Greetings. Not really sure which board this post fits. If this is not the right board to post on, I hope an admin can move it. I figured these forums might be a good place to start with some questions. I have a story I would like to one day get published. Not to make it big but just to get it out there and say I did it. I am not one with a "business" mind. I do not know if I need/want to go self/traditional publishing, nor have any money right now as it all goes to rent anyway. No, my question right now is on protecting the work. I have read where people can self-publish an e-book on Amazon and such to get their work noticed. I also seen places where people can share their work and ideas with other writers to collaborate. My question is about protecting my work if I did anything like that. Would I need a lawyer who specializes in protecting my content (from others who would claim it theirs) like characters, plot, etc? That is my main concern right now. When do lawyers, or someone else, come into play to protect my content from being claimed by someone else? From personal experiences, what are the best practices in doing this? Thanks for any suggestions.
The chances of another writer stealing your ideas are infinitesimally small...most of us have more idea than we can handle. the actual writing is copyright when you write it and you can register that copyright when the work is finished, but ideas can't be copyright... they could be trademarked but by and large for a normal authors its really not worth it. i'd suggest putting the paranoia to one side and just writing the thing
You can't copyright ideas. The actual writing is something you can copyright once you have something down, but, as Moose said, your writing is copyrighted once you get it down. You can choose to register it which I think a lot of people do prior to releasing a self published work. If you work with a publisher, they will handle the copyright stuff. But, again, copyright only protects the actual text. When it comes to writing execution is everything. Even the best ideas will fall flat (or worse not make much sense) if poorly executed. Your plot and such are not something you can copyright. That being said, this is something new writers seem to worry about more than they should. Ideas are a dime a dozen. And especially writers are usually never short on ideas. Sure, we've all heard plagiarism cases, but I think most people write because they want to do the writing and have stories they want to tell. They are not out there looking for work to steal.
Yes, that is what meant. Protecting the published work from being claimed to be someone else's. So, that is when copyrights come to play. So depending which way I go, copywriting is handled differently. Whether I do it before publishing myself or having a publisher do it for me. Okay, now I know the proper term to consider for the future. Thank you.
Take a look at any book in a bookshop. The professional publisher will generally handle the copyright aspects.
If self-publishing, see a good lawyer. Recently read a book titled Author Hawke by Herman Wouk and goes into depth on his own experience. If going to a publishing house, still see AND have your own lawyer.
There are definitely pirate sites out there, but generally speaking they're not trying to get people to think that books are written by a different author. They just make it seem like they have the right to sell or download your book even if you've never given them permission. And obviously you'll never see a dime in royalties from a pirate/bootleg site. That said, I've had 3 books and a short story published, first through a traditional publisher and then self-published on KDP after the original publishing house went out of business. I've never had any issues with piracy - I'm guessing they go after books that are way higher in Amazon rankings than mine. I've never registered anything or engaged a lawyer for my books. I don't make enough on them to justify the cost of all that.
Even for a high profile self published author there’s no need to consult a layer unless you have a specific issue to consult them about another point about copyright infringement is that they are often based in places not worth pursuing. I’ve never had an issue as a writer, as a photographer it happens all the time and I generally just sent a generic cease and desist unless they were Uk based
Frequently new writers get the idea that people are going to want to steal their work or their ideas. This is largely based on a misunderstanding of some basic things. The vast majority of ideas are not new or fresh or original, most stories are based on ideas that we've seen countless times in many different forms. What makes each one seem fresh or new is the way it's handled. The more you look into writing the more you'll run across the idea that there's only a very limited number of basic plots. The number keeps changing—if you do a search you'll find articles saying it's seven, a dozen, 36, and on and on—it just depends on how far you want to kernel things down. At the most basic there are apparently only three kinds of plot—Man against Man, Man against Nature, or Man against Himself. But that's stripped all the way down to the bare plywood.Then you'll run into the lists including plot ideas like Rags to Riches, Riches to Rags, young person goes through series of trials and becomes a warrior, Intrigue in the Court etc. Yes, if you boil things down to this basic of a level there are only a very limited number of plots possible. And countless millions of stories written using each one of them, with more being published each day. The number of possible plots doesn't grow, we just keep finding new twists on them or new ways to dress them up. It's the twists and the dressing that make the good stories good. Also people have this notion that an idea is theirs. This is not really true. Ideas aren't really what we think they are. They don't come into existence solely inside someone's head. Mostly they exist in the larger public space of communal ideas we all draw from. If you look into new ideas throughout history you'll generally find several people had the same idea at the same time. When Darwin was working out his concept of natural selection, so were several other people around the world. New ideas seem to come in from the outside, and occur to many people in a cultural milieu. Mostly what we're doing when we get a great idea is putting together ideas that have been floating around in the greater society for a while, just waiting for somebody to put them together in that particular way. And usually many people put together the same ideas in nearly the same way. The one that gets the credit for being 'first' is generally the one who is prepared at the time, for instance already a decent writer, and who is ready to devote the time and effort necessary to bring it through to fruition. Any time you have a great idea, rest assured, many other people have had it too, and some of them are good writers, and some of them are already working on their manuscripts.
Yes, there are proper names that I would eventually want to protect, just so no one else claims it to be theirs. This has just been on my mind for several decades. Thanks for the info, all.
You can't do that, character names aren't copyrightable...at least i don't think so. You could potentially trademark them but that's rife with complications vis cocky gate ... for that sort of thing you'd really need to talk to a legal specialist
My mistake. I should have typed trademark. Am trying to get my ADHD head to understand all the different terms and methods.
hardly any authors bother with trademarks because its so hard to do and there's so little reason - the exception is where the character is wildly successful. e.g Hanibal Lecter is a trade mark, as is Harry Potter, and Jack Reacher, for an unknown author who hasn't yet sold any books it, makes no sense. No one is going to steal your characters name, nor would it matter if they did. Faileena tried to trademark Cocky in ref of her books about the cocker brothers - it didn't end well for her
According to this article it would be $250 - $350 per name in the U.S., and that's if you're doing it yourself without attorney fees added to the mix: https://www.forbes.com/advisor/business/trademark-cost/ I don't even make that much in a year from my books, so I can't imagine spending that kind of money. I mean, maybe if you created Harry Potter or some other one-in-a-million IP that others would try to profit off of, but it would have to be something wildly popular for anyone to want to use it for their own purposes. Names, settings, systems, plots etc. are a dime a dozen in a world full of writers. Someone did try to plagiarize Nora Roberts a few years ago, but she's sold 500M books so you can see why someone might want to try to profit off that level of success. This comes up quite a bit and it's honestly trying to solve a problem that doesn't really exist. No one is wandering around the internet trying to steal ideas from fledgling authors. It's just not a thing. ETA: @big soft moose said it much more succinctly than I while I was writing this post lol.
As a new writer you will hear a million times that there is no need to worry about people 'stealing your work' to me that's kind of like telling a new driver most people never get into a car accident so don't worry about it... and then they drive around without wearing their seatbelt. In my opinion the best thing to do, is write a first rough draft, get that registered, and bam you have "some protection." Now if in 50 years someone from a writing group turns your story into a film or something without your consent you have something you can go to court with. FTR 'registered' is a general term, it just means getting an official third party time stamp. If you post your story to this site, if the date and time that you posted is shown (and accessible when you make your claim) that 'counts' as registered. Not the best/most secure option but I just want to be clear there are ways to 'protect' work for free. The above suggestion is not fool proof, everyones claim of "you can't copyright an idea" is still true. Someone can read your work and still write something similar but different enough that even the best copyright lawyer in the world can't fix it. BUT having some kind of protection is better than having none at all. If you have some version of your work 'protected' I would not bother with a lawyer, UNLESS one of two things happen, your work becomes a mega hit. Or someone actually tries to claim your work. Funny, this topic touches on my two areas of above amateur below professional areas of expertises, writing and law. Still just my 2 cents
Posting your work on this site won't protect your copyright by registering anything - time stamps are very easily faked. likewise with the poor mans copyright urban myth about posting yourself a copy If you are in the US to register your copyright you should register with the US copyright office. https://www.copyright.gov/registration/ In the UK there's not a comparable service, that sites that claim to be a re little more than a con. However there's no point at all in registering a rough draft - you should register the final version
Dude anything can be faked. Some forms are better than others, but something is better than nothing. I agree and disagree in part with a lot of what big soft moose says, but this last line I strongly disagree with. I mean you SHOULD register your final version, but there IS a point in 'registering' a rough draft, especially the for the new writer who is scared of sharing their work for fear of it being stolen. Getting some kind of 'protection' alleviate (at least somewhat) the fear of someone stealing your work. If you have some kind of protection you can take your work and show it around, get feedback, show it to writing groups, and improve the work without fear (or less fear). The Expert advice is "Don't worry, no one will steal your idea because all ideas are equally worthless, every idea out there has been told a million times, your idea is not special" I hate that kind of advice because it leads to a "why write at all" it's all worthless. This whole website is dedicated to a bunch of people who just spent a large part of their lives wasting times and no one here has ever or will ever write anything that hasn't already been done a thousand times already... come on boys time to shut down this site! No I don't believe that. I don't care how many ideas like mine exist, only I can make my story. Only you can make yours. It's like children, there are billions of children in the world, but only MY CHILD is MY CHILD, and I don't care how unlikely it is something bad will happen, if there is something I can do to protect my child (especially if it is easy) why not do it. For a new writer especially, to easy their fear, I would still suggest getting protection for their work by the rough draft stage, I would lean towards a free 'time stamp' method, only because it's free. But spend a few bucks and go the super official way with it, but do what makes you feel comfortable. Then after getting the work finalized get the work officially protected again. As a NEW writer I think that is fine, if it makes you feel safe. Don't let someone tell you "not to worry" if you're worried. Then after that experience, after going through the process and showing your work around if you feel "you know what I didn't need all that protection" on book two you might skip getting some kind of early protection. Again my 2 cents, but i stand by it.
Theres some absolutely terrible advice here which sums up why we don't usually allow legal advice on this site Absolutely not - posting your work on this site (or on the internet generally) does not protect your copyright... if you want to register your copyright, register it with the copyright office... In the US you can only pursue certain sorts of damages if your copyright is properly registered. Plus websites come and go, if you want to pursue an IP violation at some point in the future - you don't want to find that said site has been shut down and your 'timestamp' lost. In addition posting your work on the internet can cause you to lose first rights making your book impossible to publish (possibly not in our workshop since it may not count as published - its a grey area) Except that a copyright registration on the rough draft only covers the words written in the rough draft, if you substantially change it you'll need to reregister it and bearing in mind the point above about proper registration this is shortly going to get expensive... better to register it once when you've finished writing (bearing in mind that all words are copyright as soon as you write them ...registration /= 'being protected' anyway) The elephant in the room here is that you can't copyright an idea, and the expert advice is actually 'writers aren't going to steal your idea not because its worthless but because they have more than they can cope with anyway'. If anyone does 'steal' your idea there's nothing you can do about it unless they falsely represent your words as theirs As covered above the 'free time stamp method' is a nonsense and doesn't provide you with appreciably more protection than you already had under the Berne Convention, and has some major down sides And on that note
