How do i portray the descent into insanity?

Discussion in 'Character Development' started by The_Raven, Sep 23, 2015.

  1. Aidan Stern

    Aidan Stern Active Member

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    Definitely pay attention to what the others are saying, they make really good points.

    Is your character able to control when he experiences these things? Does he have moments of reprieve?
    I think the "insanity" that you're thinking of is more along the lines of the "raving mad" kind rather than the "moral insanity" kind. We touched on different views and aspects of the general term "insanity" in a class of mine. In history, many times, insanity was considered insanity in a more physical and intellectual sense, but as we developed more ideas of what it was, we learned that there are people who are just incapable of certain things that a "normal" person is, or perfectly intelligent, but they have no morals. Like in "The Most Dangerous Game" by Ray Bradbury. (I think that's what it's titled, I'm not 100% sure though.) There are so many aspects to the psychological world...

    I have a similar, not so similar idea of mine that I don't relate to any kind of official psychological disorder or whatnot. It's on a person who is unable to make eye contact because he is able to experience the other people's memories as if they were happening to him. This is where my story is up in the air, but one possibility I was thinking about is something happens where he goes blind, and that single barrier of having to make eye contact is broken and slowly but increasingly, all these memories start to invade his mind.

    If your story were my story, I would just write the character as being so frustrated, confused, and overwhelmed that he slowly loses his own identity, becomes "raving" and incapable coherent thought, then ultimately becomes apathetic and just a hollow vessel for all those people's perceptions.
     
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  2. Aidan Stern

    Aidan Stern Active Member

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    If he's experiencing others' lives, is it as if he's that person?
    I think that he would develop all the fears, hopes, personalities, etc. of the peoples' lives he experiences.
    Maybe, if you want to assign a psychological disorder, you could use multiple personality disorder. This would open up thousands of directions you could take the story in. He could have thousands of personalities made up of individual experiences and mixed peoples' experiences. Maybe he can go around being other people, making a royal mess in society. For example, if he experienced the life of a murderer, he could go around in that mindset perhaps mixed with another, and go to the authorities and confess, but he wouldn't be physically even capable of being a part of the crimes. Or he could confuse the hell out of people he meets that know a person he's experienced the life of. Does this make sense?
     
  3. The_Raven

    The_Raven Member

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    It does make sense. However, that's not exactly what I intend. The MC experiences others lives in dreams and random flashes. He has no control over what happens. He is merely an observer in someone else's life. He does start to lose his sense of identity and thinks that others memories are his own.
     
  4. Aidan Stern

    Aidan Stern Active Member

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    Okay, I think you have a really good idea. Just write a whole bunch of possibilities out and then go through and pick and choose what you most want to include in your final draft. Try your best to not get hung up on tiny details (unless necessary) or grammar and proper form. Battle that perfectionist in you. Freewrite. That's what I do (try) when I'm stuck. I just write a ton of random follow up ideas and figure out the mess later. (At least, this is what I'd like to do in theory.)
     
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  5. Aire

    Aire Banned Sock-Puppet

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    What's wrong with making him a schizophrenic? Watch Identity with John Cusack to get an idea how that aspect can be grasped; personally I thought it was very good.


    And sorry to say, I agree with DueNorth. I am studying in the field, or planning to, as that's what dad did as a profession [analyzed people] and to say insanity & mental disorders are "one and the same" is hardly correct. This probably comes from lack of general knowledge and well everyone and their mother in most court cases entering a "plea of insanity". One reason why it is no longer considered a medical diagnosis [hence a doctor can't walk up to Joe on the street & say "yep, he's insane. Cart him away, boys"].

    Psychotic disorders [bipolar, schizophrenia, etc.] would be the "closest", in the most basic meaning, of insane. The list of disorders that were once dubbed "insane" is pretty big actually, and takes in more than just the obvious [brain injuries for example]. However, someone can be perfectly "sane" and still do some pretty "insane" stuff. Anyone ever watched parkour videos; some of those people are "crazy".


    To the OP you don't want realistic. So what are you looking for? In the world of books the easiest way to make someone insane is all-consuming guilt / grief or mental disorders.

    Maybe do some sort of flashback series as mentioned - the other lives he is living are actually past lives [e.g. five hundred years ago he was a Comanche Indian only to wake up and find himself instead of some fearsome brave - a scrawny white teenager].
     
  6. Masterspeler

    Masterspeler Active Member

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    This is a tough, tough, TOUGH subject to portray. At your age, I may have been preoccupied with madness because of heavy metal. Sanitariums, Thorazine, toys in the attic are metal.

    But, to make it more than just a giggling, head banging feeling, it needs to be well thought out. I don't know if it can be done without actually having experienced some level of self doubt over one's sanity.

    One of the MC in my novel starts on this slippery slope (so cliche, I wonder if there are any grippy high traction slopes around.) Dreams are a good start. A recurring dream, where each time a new element is introduced, or a constant figure appears in any dream, could start making the character worried. This would lead to less sleep, or less restful sleep.

    So in your MC's case, dreaming of other people's lives could make him come across something while awake that makes him pause, ignoring others around him, or crossing a street oblivious to traffic, only to wake up asking himself "I almost died, what the hell is wrong with me?" ("Are you listening? Is anyone out there?")

    He might pull away from friends, even realizing it, grabbing the telephone receiver (do people still have those? I use lots of old tech, so I forget what's around) but not dialing the number. He lashes out with the "You don't understand me," or the classic, "When ever I need help, nobody in this family is around to help."

    I wouldn't focus much on him questioning his sanity (the old if I question my sanity, I must not be insane) but instead on compulsions. Hold on...double checks all spelling. Must check spelling.

    You have to convince the reader that whatever he is doing has some meaning, some logic. You must. (None of you care! I'm just a newb. I write but nothing. Are you listening?)

    Arguing with a voice in your head isn't crazy! Listening and obeying to them is crazy. Can you imagine that? If I was to write what those bastards tell me, well then, you can kiss the Mars Rovers goodbye. Those secrets, if they ever got out, even in fiction, would be a disaster! Sure, it would be nice to get some recognition, but online? They wont buy it, I must make them buy it...brb its insanely hot in here. I have to turn the oven off.

    I'm back. The cats love the heat, but they have to shut up, no matter what they say. You here that, you furry hairshnozzel!

    But it has to be gradual! gradual gradual Gradual! Ok, now I know you're not listening. You just skimmed over this. My best work! My masterpiece. You glossed over it because you're all jealous. How did you find where I live? Stop ringing my door bell. Jeez...how many of you showed up? Knocking on my windows too? No, no no. You will not get the secrets or the rover, or my masterpiece! I will defend them with my li--
     
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  7. DueNorth

    DueNorth Senior Member

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    Masterspeler's ideas are great, especially the advice one pacing-- with one exception, in my opinion: skip the dreaming element, or if you use it, have them be daydreams or delusions. I wrote about this is another thread on dreams. There is no evidence of a correlation between dream states and psychological processes when awake.
     
  8. Masterspeler

    Masterspeler Active Member

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    Dreams can work if they aren't too detached. If they hold some sort of meaning to the writer then the writer can effectively convey that fear, despair or the symbolism. I have felt that madness, and once again feel it now. The difference is that before I was scared of it. Now, I've learned that any level of greatness comes with a dose of insanity, and brilliant teeters along the edge of madness.

    Of course, there's no guarantee that I land on greatness, but maybe a padded room might mean a comfortable night's sleep, and no more daily worries, no more pangs, creation woes and so on.

    AB
     
  9. DueNorth

    DueNorth Senior Member

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    Hmmmm? You totally lost me now, man--maybe one of those madness things that I don't get--too caught up in my own boring sanity. What I was getting at is that there is no evidence that a person who is lapsing into psychosis will have dreams that will foretell this waking delusional psychological state. What this has to do with your greatness (or lack thereof) other than that I agreed with much of your previous post escapes me. Is there such a thing as a dream that is not detached?--detached from what exactly?
     
  10. Chinspinner

    Chinspinner Contributor Contributor

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    I'm trying to think of a decent portrayal of a descent into insanity. I think foreshadowing is important in certain actions your character takes. The example of Harvey Dent in The Dark Knight is a good one in one particular respect. All of his actions after the transformation have been foreshadowed before, all of his "good" characteristics are organically corrupted to become "bad". (I am not equating insane with bad here, merely describing Harvey Dent).

    So for example, a slight preoccupation or a character quirk can solidify into a destructive obsession over time.

    In terms of literature, the descent of the MC in Crime and Punishment is particularly effective. He is not insane, but he reaches a dark place, and again the arc is truly believable. Alas his redemption is slightly less believable and tacked on... it would have been better without it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2015
  11. Masterspeler

    Masterspeler Active Member

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    @DueNorth , sorry, I was unclear. To be honest, I dont even know what I was driving at. I didnt mean it as an insult by means of a claim to greatness. If anything it could be a worry over the lack of greatness, and a conflict between ego and reason that knows and recognizes one's own mediocrity.

    As far as the dreams. I will give my own as examples. I can have detached dreams, as in just random weirdness. Like teletubby worms, or shaving a toilet (no, as much as it sound like one, it is not a euphemism). They mean nothing to me, at least consciously, so I dont put much stock in them, and move on.

    Then there is a recurring nightmare I've had since 9/11 that still troubles me to this day. I still have it, and I still wake up in a cold sweat. That dream is not detached, its very personal, and very intense, even in its variations on the theme. While I make joke that the crazy dreams make me sound insane, its the recurring one that bothers me that it may be happening for real.

    I hope that makes more sense. Truth is that insanity is tough to explain, but easier to show, as we all latch onto elements that resonate for each of us. It is after all a very intimate process of losing one's own mind.

    AB
     
  12. DueNorth

    DueNorth Senior Member

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    Your recurrent dream since 9/11 is characteristic of a trauma reaction. Your other dreams are random and would not be accurate representations of descent into madness (as troubling as they might be to you). And so I am reccomending against using dreams as a storyline predictive of, or symptomatic of, developing psychosis because it is not scientifically accurate even if it may make for a good story. You may be interested in the thread "Use of Dreams to Advance Narrative," in that thread I said:
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2015
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  13. Masterspeler

    Masterspeler Active Member

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    Yes, the crazy dreams are amusing to me. I use crazy as a term not indicative of any mental issues. The other ones yes. They worry me. Planes scare me, lack of control scares me, but I'm not alone in that boat. But it has offered a glimpse into my own edge. I have seen myself past that point many times. It has made me write better insanity plots though. Better compared to my other writing, because the more I interact with people here, the more I realize I am really low in experience and talent.

    Still, I like learning and that I am doing much of, not just about writing, but many other subjects.

    AB
     
  14. DueNorth

    DueNorth Senior Member

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    Okay--seems like we just needed some clarification. Best!
     
  15. DeathandGrim

    DeathandGrim Senior Member

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    Detail detail detail in the thought process to give context to the actions
     
  16. Burnistine

    Burnistine Active Member

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    What's wrong with him questioning everything that was once rational? Have him undo what was perfectly flawless. Repeat questions and give off-the-wall answers and find humor in the imbalance of it all.
     
  17. ~Artemis~

    ~Artemis~ Member

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    Maybe give your MC some small but noticeable tics that happen when he gets stressed. E.g. maybe some muscle in his face or hand twitches, or he needs to perform a certain action like counting to ten or washing his hands. Almost like OCD, except to a lesser extent. Couple the tic with irrational or paranoid thoughts; early in the story he could maybe dismiss the thoughts effortlessly, see them as irrational and illogical. Then, as he descends further and further into madness, make the tic become more and more prominent and the thoughts harder and harder to dispel, until they completely consume him.
     
  18. Kit Carruthers

    Kit Carruthers New Member

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    I find the best way is to write in first person. Show disorganized thinking that gets worse and worse. I don't mean to plug myself, but what I did was have my main character think in dialogue, and then once he snapped the responses started happening automatically instead of manually.
     
  19. oTTo

    oTTo Member

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    Your post made me think of Catcher in the Rye.

    The decent into madness may not be perceived by the one doing the decent. It should be subtle to the reader.
     
  20. Masterspeler

    Masterspeler Active Member

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    The narrator could also start going bonkers, right? Ok, I feel like Im a bit off my rocker, but sleep deprivation is a lot like being insane, or in love...or being insane and in love!

    PS Sniper beetles and fuzzy teletubby w0rms roaming subway tunnels on 3 day holiday weekends...HONK HONK!
     
  21. SSS

    SSS New Member

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    Definition of insanity according to Wikipedia :

    "Insanity, craziness or madness is a spectrum of behaviors characterized by certain abnormal mental or behavioral patterns. Insanity may manifest as violations of societal norms, including a person becoming a danger to themselves or others, though not all such acts are considered insanity; likewise, not all acts showing indifference toward societal norms are acts of insanity. In modern usage, insanity is most commonly encountered as an informal unscientific term denoting mental instability, or in the narrow legal context of the insanity defense. In the medical profession the term is now avoided in favor of diagnoses of specific mental disorders; the presence of delusions or hallucinations is broadly referred to as psychosis."

    I think the key word is "abnormal"; so to portray the descent into insanity you'd likely need an established "norm" to begin with in the world your character exists. As stated by someone who posted further up i think showing the transition from being normal to abnormal really depends on what type of abnormal you want your character to be. How I'd portray any form of character growth would be through conflict; what are the beliefs the character needs to take on to overcome whatever difficulty it is they're facing in getting what they want? This can equally turn a character sane; or insane, which is the reason i prefer the term "character change" over "character growth" as "growth implies they're changing for the better. So lets use extreme perfectionism as an example of someone descending into insanity :

    Lets say it is the first day of school; and your character wants more than anything to be liked by the other people at school. However when they get to school all the kids make fun of them because of their fashion sense; which is the complete opposite of what the character wants("want" being the key word here), this traumatizing event only fuels the character's desire to be liked
    So now you have an obstacle in the way of what the character wants, a conflict if you will(whatever is in direct opposition to what the character wants can be regarded as a conflict); in this case it is the school kids high opinion of fashion.
    Okay, so now the kid goes home and spends the night trying on different outfits determined to get what they want; the appraisal of their peers; only to return to school the next day to be rejected again.
    This fuels their desire even more....eventually you could push them to some form of breaking point, or you could push them to the point where they want to be liked more than they want to risk going to jail. Maybe they'll kill someone for their clothes? steal? Maybe they'll think it is some conspiracy against them and step in the realms of delusion; perhaps even delude themselves into thinking everyone likes their clothes just to satisfy their unyielding desire; perhaps that the desire becomes so ingrained that even after gaining the acceptance of the other kids at school, the character still doesn't believe it; and so they continue that pursuit.

    You could say what someone wants defines the type of insanity your character will have; and the level to which they want it is the degree to which they're insane. So whatever triggers someone to want the thing that is driving them insane more, is the way to show them transitioning from sane to insane. How do you make your character want something more than what they already do? through conflict. A person who has an anger problem because they want to win on video games becomes more angry every time they lose; the conflict here being the obstacle to them getting what they want : the video game (or the other player if it is multiplayer).

    It is also interesting to note that the type of emotional response a character might experience depends on where on the timeline they attempt to get what they want is.. Using the angry video gamer as an example again, they may experience anxiety at the thought of losing, and anger/sadness after they've lost; so although they have one desire, they can also express a wide range of emotions.

    Anxiety/fear/disgust = want something in the future
    Anger/sadness = loss of something (wanting something in the past)

    Hope that helps.
     
  22. Andrew Steven

    Andrew Steven New Member

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    It would all depend on how much of a timeline you would have .. For me I wouldn't let it slip in cold turkey .. Rather that the MC has a problem and that a level of anxiety is prexistant , bringing in a few quirks which present an underlying problem , where the supporting characters notice , but are not immediately worried about it
     
  23. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    I know I'm responding to an older post here, but your remarks gave me a thought. What if the wakened person THINKS his dreams foretell a descent into madness? Or what he remembers of his dream confirms things he's afraid of, either here in his present world or what might yet come? He then begins to act upon what his dream told him? In other words, using dreams as a trigger for, rather than a reflection of, reality? Dreams often intensify feelings, and that can make a person feel slightly 'mad.'

    I know in my own life that my dreams often crystallise something that's been bothering me, or can help me pinpoint niggling doubts I've had about a person or situation. I've made major life decisions based on feelings I've had in dreams, and I haven't regretted any one of those decisions.

    If you see dreams as your subconscious at work, unhindered by 'fact' or analysis, they can be very helpful. They aren't necessarily prophetic. (One of mine actually was—I dreamed about a person whom I knew nothing about, but met for the first time many years later, and who behaved exactly as he had done in the dream!—but that's another story—and no, it wasn't a romantic partner....) Even if they are not prophetic, however, in a direct sense, they can be indicative of real issues that need to be dealt with.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2016
  24. Rob40

    Rob40 Active Member

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    Just putting this here as something to look at. Nobody has mentioned Nikolai Gogol-Diary of a madman ?
    Fun short story, written as diary entries of a man who is a litttle more crazy with each day.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2016
  25. LostThePlot

    LostThePlot Naysmith Contributor

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    That's almost the only format that this kind of thing can work well in. It's set over a reasonably extended period and removes all the 'book keeping' day to day stuff that you'd have to include in a first person book letting you (essentially) just write 'little bit more crazy today, oop and a bit more' without needing to keep it up at a very specific level of crazy while they go to work and make dinner. You have to keep that exact amount of crazy up all the time or it'll feel like it's gone away but you can't go over it or you'll hugely accelerate the timeline. So a diary is a great place to show it.

    Extended narratives (as opposed to diaries) have other problems too. In third person the dichotomy between the characters perceptions and the real world are immediately apparent. In first person they never are. You can certainly work skillfully to make up for these but I like neither one myself. Third person feels like a very cynical attempt at dramatic irony that while ok at first quickly becomes unsatisfying; it feels like you are laboring the point to constantly point out how crazy someone is. First person gives you something a bit more interesting because at least there you can point the reader at things with blatantly unreal perceptions but even then it's not great. The problem is that it's very very hard to plant the idea of 'this character is going crazy' without just making them immediately crazy. The second you go too far the reader can't trust the character's perspective and with that goes a lot of interest and sympathy.

    I think the way to do it is to have a very detached narrator and never let the audience see inside the character's head so all we see is their actions, not their thoughts. That's how you can set up the uncertainty that really matters here. The reader fills in why the character is acting in a certain way, saying something that doesn't fit, but we don't know for sure. Even if we get told we really don't know until he's having a complete breakdown.
     

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