devon/Cornwall 'proper' would be used instead of 'properly', and is very common idiom
    US English: no idea!
     
  16. jazzabel

    jazzabel Agent Provocateur Contributor

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    Today, it's the same as saying "I was really ashamed", sort of like "I was mortified" (another word for extreme embarrassment we use in UK).
     
  17. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    Also proper (but archaic) English. And it's not clear when the proper usage died away, leaving it only in idiomatic use.
     
  18. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    to sum up:

    it could mean either 'very/terribly/etc.' or 'justifiably/appropriately/etc.' depending on what the person who said it meant...

    i'm american born and raised, have been reading british literature since childhood and have traveled and lived in england, and i would use it to mean 'very' and not the other meaning, so i don't see it as only a us/uk thing, but just a matter of style and/or the choice perhaps affected by one's background...
     
  19. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    Agreed -- and it might mean both of those; sometimes ambiguity is intentional.
     

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