He's an all American student, popular with friends, captain of the football team, 6'2, tall, lean big frame built with blonde hair and maybe blue eyes and has a very attractive girlfriend, though she's not as mean as he is, he's a real douchebag. Is this okay?
It's a sci fi fantasy mix where the MC has cursed powers based on an ancient animal totem from Brazil and when he was young he was taken in by his grandfather after his deceased mother, where he is sent to school and meets this bully. Because I was told by someone that's a cliche bully. He was supposed to look a little like Thor. So instead of American I was going to make him Polish but they then told me that's copying Ivan from Rocky 4. But I've seen many super heroes and good guys that are white tall figures, blonde and hair, blue eyes so I think it would be nice for a change for one to be the bad guy and end up as a villain. Even his girlfriend becomes a villain in a sense. She's got long wavy, brunette hair, beautiful features, curvy hips and is a college grad. I really hope these don't sound like cliche villains.
I don't think you need to focus so much on your characters looks. Focus instead of writing interesting characters that makes for a good story. While some readers prefer heavy details on how the characters looks - from what I've gathered over the years it seems like a majority of readers are fine with just some general outlines. Books are not a visual medium. People might see the story in their head and some need more or less help to paint the picture, but I still think obsessing over the looks of a character that guaranteed will look different in every readers mind is just going to hinder your writing. Everything can be cliche. Cliche things can be good if you write it the right way. So just write and then decide what works or not.
Mean girl with long, wavy brunette hair, beautiful features, curvy hips, hunky boyfriend, college grad? Erm.... I'd say dive in and get your story itself going. And I'd also suggest a radical trick. Do NOT describe anybody's physical characteristics. You can add them in later, if you need to, but challenge yourself to write this story without relying on directly describing these people AT ALL. What you'll be doing then is concentrating on how they behave, what they do, what they say, what others think of them, etc. Their looks will be implied, I'm sure. It's a good trick to free YOU from creating clichés. After you finish your first draft, if you feel your readers will suffer if they aren't told the height, weight, eye colour, hair colour, body shape and skin tone of your characters, by all means add them in. But I'd suggest you leave them out while you write the story. Keep the images in your head, but don't hamstring yourself with ...yes ...clichés.
Thanks. I can write the characters stories out no problem. With keeping the visual appearance in my head. The only thing is it's a visual novel like comic style so the appearances will kinda matter.
Well, yeah, it is a cliche bully. It's a cliche bully because you've only given the absolute minimum of description. We have no idea who this person really is, what his personality is like etc, so naturally he seems like a cardboard cutout generic character. Also, Ivan from Rocky 4? Who cares if he's got something in common with Ivan from Rocky 4?
The handsome jock and the perfect cheerleader are stereotype mean kids, especially in stories with nerd protagonists, (Flash from Spider-man anyone?) but the bully who's mean because he's fat or has a cleft pallet is also a horrible cliche (and extremely negative stereotype.) Draw them however you want physically, but dive into what makes them mean. Great bullies in any medium have backgrounds that explain their behavior. If you want perfect examples, look at the main bully characters in It (the book, not the movie) or Let Me In (the movie.) What makes them great characters is that we're given glimpses into their home lives and instantly understand inexcusable behaviors. We still hate and fear them, but they're humanized and completely three dimensional. These are also good examples because they go so far beyond taunting and public shaming. These are troubled, violent villains. ETA: It doesn't have to be just home life stuff. Peer pressure is usually a major factor as well.
I'll soon explain him more in detail. And yeah I don't know why this guy told me why it's wrong to have something in common with Ivan. Why don't I do both? The handsome jock, the cheerleader and fat kid as bullies? There's all kinds of bullies right? They'll have backgrounds or at least some backstory for the bullies but does always need to be some justification for why they bully? So many bully characters always have a good reason for their actions or become good in the end. Can't mine be different? There's already bullies that get justified for their actions and later become good like Johnny Lawrence and Flash Thompson. I can't think of one bully that remains bad throughout any book or movie. There's this one called I think The Power of One but that's it.
Yes. All of your characters need reasons for the way they behave. The two I mentioned do. Spoiler: Let Me In Actually, the kid who does most of the bullying has reservations when his older brother, a total psychopath, wants to take things way too far, but there you go again. His older brother is completely irredeemable as a character. I'm all for redemption stories. Don't let me deter you from that. I still want to understand why they behaved that way and why they changed. Like I said, it can be as simple as peer pressure, but I want to see it, feel it. You might not need to justify actions from your most minor characters. We all know there are crappy people out there and people having bad days, but if you want us to care at all about a character, or even spend much time with them at all, we need more than that.
If you plan on killing the bully, I can definitely see your MC having enough and using his powers on the bully (assuming he can) and even turning evil and selfish, even for a brief moment before deciding that to use these powers for selfishness would lead to becoming a villain.
This is a good example from the movie. If anything, I might say that the bully's mother and father have raised him to be against freaks or anyone who seems out of the ordinary which was carried on over to the bully. Maybe after the bully and his friends attack or harassed the MC, who by mistakingly killed them with his powers that he wasn't aware of, causes the bully's father or the bully's cousin to want revenge on the MC? Well there's 2 ways I can go with it. 1) If he accidentally killed the bully out of rage with his powers for bullying him which then results in the father, cousin or maybe the entire bully's crazy family wanting revenge on the MC when he's older an adult and maybe they want a hold of his powers too and the bully could return as a zombie as an adult. 2) Or I could say the bully turned out to be a real bad villain when grown up, maybe because the MC caused the bully to be expelled or dishonored by his father for not beating the heck out of the MC to make a name for himself or lost his reputation as the badass of the school, then when grown up the bully has become a full villain, similar to like one of Spiderman's nemesis. Which one sounds better? Here's an example of Daniel Craigs character as the adult bully that was a bad bully as a kid who used to bully Steven dorffs character as a kid, then Daniel Craigs character grew up to be a cold and sinister bad guy, because Steven Dorffs character when they were kids had caused Daniel Craigs kid character to be expelled back at school and disliked by his father or something.
Definitely number one. The lesson comes back to haunt him... literally. Make him a sentient zombie where he says he could have been a good person, but you killed him too early.
Okay but how would it make sense if he'd be a zombie as an adult if he was killed when they were kids?
If the bully in the story is similar to what happens in "Let Me In" when they are all killed but say while the MC is being drowned or some similar incident the bully and his friends do to him and either a totem of supernatural powers trying to guide the MC kills them or while he's drowning in fear his powers activate without his knowledge and when he rises out of the pool or rises from whatever the evil prank the bullies were doing to him, he sees they're all dead, would the MC still be the villainous bad guy responsible for the bullies death and the sentient zombie bully be considered as the true hero? Or is it possible the MC could be seen as the villainous bad guy for what was done by accident but being misunderstood and the zombie bully being seen as the good guy hero where he and everyone says he would of been a good person had he lived and grown up, but is truly the bad seed?
I believe in Let Me In (American version at least) Eli kills Owen's or Oscar's (whatever this kid's name is) to protect him. At least for her own selfish reasons. Maybe after the bully's original death, the bully's family searches for a way to bring him back in their grief. So they discover a Pet Semetary and bring him back. But as Timmy says, sometimes dead is better. The bully then comes back as an omniscient zombie. Where he saw in the future that he would do many great things after his redemption, but since the MC killed him before that, those things will never happen. So using his grand omniscient knowledge, he hopes to kill the MC and hide his body somewhere nobody will find it. Trapping the MC in hell forever. And maybe do those great things, since coming back he has completed his "redemption" that would have taken him years had he not died.
I could do that which is one way I can have the story go. But what if there was also an incident where the bully didn't get killed and the MC who got bullied never harmed the bully back as a kid or done anything to get back at the bully and his friends and was left destroyed, but that bully then grows up through life gets to do many great things and puts the past behind him for the torture he put the MC through as a kid or just overall forgot all about him. But the MC still suffered the torment, especially by others years later because of his strange like abilities until the MC after all these years discovers what he is or has and this could draw the attention of the bully now grown up and very successful and rich to either be in shock of what the MC is and wanting some of that power as if now he regrets what he'd done and now wants what the MC has. Or the MC gives him a surprise visit, shocking the grown up bully even more and the MC in a selfish rage, wanting to send the bully straight to hell. Maybe I should make 2 separate MC's with 2 different stories as these are both very different paths. One is where the bully and family was destroyed and the bully makes a return, and the other one is where the MC was left destroyed and the bully went on through life happy.
I'm fine with characters' appearances fitting into a stereotype, it makes it easier to latch onto the character in the mind. I care more about the personality of the character. I assume your bully isn't just there as a matter of convenience and has some personality and backstory to explain why they are the way they are? It also can help set a location and setting as well, I have a very strong feeling on the early 2000s? Even if you don't know what movies these are from, you can get a good idea of what the character is like and what year it is. Look at this greaser douchebag from the 50s Mullet hick douchebag in the 1980s Here is what I'm imagining from your description. Asshole high school kid in the early 2000s Movies are It, the It reboot, and the 21 Jump Street reboot.
Well, as with any bully, physical appearance isn't so much as important as their state of mind and personality. I knew guys who looked like complete nerds, guys who I would tear apart in anything resembling a fistfight, but they were bullies. They were insecure about their glasses and wiry frame, so they learned to be witty, make fun of people and threaten people physically when needed. Most importantly, bullies almost never fight. You may, occasionally, know a crazy bastard who will just terrorize everyone around him and is more than willing to throw down with someone... but for the most part, bullies are all bark and no bite. They talk a lot, try to seem tough, try to intimidate others, but at the end of the day, they're more scared of you than you are of them, sadly. I view a bully as a little Chihuahua backed into a corner. They're usually shaped by rough home lives, physical, emotional and sometimes sexual abuse, neglect, drunken fathers, drunken mothers, big brothers who picked on them - because they're the kid who dad always chose to beat on, so big brother picks on little brother and little brother picks on you - or some other sort of childhood trauma. This is, of course, just my opinion. I think the bully is a very specific type of person, mentally, but the physical appearance can be almost anything. Depending on the context of who this bully is and who he is bullying, your description sounds just fine.
Yep! I was thinking more like the bully from the early 2000's like the Channing Tatum bully from 21 Jump Street. Even the late 90's might work but either way, these eras could make for an interesting setting for the MC victimized as a teen. As long as it's something relatable.
I agree with this. Bullies come in all different shapes and sizes. There's no specific look or appearance or even type of crowd they belong to. I don't even plan on just one bully. I plan on having a few, such as another one who's a skinny nerd and his nerdy friends that will pick on others due to their own insecurities. The MC in this plot is seen as a weakness, could be a part of his personality or that he seems different than others, so it leaves him vulnerable to be attacked or picked on, like an easy target. It just so happens that somone like a popular tall slim chiseled jock douchebag and some of his friends, the skinny nerd with glasses and his friends who can be really bad bullies and act tough in my story, even a fat kid, and some very hot and attractive girls, even less attractive or fat girls can be bullies in my story. Anyone or any body type can be a bully, it's a matter of them taking their own insecurities out on an easy victim so they themselves never have to get bullied or to take it out on those to feel empowered. I've witnessed this happen in real life and even in movies and shows. I get what you're saying. Bullies will target someone due to sometimes their own bad experiences so they will take it out on somone they feel is easier or weaker than them, or just feel jeslou5about someone else, many reasons apply. One thing is in my story, there will be multiple types of bullies, not just the one cliche bully. And they will have some backstory to them though some not too much since this is about the MC and other more important characters. But the MC may stand out or seem very different than the other crowds which makes many from other groups view him as an easy target. Some bullies can act rough physically if they are much taller and larger than the MC. Some could be big and tall but just be all talk, just like how even skinny smaller bullies can be but act tough in groups. They would mainly only try to act physically tough when it's to their advantage.
