Where do you even Start?

After wading through advice websites and forums for literally years, I'm still just as lost as I was when I decided to get serious about self-publishing. I've determined that I'm not asking the right questions. And so here we are, the most basic of basic questions: Where do I start?

Now, I wish it didn't have to be said, but it does: I know you're supposed to have already a book written. Please, do not do the cop-out, "Well, you have to have a book written first, honey," to make yourself sound clever. I'm not the most civil person, but that answer is condescending and rude, and it's the only "advice" anyone gave.

This question is to help build a roadmap that a prospective writer interested in self-publication could develop.

1. Get book written.
2. Have other people read book. (Actually, skip this part and just use an AI system. Critiques boil down to the blind leading the blind. Half the people who read your one chapter make suggestions that will screw up the next eight chapters, don't even bother to ask, let alone care, what kind of story you're trying to tell, and give advice that just boils down to regurgitating rules they themselves don't fully understand how to apply.)
3. Find a reputable editor to help craft it into a story for humans to read.

And then what...?

 

Take a look at Tim Grahl's youtube videos. He has decades of experience in book launches. One thing he has pointed out is many of the books that hit the best seller lists (which are based on a week's worth of sales) have sales die off after hitting the list. While others that never hit the lists sell year after year, and do so without the fan fare.

 

Women in Publishing holds an online conference every year. It isn't expensive, the speakers are very good, and you don't have to leave home to attend. I highly recommend it. To see notes from last year's conference, you can go here: https://womeninpublishingsummit.com/

Kalisto, it's true that some folks may be trying to make themselves sound clever by telling you to write a book first. However, it's not a cop-out. No book, no need to know how to self-publish unless you're planning to do the deed for someone else.

Re: building your roadmap to self-publication.

1. Writing the book is a good place to start.

2. Depending on AI for critiques because submitting the work to living readers is "the blind leading the blind" is seriously flawed thinking. See any thread on any writing forum that discusses AI.

3. Find an editor to help craft it into a readable book. Uh-uh. This is your job. It's not up to an editor to take a flawed product and make it readable. If you can't write a readable book, you need to practice until you can.

You stated that you've spent years studying self-publishing and are no further along than when you began. Put me down as rude and condescending if you must, but speaking from decades of experience, I am telling you with compassion and sympathy that you'd be better off spending time and energy on writing. Trying to map out the entire journey to self-publication first is a fine way of avoiding step one.

I wish you the very best of luck, and do check out Women in Publishing.

 

Build an audience for your work. Whether that is social media, or sites like patron and royal road. It all comes down to finding the audience for your work. Even with traditional publishing you need to be prepared to do your own marketing, unless you are in that group who gets a huge advance, ie a Grisham or King. Because that is where publishers are going to put their marketing dollars.

 

THAT is very interesting. I did not know that. I want to write more for longevity than quick success. Money isn't an issue and isn't why I'm writing.

 

How about I put it this way? Whether I have a book or not. Whether I spent 2 days writing or 30 years writing. Whether I have a college degree in writing or just some barely literate high schooler, this is that's the question I asked and what I want to know. It's just that simple.

Because maybe I have a book. And it's the greatest book ever written. And it will save the world. And stop global warming. And bring about peace and prosperity to the entire planet. And redistribute wealth in a equitable manner. And the blind who read it will see again. And the deaf will hear too.

And because I have have written literally the greatest book in the world - More important than the Bible and Koran combined, have I finally earned the right to ask how to go about publishing it? Or is there another ritual or ceremony I have to do before I earn that right?

 

That's interesting. I had began learning Blender and I was experimenting with doing short films with it. I wonder if I can make a short film with the characters in my book...

 

That isn't all that different from some of the techniques I have seen being used to build audiences currently. I have seen a few authors that use a welcoming version of their book to build their audience. Or record their own serialized version of their work in audiobook format.

How To Launch Your Book With Tim Grahl

Sell Your First 1000 Books with Tim Grahl

Hope this helps.

 

I hope the reference to Women in Publishing is enough to redeem my trespasses. (Gently replaces the chip, regretting having accidentally knocked it off, and departs for a different thread.)

 

I'm not 100% sure if you're being facetious or not, I do feel I have to jump in here.
Reader feedback is incredibly valuable, you just need to know how to utilize it, which is an art in itself. To boil it down, you need complaints. You don't have to (and in a lot of cases, shouldn't) carry out your readers instructions on how to remedy their complaints, but it is important to know why they made them. If they say they want another chapter fleshing out the love interest, don't grind the story to a halt to force that in, set her up properly earlier so that isn't necessary; don't eliminate a confusing plot point, give it the time it deserves; if they say your villain is nasty and irredeemable, figure out whether you want to lean into that or if you think a redemptive moment or two suits your vision; etc.

You can write for yourself all you want. Most of the time, that's all my writing is ever for. But ultimately, when you publish a work you're publishing it for others, and to have any success on that front you have to produce a polished work. If anything's worth doing, it's worth doing well.

 

I'm glad you found it valuable and continue to find it valuable. In the short run, I did too. It helped me learn small things like show, not tell, and passive voice vs active, etc.

Long run, it's just people regurgitating rules they heard from somewhere so they can get the 200 words they need to post their own story up. They have no interest in my goal, what themes I want to bring out, or where this is going. When the 14th time you hear "I don't know who this character is. Remember the reader isn't just going to know who these characters are" and we're on Chapter 5 and they didn't read the first four chapters, where is that feed back helpful? On no planet is that helpful.

Save your money, and get an AI, since critiques don't care anyway.

Just because I say don't bother with critiques doesn't mean I'm writing in a vacuum. It just means that the amount of money you're putting to be on a feedback forum, and the work you will be required to put in to remain in good standing, is not going to be worth it for a line or two of feedback that might be kind of sort of helpful. Tell me where I'm wrong!

But... but... how would you know what your audience likes? I would say a good start is touching grass and talking to people. I hear so many writers, "I just want to write. I don't want to go work at a grocery store and get yelled at." No! Trust me, you want to work at the grocery store and get yelled at! So you can write a story of a protagonist who isn't just another struggling writer getting caught up in a wacky adventure. I can't even name how many of my customers end up in my books.

Second is read other people's stuff.

Third is to find someone who gives a damn.

 

Thank you! Thank you for finally, after 10 years to finally giving me an answer. I'm not kidding when I say I'm actually crying in happiness. Thank you for answering. Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

 

@Kalisto
You seem upset or agitated at having received bad feedback. I'm sorry if this is the case. Receiving and giving feedback are both two artforms kind of. Whether that is from a million reviewers on a bestseller, or one critique on a writer's forum. You need to know your own goals and stick to them, yet be able to discern what may be helpful to your writing.

I've personally found feedback very useful, but I may not be as far advanced as you may be when it comes to writing skills.

I would also give you the advice to not rely too much on AI for feedback, at its current state. AI can be quite unreliable.

Also, most feedback forums are free, bar the voluntary donations, so I don't get where you seem to imply that it costs money? Do you mean time is money? If so, writing ain't exactly a gold vein.

 

So... do you have any advice on self publishing?

There are some feedback forums that do require a fee to access all features, particularly those that will allow novel writing.

But as you said, time is also not worth it.

Let me tell you what you would get from me if I critiqued your work. First you'll get an email. I'm going to ask you all kinds of questions. Who is your main character? What are some themes? Is there a work that inspired this story? Please brag to me about your story, your world building, and your writing process. I'm going to get into your mind. I want to know your goals.

Then I'll read your story and give you, hmm maybe a little feedback here and there. But then a list of questions. And this will go back and forth. And maybe about the third email you'll get my feedback.

Why do I do it this way? Because I had a story to critique from a younger writer. It starts with a tragic death to the protagonist. And then shifts to the protagonist going to a magic school and having all these shinnanigans. Holy tonal shift, Batman!

My feedback was to ditch the magic school. It has nothing to do with this tragic death, blah blah blah. Authors kept pushing back.

Finally it clicked, "You want to write a book about a magic school! You just didn't know how get to protagonist to the school and connect them to the villain. This isn't problem with shifting tones. It's a problem with organizing the events so they work!"

That's why critiques are useless. Because no one wants to talk to anyone!

 

Um... so are critiques! I fail to see what problem is being solved by taking your advice!

 

I am glad I have been of some help to you. Autocorrect messed up my previous post and changed webcomic to welcoming.

Using AI for a critique, is little more than helping train the AI for free.

Have you considered the possibility that those giving you the critiques are either not your intended audience, or don't know how to give you useful feedback? Perhaps finding or developing some type of questionnaire to give direction for the feedback you need. To me there is nothing more frustrating than a beta reader saying something like "loved it".

 

Perhaps this is your issue? You give more effort than you receive? That can feel discouraging. I'm not saying you should lower your effort. Going into the mind of someone, fully, to give them the best feedback is quiet the task. But I would argue that you will still not know the intent and story as much as the originator. So, perhaps the effort is flawed when considering the desired outcome?

Critiques from living people are less flawed, since unless you're writing for machines, it will be living people who will read your work.

Meh, what do I know.

 

The hell I'm ever going to lower my standards! I'm there to help you write your story, not tell you how I would handle a writing prompt.

And you can argue all you want that I still don't clasp fully what they intend, at least I have a closer understanding then if I didn't ask at all.

And how are critiques from readers less flawed? As for your writing for robots comment. Have you ever used an AI? Yes there are AIs that will write a book for you with some prompts. They will mostly do spelling and grammar and alternative word choices. They also can check word frequency etc.

What they don't do is write the book for me or turn me into a robot.

Also why AI is better:

1. It doesn't regurgitating rules itself doesn't understand.
2. It actually will finish reading the book.

 

On this, I hope we can agree to disagree.

I use prowriting aid whenever I write. My experience is, that it is useful for spelling and grammar checking. The word choice options it presents fail to account for tone and context. But beyond those limited aspects. I am not a fan of AI as it currently exists.

 

Yes, and that's why you shouldn't bother with them. In most critique forums, you have to put a certain amount of effort in offering up critiques to keep your account in good standing. Standard is about one story/chapter to every two critiques you give. And while that's not overwhelming, consider the return is maybe one or two lines of helpful feedback on your own story, the effort is certainly disproportional to the reward.

Now, it's easy to say, "Well, you should just find someone who actually knows what they're talking about." In theory, that's good advice, but those people already have their network, and to be fair, there's nothing you can offer them that they need, so they will not be interested in you. They will not teach you, and you have no real right to ask it of them.

That's why, if you're smart, you skip the critiques and go with AI. It's the difference between getting something useful with low to medium effort and nothing to a few things useful with significant effort.